Announcing The Platinum Club Plus [Beta] Program
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For the most part, what I would say has been said. I'll just echo what someone said somewhere because I only saw it once and I think it's the key to the whole thing: Even if a product is "worth" $5 rather than $1.99, Daz will be worse off for 3 x $5 than they would for 10 x $1.99. I don't see how this can end well. $2.99/$3.99 might work, and I would be fine with that, but I just don't think this does.
I'm reminded of when TV shows on DVD came out. One of the first shows was The X Files, and a season cost $200. They sold at that price, so they signed up to an initial distribution of the whole show at that price point. But roll on a couple of years, Buffy found that selling at $50 got about 20x the sales. So all the other shows sold at $50 while XF languished for years at $200, making a hell of a lot less money. They didn't lose sales after other shows came out from the poor comparison - die-hards were willing to pay it. But they missed the casual fans, and there are a lot more casuals than die-hards. Finally all nine seasons came out at $200 and they went on to new contract at $50 like everyone else, but they missed a lot of custom along the way.
I'm fortunate to be at a time in my life where money is not overly scarce, and I've spent the better part of five thousand dollars at DAZ in the last six months. My PC club saves me a bomb, and PC+ would have saved me a hell of a lot less. I love my $1.99 and $2.99 goodies, although I buy a lot of higher priced things too. For me the value proposition of PC is definitely the $1.99/$2.99. It's why I come to Daz every day, and the big competitors once a month. Do I buy lots of other full-priced stuff while I'm here? Sure. Do I do that at the competitors? No. Would I drop five grand on 750 instead of 2000 items? Hell no.
But what about the PA discounts? Sorry, it's not enough. There are less than half a dozen PAs whose whole stores are persuasive enough to me to compensate. For every awesome thing in the store, there are a dozen examples of Yet Another Skanky Warrior Set. So that PA with a store of sixty items? You're offering me maybe five things that actually have a point of difference that I would pay for.
I'm sure this will work for some, but it doesn't work for me. And I'll be surprised if it works for many.
However, if they wait past the end of June they will miss out on the June PC+ coupons (but of course then they will get the regular July PC coupon).
Hmmm Pro's and Cons for sure, Being a very small time user, a hobby i probably don't have time for I normally end up with the freebies..and then hunting for some Daz product to use my voucher on by the end of the month. Having the whole PC and value categories open up at least lets me use my coupon on something I like rather than just hunting through the storefront for a NON pc DO item of around 6 bucks. It will be alot simpler for me to get value there.
A caveat I do think would be interesting is how this effects sales where PC items are bundled together at a discount.. its easy to gauge if this pack of 6 items is a good deal or not when you know you could get em each for 2 dollars. IF the prices vary some of those deals might be more appealing even if you don't want a couple of the textures..
In the end. Though I'll probably end up paying more, I think this is a good idea to try, it gives Daz flexibility in pricing rather than being hamstrung by a large portion of the catalog at a locked in price. With the Various sales and so on deals can certainly still happen(At a few points in the last year many sections of the PC had 1buck sale days if memory serves)
HSO
After converting to the PC+ beta and playing around with various pricing combinations to see if it's really viable, I have to say that it's really NOT a good deal for the customers. I am a hobbyist and like the vast majority of people in today's economy, I have a budget that I should stay within. This proposed set of changes will definitely impact how often I purchase anything at all.
The $1.99 &$2.99 price points were not only a great incentive for impulse buying but they made it possible to build up a content library relatively easily. This made it fun to begin to learn this hobby by keeping my interest level higher. It also kept me spending money. From the point of view of DAZ3D that's probably a very good thing. Also , the $1.99 & $2.99 price points made it possible for me to buy that "really cool thing" from any of the various PA's whenever it was released. I also would point out that because of being able to get many things for such really low prices, the last 3 out of 4 main figure releases I purchased were the "Pro Bundle" options.
Going forward, under this proposed new Platinum Club scheme, lots of things are going to have to change in my shopping habits for 3D content. I just looked at my purchase history for the last 30 days and did a bit of analysis using that data on what my spending under the new plan will look like. Let me tell you, it's going to change and not for the better .
Before: I would use the $6.00 coupon to ease the cost of purchasing something "big"like one of the various "Pro Bundles" or something similarly priced. Otherwise it would simply sit there till the end of the month when it became a "use it or lose it" kind of thing. Meanwhile, I was happily spending money throughout the month on both PC and PA items if something caught my eye. Yes, a larger portion of those sales were PC items but I joined the Platinum Club in the first place to be able to do just that. I got lots of cool stuff and DAZ3D had a happy customer who was spending money with them roughly 3-4 times a week. Also, very importantly, DAZ3D got ALL of my discretionary funds that were set aside for my 3D hobby.
Going forward under the new system, it's simply not going to be able to be that way. First off, I'm going to have to start playing the "coupon and discount stacking game" far more aggressively than I was before just to get half of the amount of product . This makes me an unhappy customer because frankly it's just too annoyingly difficult and time consuming to figure all that stuff out.
Secondly, I just won't be purchasing as much. The items I would normally get at the old price point just because the seemed "cute,neat, interesting, or cool" won't be going directly into my shopping cart anymore but rather into my wish list to be "held" there against future sales if any. Going into the wish list does not automatically mean transitioning into the shopping cart by any means.
Thirdly, I probably won't be making flat out purchases of bundled items anywhere near as often if at all but will rather be "cherry picking" and "discount stacking" to get only base figures and maybe on or two other options. This means, in the case of bundled products, some of the PA's who worked very hard on making wonderful things won't get that percentage from my purchase now.
Finally , I am now researching the various "club options" that other content providers offer. Before, I was content to spend all of my 3D budget with DAZ3D. The low price points and wide variety afforded by my PC membership made it unnecessary and even uninteresting to check out the competition. Now, if the proposed Platinum Club+ plan goes into effect, that will no longer be the case. The decision and action would be driven out of common sense and necessity.
Based on other comments in this thread, I am pretty sure I am not the only person that would be so affected. There will probably be a LOT of people being similarly affected and making similar decisions. I am pretty sure that will affect profitability for DAZ3D and the PA's in a negative fashion. Maybe the accounting and marketing people might want to head back to the drawing board with their "Platinum Club Profitability Plan" and present us with something that will be of benefit to everyone?
Jack ... please, don't take this so personal.
It's not.
We are not talking about your creations (which are beautiful) - we are talking about the Platinum Club.
The PC has nothing to do with whether any PA's products are worth more than $1.99. The whole point of it is that, as members, we get discounted products for a fee. The whole, "don't you think my products are worth more?" complaint is a complete red herring and kind of emotional blackmail. If any PA is dissatisfied with the PC arrangement then don't participate or don't offer products that they want more money for. What are we paying $70 a year for if we don't get discounted products? The coupon is nothing special when at least once a month everyone gets $6 off anyway. DAZ is not doing us a favour - we pay for these discounts!
I advise the PC and PC+ membership can exist at the same time.
If they can not exist at the same time, I prefer the $1,99 items though I had already used the new two coupons.
Hehe. Some PC items become expensive now.
Jack ... please, don't take this so personal.
It's not.
We are not talking about your creations (which are beautiful) - we are talking about the Platinum Club.
The PC has nothing to do with whether any PA's products are worth more than $1.99. The whole point of it is that, as members, we get discounted products for a fee. The whole, "don't you think my products are worth more?" complaint is a complete red herring and kind of emotional blackmail. If any PA is dissatisfied with the PC arrangement then don't participate or don't offer products that they want more money for. What are we paying $70 a year for if we don't get discounted products? The coupon is nothing special when at least once a month everyone gets $6 off anyway. DAZ is not doing us a favour - we pay for these discounts!
Just want to clarify one point - PA's don't contribute in the same way to the PC.. their items are not brokered, they are purchased outright by the PC. This is part of the equation, as sourcing these items has increased in cost, along with additional elements such as commissioning artwork and covering QA costs.
The 'don't participate or don't offer products' is a valid option, however we've always endeavoured to get the best content for our members, which is why I 99% of the time also offer my own content up to the PC. But yea, maybe one thing that comes out of all is that I cease to do that.. however I can't help but think that it also a negative for the members.
The older items would probably get a tweak in pricing if anything was rolled out longer term.
As for my stuff.. I'm sorry to hear that you don't feel they warrant the $5.09 price tag. Before you nuke your WL though, bear in mind this is just a beta.
Seriously Mr. Tomalin? It's NOT personal. None of this is about you or your products. This discussion is about proposed changes to the Platinum Club pricing and it's effect on the customers of DAZ3D. The comment you made here regarding someone not feeling as if your items warrant a certain price point is inapropriate, unprofessional and not what the discussion is about. Let's please keep this discussion calm, focused, and on topic so that it's a vehicle to drive positive change for all sides.
The older items would probably get a tweak in pricing if anything was rolled out longer term.
As for my stuff.. I'm sorry to hear that you don't feel they warrant the $5.09 price tag. Before you nuke your WL though, bear in mind this is just a beta.
it sounds like you want to move to be like a regular pa's store ;)
if you moved all your pc club 1.99 stuff to a regular pa store, ... the mind boggles. lol
who would sanely make a weekly 1.99 original geometry set? and what do you have to smoke to keep the ideas flowing?
i hope daz gives you a percent of the pc membership fee!
Seriously Mr. Tomalin? It's NOT personal. None of this is about you or your products. This discussion is about proposed changes to the Platinum Club pricing and it's effect on the customers of DAZ3D. The comment you made here regarding someone not feeling as if your items warrant a certain price point is inapropriate, unprofessional and not what the discussion is about. Let's please keep this discussion calm, focused, and on topic so that it's a vehicle to drive positive change for all sides.
This thread has gone 20+ pages and I've never made it personal.
I merely responded to one comment which *did* address my own content specifically. That said, I would extend that comment to encompass all of the new PC items. I, as well as the rest of the team believe that the content we put out each week is worthy of the $3+ price tags.
Like I said, we're aware of this - and will be analysing the data with these things in mind.
The trouble with analyzing the data, is that some, like me, may not object TOO strongly to the changes as stated, but may not opt in because of the price increase until they need to. I am considering opting in next week because I know that if there are any PC items that I really want, come August, I should be able to buy them at either 1.99 or 2.99 (if I remember), and I am tempted by one or two of the PA items, more if I don't purchase A6P.
it sounds like you want to move to be like a regular pa's store ;)
if you moved all your pc club 1.99 stuff to a regular pa store, ... the mind boggles. lol
who would sanely make a weekly 1.99 original geometry set? and what do you have to smoke to keep the ideas flowing?
i hope daz gives you a percent of the pc membership fee!
Genuinely I don't want to move.. but if the price tag is non-negotiable at 1.99, as it appears to be the general consensus (in this thread at least) it does limit what options I have and the content I can product for the PC.
Seriously Mr. Tomalin? It's NOT personal. None of this is about you or your products. This discussion is about proposed changes to the Platinum Club pricing and it's effect on the customers of DAZ3D. The comment you made here regarding someone not feeling as if your items warrant a certain price point is inapropriate, unprofessional and not what the discussion is about. Let's please keep this discussion calm, focused, and on topic so that it's a vehicle to drive positive change for all sides.
I think Jack's response was probably meant as a light-hearted ribbing ( "Oh, so you don't like my stuff? :-P" )
Seriously Mr. Tomalin? It's NOT personal. None of this is about you or your products. This discussion is about proposed changes to the Platinum Club pricing and it's effect on the customers of DAZ3D. The comment you made here regarding someone not feeling as if your items warrant a certain price point is inapropriate, unprofessional and not what the discussion is about. Let's please keep this discussion calm, focused, and on topic so that it's a vehicle to drive positive change for all sides.
This thread has gone 20+ pages and I've never made it personal.
I merely responded to one comment which *did* address my own content specifically. That said, I would extend that comment to encompass all of the new PC items. I, as well as the rest of the team believe that the content we put out each week is worthy of the $3+ price tags.
Poor Jack ((hug)) I, for one, do appreciate, all that you do for us poor, noisy, agumentative, demanding members and I love your items.
I do believe that the PC items are worth the price increase, I just don't have to like needing to spend more. The downside of the price increase is the decrease in amount purchased because my money isn't increasing to match. :( BUT I will buy PC items at the newer price, maybe just not all.
Seriously Mr. Tomalin? It's NOT personal. None of this is about you or your products. This discussion is about proposed changes to the Platinum Club pricing and it's effect on the customers of DAZ3D. The comment you made here regarding someone not feeling as if your items warrant a certain price point is inapropriate, unprofessional and not what the discussion is about. Let's please keep this discussion calm, focused, and on topic so that it's a vehicle to drive positive change for all sides.
This thread has gone 20+ pages and I've never made it personal.
I merely responded to one comment which *did* address my own content specifically. That said, I would extend that comment to encompass all of the new PC items. I, as well as the rest of the team believe that the content we put out each week is worthy of the $3+ price tags.
Ok, lets look at this another way perhaps? Yes. I happily state that there is wonderful content from the Platinum Club team. Goodness knows I have purchased enough of it. That said, let's take it to a matter of simple economics. In a given period an item priced at $1.99 may sell 30 copies for a total amount of roughly $59-$60. That same item in the same time period priced at $3.00 may only sell about 15 copies for a grand total of about $45.00 or so. Now, if the content creator gets a percentage of total sales, which number would you rather get a percentage of?
This thread has gone 20+ pages and I've never made it personal.
I merely responded to one comment which *did* address my own content specifically. That said, I would extend that comment to encompass all of the new PC items. I, as well as the rest of the team believe that the content we put out each week is worthy of the $3+ price tags.
Poor Jack ((hug)) I, for one, do appreciate, all that you do for us poor, noisy, agumentative, demanding members and I love your items.
I do believe that the PC items are worth the price increase, I just don't have to like needing to spend more. The downside of the price increase is the decrease in amount purchased because my money isn't increasing to match. :( BUT I will buy PC items at the newer price, maybe just not all.
Thanks - but it's all part of the job.. so no worries there.
The second part is exactly why we're running the beta.. we totally understand that no one likes price increases.
it sounds like you want to move to be like a regular pa's store ;)
if you moved all your pc club 1.99 stuff to a regular pa store, ... the mind boggles. lol
who would sanely make a weekly 1.99 original geometry set? and what do you have to smoke to keep the ideas flowing?
i hope daz gives you a percent of the pc membership fee!
Genuinely I don't want to move.. but if the price tag is non-negotiable at 1.99, as it appears to be the general consensus (in this thread at least) it does limit what options I have and the content I can product for the PC.
at least no one can complain your stuff isn't poser friendly.
always 2 there are, a ps d/l and ds d/l.
and people not using ds or ps can use the obj files from the ps d/l for their software of choice.
I think Jack's response was probably meant as a light-hearted ribbing ( "Oh, so you don't like my stuff? :-P" )
I think the approach here is, "come on people, be reasonable", so we feel guilty and agree with the prices hikes. If those in agreement reach a critical mass then the rest of us will sound like ungrateful whiners even though we're all now getting a worse deal. Ultimately, it's a numbers game because the decision will be based on what makes the most profit not on any members consultation.
Genuinely I don't want to move.. but if the price tag is non-negotiable at 1.99, as it appears to be the general consensus (in this thread at least) it does limit what options I have and the content I can product for the PC.
at least no one can complain your stuff isn't poser friendly.
always 2 there are, a ps d/l and ds d/l.
and people not using ds or ps can use the obj files from the ps d/l for their software of choice.
There's 3 in fact, as I also include a legacy set for DS3 users too :)
Its not the price increases I have a problem with personally I think it should have been done a while ago, what I dislike is all the ridiculous shanagans that go with it, buy this with this in this time period and it will be cheaper than buying it another way.
I don't like the fact that prices are going to almost treble, especially on some things, what if Daz decide to only buy in big sets for several weeks things will be beyond my budget, and that's another problem the inability to be able to budget because you won't have a clue how much the weeks releases will cost.
I also don't like all the possibles and probablies being banded about either it will work one way or it will not, it seems to me that this has been thrown together with little thought as to how it will actually work along side the rest of the constant sales that go on.
I'll admit, I'm not really a fan of the PC items getting intro discounts. Or more accurately, increasing in price after 2 weeks.
I do remember, back when the $2.99 kerfluffle happened, that part of the motive for that was to get more people to buy the PC items in those first two weeks. And maybe this will do that.
And maybe, if we must go to percentage based (rather than just raising the base cost of all PC items to 2.99 -or even 3.99- each), the intro sale period will help that.
Or maybe cutting the dance and just going to a 75% discount, with no intro discount, might be simpler. At least for the customers.
Just something else to toss in the "What are the options" file.
Ok... I've had some sleep and my brain is fresher... This is my last 2cents on this thread (then I'm UN-watching this thread... I've still got my headache)
I've ditched my WISH LIST... Most of it was triple the price from regular PC prices...
Fact is... I...
1) only buy PA items on FLASH SALES...
2) only buy the PC 1.99 item/s each week (which I won't do now until after I'm converted back... IF... I stay in the PC Club)
3) only buy things that have a 50% off or higher sale (30% isn't enough to MAKE me buy something that I really don't need)
4) only buy on impulse when I see a good sale. The last few months have me spoiled... why would I buy regular price anything???
I have been spending $300 to $500 dollars a month worth of merchandise in the last year I've been a member... That's a lot of money... I'm so confused at the pricing now I may not buy anything for a while. I'll use the 2 new coupons.. but after that.. I'm done spending for the month.
I know there are OTHER 3D clubs... and one in particular has PC items for $3.50... but.. I've still not joined it because the $1.99 items at DAZ allowed me to buy 2 times as much STUFF. I don't mind DAZ raising prices.. I totally understand that PAs want/deserve more money... I just wish we are given say.. a months notice and then let us know... COME AUGUST say... 1.99 ITEMs WILL GO UP TO 2.99 PERMINENTLY.. etc.. then just raise the prices... and quit playing with my brain.
Have a great day everyone.. I'll be about... Hugzzzzzzzzzz to you all!!!!!!!!
Llola
How about this Jack.... just some feedback on the $1.99 issue folks are having.... really OLD stuff, $1.99, items that just hit the store for their first 10 days, $1.99 and then after that this new pricing of 70% kicks in.
For the really old stuff it would perhaps start back as far as M1/V1 up to earlier Gen 4. Gen 4 stuff that's only a few years old to newer stuff (there is still SOME support) for Gen 4 here (I think).
I know folks that are still wanting support and cheap stuff for Genesis 1 will have an issue with this suggestion but at least when newer stuff is released, even with the new club pricing they will have an opportunity to grab is within that 10 day period and if they don't ... well that's not DAZ's fault.
But this also brings to mind why the hell hasn't DAZ figured out how to create some end date sale text to put up on the product pages. I mean really, this code has to allow for that to be implemented somewhere! :-/
I'll reiterate - this is a beta, at the end of July it reverts back the old PC. So really you needn't have ditched your WL - it would have been back to normal at that time.
In the past when things have been just rolled out - as you suggest, there was equally as much commotion. We figured with having this a purely opt-in beta promotion it would offer flexibility for people to do whatever they feel is best for them.
Increasing the price to $2.99 didn't work it seems, possibly because it didn't encourage significantly more members to buy the products when they were $1.99 nor did it encourage them to buy them at $2.99, so I suspect tinkering again with PC will just cause the same phenomenon - when the prices go up we stop (impulse) buying unless it's a must have.
Alternative strategies for making more money might be to increase prices across the board, open up the market and make these products compatible with other software or improve DS with various new features that attract users and allow PA's to develop a more diverse range of products. Squeezing your own members is not the wisest strategy imo.
I meant increasing all PC items to $2.99 (or 3.99). Sorry if that wasn't clear.
The back-cat stuff certainly would be priced differently in the context of a longer term change, yes.
The 10 day idea, is pretty much the same as the VC concept.. we're then met with people who will refuse to purchase after that intro period because it was originally 1.99 and then suddenly it's increased in price. A few posts in here also highlight that fact.
There's lots of ideas being posted, and we're not dismissing them - they are all going on the list, however that's just my initial gut-feeling :)
Why hold this beta in July? Traditionally, for many countries, July and August are vacation months. At least in the Northern Hemisphere. I know it's winter in the Southern but I have little knowledge of people's general activity in the Southern Hemisphere so I am no trying to insult you.
My point is, many customers are away from their computers during this time so July may not be the best month to get a accurate snapshot of sales.
I know there are certain months DAZ can't do it without major problems. Late Februrary through early April is out because of MM. Late August through early November is out because of the back-to-back PA sale and PC anniversary sales.
The question of the older products and pricing was brought up. Any idea where the cut off would be? Gen1/2 clothing, textures and poses? Here's the problem I see: DAZ leaves products for Gen 3 and lower at the standard PC price. Problem: The MFD has been refit for the rest of the Gen 3 figures, V4, Genesis and G2. If a user already has the Gen 3 iconic shapes, they can buy the V3 version at the lower price and use autofit. I'm not trying to make trouble, I'm just pointing out something that occurred to me.
Ok, just thought I'd put out my thoughts. Some of these posts are just too wordy and it's not that big of a deal to me but just trying to suss out what folks would feel to be a bit more fair without out cutting into all the initial ideas DAZ came up with for this "PLUS" club idea... I think if there were that sale ends notice on the pages it would give folks more of an INCENTIVE to purchase before the end dates. So I don't know why this issue keeps getting swept under the carpet. It's hurting sales for DAZ in the long run and it's pissing off your clientele, including me!
Oh, I should do what is best for me?Hmm, I don't purchase THAT many PA items during a regular month, there are a number of books coming out from my favorite authors, It is summertime, and the nights can be enjoyed semi-comfortably. Hmmm, best for me may be leaving my computer off until I catch up on all of the new books after rereading the series leading up to them. But nah, that doesn't feed my DAZ addiction.:lol: