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Strictly Business Outfit for G8F - Strange morph files included?

maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 3,037
in The Commons

I'm kinda interested in the Strictly Business Outfit for G8F but as it's once more a Daz Original from an otherwise unknown PA (here: Three Digital, as the directory in the file list indicates) I'm hesitent to just buy it...

So when I had a look at the file list to see what kind of morphs etc are coming with it, I found the entry below (and tons of others like it)

"/data/ThreeDigital/Strictly Business/Interior Shirt/Morphs/ThreeDigital/Base/eJCM_Edward8_Fear_HD_div1.dsf"

which seem a bit weird for me. Why would a shirt need morphs for an expression???

And there's more...

  • /data/ThreeDigital/Strictly Business/Hair/sanjay_hair_v02_40988.dsf

  • /data/ThreeDigital/Strictly Business/Hair/sanjay_scalp_v03_489.dsf

  • /data/ThreeDigital/Strictly Business/Hair/UV Sets/ThreeDigital/Base/default.dsf

are also showing in the file list?!?

Any ideas why?

And has anyone already bought the outfit and can give some impression about it's quality?

Comments

  • GordigGordig Posts: 10,612

    Somewhat off topic, “Strictly Business” is awfully casual. 

  • JOdelJOdel Posts: 6,322

    We seem to have a run on no-name PAs all of a sudden. I'm wondering whether these are group efforts from vendors who don't usually work together, or of known artists called in to help out a newbie.

  • Phoenix1966Phoenix1966 Posts: 1,857
    edited May 2020

    I didn't buy the hair, just the suit. The hair textures were included in the product zip. The shirt has painted on shadows. The jacket loads with a dickey (it's labeled "interior shirt"), so you won't see shirt cuffs peeking out past the jacket sleeves. That also means the jacket is rather snug around the arms. Renders to follow.

    Post edited by Phoenix1966 on
  • Phoenix1966Phoenix1966 Posts: 1,857

    This is on a default Michael 8 body. I like the collar on the shirt very much. I figured, since I wasn't thrilled with the painted shadow, I could just retexture it. The shirt is all one material zone, but the buttons are separate objects. The plaid shirt is a shader, but with the shirt's default normal map applied. There is a problem with the mesh of the collar and a top button that's on the inside of the shirt (but that can be hidden or deleted).

    strictly business.png
    927 x 1500 - 839K
    strictly business shirt.png
    1165 x 793 - 416K
    strictly business shirt plaid.png
    1165 x 793 - 500K
    rip.jpg
    1000 x 675 - 173K
    top button.jpg
    1000 x 664 - 192K
  • maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 3,037
    Phoenix1966 said:

    This is on a default Michael 8 body. I like the collar on the shirt very much. I figured, since I wasn't thrilled with the painted shadow, I could just retexture it. The shirt is all one material zone, but the buttons are separate objects. The plaid shirt is a shader, but with the shirt's default normal map applied. There is a problem with the mesh of the collar and a top button that's on the inside of the shirt (but that can be hidden or deleted).

    Exactly the information I needed... thanks a lot, Phoenix1966 :)

    Oh.. any chance we get Castiel and Crowley to go with the Winchesters You made? *nudgenudgewinkwink*

  • Phoenix1966Phoenix1966 Posts: 1,857

    I was always a fan of season 4-5 Lucifer, so you never know who might still be a possibility. devil

  • maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 3,037
    Phoenix1966 said:

    I was always a fan of season 4-5 Lucifer, so you never know who might still be a possibility. devil

    Wait.. do you mean Lucifer from Supernatural? Or Lucifer from Lucifer? ^^ Lucifer Morningstar sure has some merits, but compared to Lucifer in the Nick vessel he's just a Gigolo gone not even that bad... wink

  • Phoenix1966Phoenix1966 Posts: 1,857

    I didn't think Lucifer (the series) even made it to a fifth season, but I never followed that one. I'm all about Mark Pellegrino's Lucifer (and Jared's version, too). But I liked him best under Kripke's reign.

  • maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 3,037
    Phoenix1966 said:

    I didn't think Lucifer (the series) even made it to a fifth season, but I never followed that one. I'm all about Mark Pellegrino's Lucifer (and Jared's version, too). But I liked him best under Kripke's reign.

    yesyesyesyesyes

  • maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 3,037

    Ooookay...

    I'm really glad that I paid only $ 2.80 for this outfit. The textures (the basic ones, didn't buy the texture expansion) look ok with Iray. Changing them is a bit tricky but works. Now to the bad part:

    • There's absolutely NO movement morphs coming with this outfit. Okay, there aren't any mentioned in the description, so it's not really "cheating" but still it's a pita...
    • The outfit doesn't really work well with others than the figures mentioned in the description. With Aldo and Buster for G8M there were a couple poke throughs and "floating buttons" due to the different shape of the bellies of these figures..
    • You can't use dForce to overcome the lack of movement morphs.. except if you would remove the buttons and build your own as rigid following nodes.. can be done, but is a tedious job
    • the outfit with the jacket comes with a shirt that only covers the front part of the figure. With some figures this shows when they bend forward, as bare skin is visible on the backside where the jacket meets the pants..

    So, for $ 2.80 it's okay-ish, but if I had had to pay more for it, it would go back...

    Afaik DAZ has some game resources department now, which developes stuff for 3D games. This outfit looks exactly like something made for a game, in which the main figure runs around in clothes that have no need to be morphed for movements and suchlike...

    No wonder DAZ offered such a big % reduction for the items in this sale... ^^ some are a little better than some freebies available...

  • vwranglervwrangler Posts: 4,973
    edited May 2020
    Phoenix1966 said:

     The plaid shirt is a shader, but with the shirt's default normal map applied. There is a problem with the mesh of the collar and a top button that's on the inside of the shirt (but that can be hidden or deleted).

    I think the top button is actually deliberate (although it doesn't make a lick of sense as the shirt is constructed). That's a button that you would button if you intended to wear a tie with the shirt. However, there's no morph or any way to close the shirt up there, so the button has no function.

    I picked up the outfit, since I was getting enough other stuff that I could always return the outfit without screwing up the discounts if I wanted. I will say that I've never seen a shirt as bizarrely constructed as that; "Shirt" and "interior shirt", indeed. (I do not understand the purpose behind the "Shirt" dickey, since it will make collision incredibly difficult and fiddly to load the jacket without the "interior shirt " ... if you could load the jacket without the interior shirt, but they load together. I actually wonder if maybe it was submitted with just the shirt dickey originally, and Daz said, "Um ... maybe do an entire shirt there, mmKay?" (You can always just delete the interior shirt if you don't want it, I guess, for that Miami Vice no-shirt look.) (And here the young'uns say, "What the heck is Miami Vice?") Oh, and you need to set smoothing/collision on yourself; it doesn't load on by default. You need to do that, because otherwise, the shirt bottom sinks into your character.

    As Phoenix1966 noted, the shirt has painted shadows, for whatever reason. It does have modeled wrinkles ... with no way to smooth them out. You can use a shader to get rid of the painted shadows, but because it only has one surface, using a shader also gets rid of the textured button placquet, which makes the shirt look slightly odd -- no sports/dress shirt of that type would be made without that sort of placquet, I think. The way the shirt is built makes sense for a game, but maybe not a lot of sense for Studio.

    EDIT: Ok, I see. The issue with the complete shirt, as opposed to the shirt dickey, is that it has modeled rolled-up cuffs. They poke through the jacket if you have that shirt on the character. And, of course, the shirt is only one material zone, so you can't hide the sleeves. Adding a smoothing modifier to the jacket and setting it to collide with the shirt mostly works, although it does leave a slightly peculiar swelled area in the forearm.

    The textures for the pants also have painted details and shadows, but also modeled front pockets, belt loops, wrinkles and cuffs. If you use a shader to get rid of the painted shadows, you wind up wiping out the beltline, front button and placquet, and back pockets.

    It's ... not a horribly constructed suit, unlike Bouncer with the Dain 8 bundle. It could be considerably better constructed, but ... put it this way: it displays all the hallmarks of someone having looked at the issues with the Bouncer suit and saying, "OK, this thing they did here? don't do THAT," but at the same time, not really saying, "OK, don't do THAT, but do THIS to make it a really well constructed item." (It's going to get a lot of Fit Control morphs thrown at it, is what I'm saying.) That said ... it's a not-terrible very basic suit, with all the parts separate that should be separate -- even if some of them are really weird.

    Post edited by vwrangler on
  • AllenArtAllenArt Posts: 7,175

    I passed on this outfit (I have enough male casual clothing that I would almost never see anyone in the U.S. wearing - of which this is one), but I find this trend with Daz Originals very "worrying". The hair also looks better suited to a game than DS - and to an old game at that. Not very encouraging.

    Laurie

  • maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 3,037
    vwrangler said:

     That said ... it's a not-terrible very basic suit, with all the parts separate that should be separate -- even if some of them are really weird.

    and now think about your reaction if you had bought it at full price... ^^

     

    AllenArt said:

    I passed on this outfit (I have enough male casual clothing that I would almost never see anyone in the U.S. wearing - of which this is one), but I find this trend with Daz Originals very "worrying". The hair also looks better suited to a game than DS - and to an old game at that. Not very encouraging.

    Laurie

    yeah, that hair really looked like 2014 or so...

    Probably it's the 3D game assets part of DAZ trying to make an additional $ by getting their stuff into the DAZ shop...

  • Serene NightSerene Night Posts: 17,704
    edited May 2020

    I hate to go against the grain, but, I  like the outfit. Well worth the price in my opinion. I'm just glad its not another horrid dforce male outfit which has filled the pro bundles lately.

     I like the realism of the pants, the soles of the shoes, and the cute way the jacket parts in the back.

    A big plus is it fits muscular characters well. Lately, the clothing hasn't worked too well for the guys.

     

    outfit.png
    1400 x 1600 - 2M
    Post edited by Serene Night on
  • EllessarrEllessarr Posts: 1,395
    edited May 2020
    maikdecker said:

    Ooookay...

    I'm really glad that I paid only $ 2.80 for this outfit. The textures (the basic ones, didn't buy the texture expansion) look ok with Iray. Changing them is a bit tricky but works. Now to the bad part:

    • There's absolutely NO movement morphs coming with this outfit. Okay, there aren't any mentioned in the description, so it's not really "cheating" but still it's a pita...
    • The outfit doesn't really work well with others than the figures mentioned in the description. With Aldo and Buster for G8M there were a couple poke throughs and "floating buttons" due to the different shape of the bellies of these figures..
    • You can't use dForce to overcome the lack of movement morphs.. except if you would remove the buttons and build your own as rigid following nodes.. can be done, but is a tedious job
    • the outfit with the jacket comes with a shirt that only covers the front part of the figure. With some figures this shows when they bend forward, as bare skin is visible on the backside where the jacket meets the pants..

    So, for $ 2.80 it's okay-ish, but if I had had to pay more for it, it would go back...

    Afaik DAZ has some game resources department now, which developes stuff for 3D games. This outfit looks exactly like something made for a game, in which the main figure runs around in clothes that have no need to be morphed for movements and suchlike...

    No wonder DAZ offered such a big % reduction for the items in this sale... ^^ some are a little better than some freebies available...

    that is something i didn't know, where is that info about that "game resources departmen???, where i can get info about that??? and about "game" if the buttoms are made in a way which they are "attached" to the outfit and not "part of the outfit this is "not game", when you export outfits with "attached" stuffs that stuffs are not animated with the outfit you need to "remove the buttoms or before add in the game engine you need to "combine then in the cloth in blender or maya or try to attach then manually by exporting then alone and "add sockets to add then to the outfit for then to "follow the animations", this aways was a trouble for me in this sort of "outfits (with stuffs attached and nor conformed or combined in the outfit).

     

    for exemple this "butler outfit

    https://www.daz3d.com/dforce-victorian-butler-for-genesis-8-males

     

    he is terrible for game, because all the buttoms and the clock, basically everything is "attached" to the outfits and not even "rigged to the model character" making him horrible to export you need to "remove almost everything or go to maya or blender to in the "worst case "combine" then to the outfit to make then at last "follow" the animation and not stay levitating in place, and it could not work in case of use "morphs" in game, few stuffs daz have are terrible to work "outside daz" like that "attachment stuff".

    Post edited by Ellessarr on
  • SevrinSevrin Posts: 6,313

    Adjustment dials?  What adjustment dials?  We don't need no stinkin adjustment dials!

    It came cheap, so, really, not a lot to complain about.  I bought some clothes for a background character, and that's what I got.

  • maikdeckermaikdecker Posts: 3,037
    Sevrin said:

    Adjustment dials?  What adjustment dials?  We don't need no stinkin adjustment dials!

    It came cheap, so, really, not a lot to complain about.  I bought some clothes for a background character, and that's what I got.

    Would you have bought it knowing all about it when it would only come at full price instead of being ~80% reduced? wink

  • xyer0xyer0 Posts: 6,347
    AllenArt said:

    I passed on this outfit (I have enough male casual clothing that I would almost never see anyone in the U.S. wearing - of which this is one), but I find this trend with Daz Originals very "worrying". The hair also looks better suited to a game than DS - and to an old game at that. Not very encouraging.

    Laurie

    Ditto.

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