Crediting artists
bsaltzman_aaab29dd05
Posts: 7
I am currently polishing up a finished feature film that has been rendered entirely in Daz Studio. I am planning on releasing it on Amazon Prime after premiering it at a local theater (York, South Carolina). Every model has come from the Daz shop, and while I know it comes with a standard license that doesn't prohibit me from selling renderings, I was wondering if anyone had any experience with "crediting." I can't in good conscience NOT include credits for all the amazing artists, like Stonemason or Dreamlight, that have made it possible, so I was wondering if anyone had any experience with "crediting etiquette." Do I ask if I can credit? Should I list every artist I purchased from as a modeler? If one doesn't reply, do I risk any legal issues by crediting them anyway? I want to do this right and do right by the artists who have made this a reality.
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It's my understanding that the EULA allows you to use products for the specific purposes without having to give credit, so it seems it is just up to you if you want to.
It's fine to credit the artists. You don't have to, but if you want to, then there's no special permission needed. If you feel that your use of the models is in a controversial area, then it might be polite to ask if they mind having their name in the credits but otherwise it shouldn't be a problem.
Crediting the artists is promotion for them so I can't see anyone having a problem with it.
https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/5425716/#Comment_5425716
https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/5425716/#Comment_5425716
"I want to do this right and do right by the artists who have made this a reality."
The artist that made this a reality is supposed to be you.
And if your movie is any good, it rose above the assets you used.
If you are determined, I would give a general statement - like a list of resources and name the Daz Store/Site as a (great) source of assets.
If you say "Featured Vendors" and list a huge scroll, sure. I could see that being a personal, but vague shout out.
Anything personal now suggests that these vendors were somehow involved/behind/supporting/aware of your movie.
Or to future customers, it hints that - if I buy THAT SET, it's going to look like (how it does in) your animated movie.
When and if you made changes, played with lighting and who knows about the render/compression settings and whatever else you did.
I also can't imagine you made a whole movie and left everything exactly as it came- out the box.
-- Enough to say it's a proper demo of those items.
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Further, in my own humble opinion (not to be taken as gospel) it subtracts from your artistry. You don't really ever see anything that names all the tools and assets that went into it.
Movie credits are about people and formats.
You thank the teams/companies/entities that helped make the movie.
If you say 'lunch from Joe's Deli" in your credits it suggests that they sponsored you and gave you lunches for free.
If all your movie crews went over and paid for lunch- why would you add that credit to your movie - because it tasted really good?
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Want to support the vendors, mention them in the comments and even provide links.
Put OTHER film makers onto the Daz Store and let the general audience think it's all magic on the screen.
I don't expect credit,you paid for the model,that's all the credit I need
That is so messed up. The director gets paid and the director gets credited. The producer gets paid and the producer gets credited. The screenplay writer gets paid and the screenplay writer gets credited. The cinematographer gets paid and the cinematographer gets credited. The actors get paid and the actors get credited. Nobody here sponsored the film. Everyone got paid and everyone got credited. Go to the end credit roll you will see names or companies. Sound credits for those who got paid and Lighting credits for those who got paid and Grip (grunt work) credits for those who got paid. Nobody here sponsored the film. So it makes sense that for the list of visual effects and modeling be credited too. Crediting Jack Tomalin doesn't mean he sponsored your film. Ditto for Stonemason although I would add his name too. Sure there were a lot of freebies and specials and regular purchases but nobody needs to know that. Nor do people need to know that it is for the garbage can or texture on the garbage can. You know what, there is a poster on the wall or some graffitti on the wall. You yourself changed that. So you may as well add your name to the credits of model making department. You don't need to say what it is for. Some choices are special thanks to name name name company name name could be for babysitting or for information on where to get something. It doesn't mention what it was for, just name or company name. Daz3D. As for food, I would list that under Craft Services: Sandwich Craft. Just because they got credited doesn't mean they sponsored you. They also got paid. Unless they actually did sponsor you, in which case I would list them in Special Thanks. Filmmaking is an expensive business. About $1000 per minute of film. Don't forget to keep your receipts. You never know if you will make money back on the investment. Some of all these who got paid didn't get paid. Payment might have been deferred in order to get the film made and make the money later.
Okay, leave him out. :) But I want credit under special thanks for writing all this information. ;)
Your post isn't disagreeing with what I wrote.
I would list that under Craft Services
If Vendor(s) provided a service, what you're suggesting would make sense, except none of them did.
Catering is a service, buying lunch at the same place everyday while you make your movie is not.
None of them were in contract with you or comissioned to have their assets used in your work.
It'd even be a stretch if you bought your models directly from a vendor, but that isn't being done here either..
Your agreement is with the Daz Store.
The part I like best is that official credits should list Official Situations.
Special thanks is indeed the place to include your ....special thanks.
Which is what all of this is really about.
Credit them so we can just tell noobs to RTDC* (and you'll get paid for another view) when they ask, "What is this ____" when your film goes viral.
* Read the damn credits
Certainly don't expect credit, but it is cool to see it scrolling at the end of a video if the producer decices to add them.
Now if you are trying to monetize your production, the distributor/streaming service will want detailed records and licenses of the assets you used. That's more a paper trail, rather than credits, but the information is the same. E & O production insurance will require that information as well.
Problem with credits is no one reads them other than the first few actors.
Which is kind of why credits in old films were better, as thats all they usually listed. After that it's a bunch of names no one honestly cares about (or remembers 10 seconds later) other than the people in them.
That said, i've been in credits for things. I still didn't bother reading them..
I give credits for content i used if i think they will be of interest. but what is most important is to make sure you post your animation here so we can enjoy your film :)
I see absolutely no reason why you couldn't give credit to the individuals who created the content you used (just my opinion). If you wish to, you could add a section to your credit scroll for "CG Content Creators" and include there the names of the people and studios that created any 3D content you used, and your own name if you created some content yourself. This would be the same as when you see the people and studios listed in movie credits, who worked on special effects, 3D models, textures/materials, animations, etc. If you do creeate such a credit scroll don't forget to include credits for things like the music you use, even if it is your own creation. And... don't forget to give yourself credit for being the director, producer, writer, or any other roles you filled.
I don't think you "have to" include credits, as mentioned by FSMCDesigns above, but I would consider it the classy thing to do, and it keeps things honest. I would think you would be less likely to run into any legal trouble if you gave credit were credit is due, and thereby prevented any possible misunderstandings regarding the authorship of the works individual parts. I shouldn't think theree would be any difficulty since the artists selling through DAZ are giving you the legal rights to use their content in such works as specified in DAZ's End User License Agreement. (Note: Do be aware of the licensing for any non DAZ content you use, such as the music.)...But what do I know. I'm not a lawyer. I'm just a professional illustrator/designer who does the best I can to protect myself. Doesn't always mean I know what I'm doing.
I don't require credit and all I do are freebies. I would think if you paid for the item, that would be enough. It is NICE to credit the artist tho, and would probably make them feel warm and fuzzy. LOL
Laurie
^I personally get that warm fuzzy feeling just from seeing my models used in renders/animations (so for me, sharing links to your work on the forums is the best thanks :) )
Weirdly, the opposite is usually true in the silly nonsensical world of lawyering. People take others to court to get removed from credits as they don't want to make it seem they had anything to do with a production (even if they actually did). Though usually that's because the work is really, really bad and they don't want it to reflect badly on them.
I guess that saying someone did something runs into legal trouble because it's a bit like libel. I don't think there's anything legal for not including someone in the credits (which happens all the time, even to actors and writers).
Slaps head... Yes, I can see this happening. I sometimes forget how complicated, confused, and "occasionaly" stupid people can be (me included). I forgot to mention that I would have made it clear in the credits that these particular credits were for premade content purchased from a store and not made for the work in question. I'd have to think about how to state this clearly and succinctly. Also, I don't know if this would make things worse or better legally. I would have tried to make it clear the content was not made specifically for the movie. Again, I don't know if this would help because I'm not a lawyer. But, yes, I can see the content creator(s) complaining if thier content was misused or badly used and creditted.
Probably just putting "Made using assets from the DAZ 3d store" would be fine. The people involved can come and ask "what hair/outfit was used in this film" like normal..
Specific people could be listed in the "thanks" section, and only list a role if they actively did something to directly help the production. Generally only active roles done by people who knew they were working on the film are listed in credits (you'll see the person who fetched coffee, but not the people who designed/built the lens/cameras/lights).
I'd guess the safest "legal" nonsense thing would be to not list anyone. Of course it's pretty unlikely to cause any legal disputes either way, unless millions of whatevers start rolling around.
Making a movie is a team effort. Hopefully, something that could be shown to their parents and grandparents and children without embarrassment. Both storywise and technically. Perhaps it would be helpful to post a link to a five minute trailer here of the film. List here the PAs in this forum thread before printing to the credits on the full length film. This might help the PAs see better if they want in or out.
FirstBastion mention E & O insurance. Errors such as including names and Omissions such as not including name would be covered. Another part of this is having a law firm to make the film itself an LLC. A limited liability corporation so that the owners of the film don't lose all their purchased Daz assets or computers or cameras and lenses, sound equipment, lights and grip equipment if the insurance company decides to screw the film's owner(s). Yeah, all that even if it were not used to make the particular film that is only animated with no live action invovled. All that equipment and CG should be in a separate company because it is used in other films and rented out from ower to same owner but different film.
It's kind of like a Catch 22. You're damned if you do and damned if you don't. Step carefully. There-be mines ahead.
I agree that you are probably safest not to list anyone with regard to DAZ content. I don't recall anything in the DAZ licensing requiring credit be given for the particular use we are discussing. If you use content from other sources the licensing may be different, of course. Perhaps simply stating "Made with Software, with additional content from Store Name" would be enough to satisfy people with questions.
I list all the products I use in my renders so that is more or less giving credit. Should I ever make an animation or game that was worthwhile to publish I'd give credits. I'm not embarrassed to use purchased and free art in games or animations I might publish.
As I do this mostly as a hobby giving credits listing credits is more to point noob hobbyists to resources available for their projects than anything else. Eventually I reckon for the PAs after enough of the 1000s or 10s of 1000s of customers use and credit their products the novelty wears off.