How to tell if the pose pack product is good?
kar98kdasini
Posts: 56
in The Commons
You know, there are too many pose sets on sale in Daz 3D.
So what's your rule of thumbs in determining the pose is satisfactory when comparing the alternatives?
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If I like some/most of the poses. You know, you're asking how people dtermine if they like a color, taste, movie, etc.
If the set interests you buy it, if it doesn't, pass. There are lots of choices so it's not a critical decision.
The tricky part is looking past the pretty (or ugly) models. It's fairly easy to fall for a mediocre posepack because you happen to like the model or her clothes in the promos. Or skip useful posepacks because the figures look bland or are clay or blue-pink shaded or the renders are grainy.
Another thing to keep in mind, is the models' body. With poses like crossed legs or hands placed somewhere on the side or head or anywhere else on the body, it will make a huge difference whether you're going to use the pose on a similar figure or not. Technically, poses are aligned relative to the bones, never to where a figures' skin is. Tweaking a pose is inevitable, but some poses are harder to tweak on some figures than others. Just imagine a pose made specifically for Ollie to sit crosslegged, being used on George. That pose is going to clip. A lot. So keep in mind what kind of figures you use, and what figures the poses are made for.
Any pose pack that has options for seperate upper and lower body posing gets 1 bonuspoint in my book. Yes, only 1. The pack does become more versatile, and these upper and lower body poses can often be combined with poses from other products (both partial and full body poses), but posing does become a bit more fiddly, and not every combination, even within such a pack, is necessarily a good combination.
Heels / no heels variations are nice to have as well, though I usually keep the footpose for the shoes at hand, most shoes come with a special foot pose, which is great, because there's an obvious difference between 3 inch heels and 5 inch heels. But, heels/no heels variations for poses are sometimes still useful when the designer of the pose took the bending of the leg into account.
A lot of pose packs appear fairly similar at first glance, so, when in doubt, I just keep them open in seperate tabs, and look again about an hour later. One pack will usually "click" more with me than another. Sometimes I can precisely tell why it clicks, other times I won't be able to put my finger on it, it might be as little as a slight difference in how one leg twists in a pose in one pack, but doesn't on a similar pose in another pack.
Variety is also the spice of life, so, look at the pack, and see if there's any poses that you think you don't have an aquivalence for. Similar poses can be tweaked, but a pose unlike anything you have already, would require you to build it from the ground up if you need it.
Buy it, test the poses; like them, keep; not like them: return.
I'm not interested in pose sets with poses where the character is just standing there or flexing their muscles. Pretty much every pro bundle has a ton of these and they are easy to make. Baked in expressions are another pose issue, or poses which make the character zap to zero unless they are needed in a specific place. I'm also not really keen on pose sets which plump the total poses by adding mirrored poses or poses for multiple figures since there tend to be fewer overall poses and I can reverse poses easily and don't tend to use base figures
I pretty much just buy the poses that would be hard to make or couples poses, since they are more interactive. Poses involving a theme such as sickness, bike riding etc I will buy if sold with corresponding props. I also like combat and rescue kind of poses. I have a large library of poses so I don't need to buy them really but i do like them.
I absolutely avoid sexy female and overally pinup style poses since, I don't render women that way or often enough to make the investment worth it.
The only good posses are expressions that convey real emotions for it takes skill to compose the right mood without overdoing or underdoing it. Everything else is a cash grab promoted as convenience.
I usually.....
1) Scan through the pose promos and group shot of all the poses and pick the ones I know I could use as is.
Divide that with the cost to see if it's worth it. I don't buy a set for 1 or 2 good poses. (although disclaimer, I did this weekend)
2) Scan for possibilities or partials, like something close to useable and figure on how much tweaking is needed.
3) I (always) need (more) neutral poses, conversations or character standing, relaxed, listening. Check for those.
4) I used to be big, big on partials, upper body and lower body, but now I have scripts to freeze sections or pose mixer products to only affect certain areas.
5) Check for heels or flats and if there are variations.
6) Check if it's from Aeon Soul, if so, place in cart and skip all previous steps.
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Things I avoid. Stiffness. Limbs at 45' or 90' angles. Hands too.
Anything that has the neck at extreme turns, twists and bends. Always looks crazy.
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Things that make me happy:
Left hand/right hand choices!!!!!!!
Separate grip or hand poses // feet flat/heels options are great.
*Some* facial expressions. Nice add-on.
Mirrored poses- cause it saves me a few button clicks to not use Symmetry.
Things that make me sad:
Poses that have rotation locked in and the character dips forward or sideways.
Poses that break the pins and somehow unlock -locked body parts and I lose holding-something-or-weapon grips - especially when it took forever to get the character to grab something right.
Speaking of, weapons with NO INCLUDED HAND POSES. Especially weirdly shaped tools and objects.
Um, yeah.
Have a good look at the hands. They are very expressive, and can take a while to get right.
I want poses that I think actual people could be in. There are way too many sets where poses don't look natural or believable at all to me, even for runway or model shots.
As a contrast, the other day I was looking at a set of reading poses at another store and realized I was in the exact same pose as one which was included in the set. Needless to say I bought it ;)
I purchase hand/feet poses for the sake of convenience. I would purchase more poses if I thought they took some effort to actually have the pose assume the posture a real person would make when doing the activity etc. Most of the times the poses don't look believable.
I purchased the Exile Poses for Nix - I appreciated how natural the standing poses looked. But im not sure if the artistic renderings elevated the pose. Maybe there are other natural poses within other pose sets that I rule out too easily.
I look at them to see which look realistic and natural vs like a mannequin. And also original. So many poses are very basic and anyone could do them. I know I'm going to have to tweak them anyway and rarely, actually never, use poses as is. I do buy poses that come with hand held props because that makes things a lot easier but I tweak the rest of the pose. Just think of poses as starting points. Are they sitting, standing, lying down? Then pose yourself. Almost all hands need to reposed because they are mostly very unnatural. Use real images as references. Make the poses your own.
_ and have Subtle Poses Bundle by Elele _ and quite nice , natural looking _
_ although is for : Genesis 2 Female, Genesis, Victoria 5, Michael 5
Depends on what I'm looking for, as there's really three ways I shop for poses.
1. It just came out, in which case I'm basically just looking to see if it's a) quality poses, and b) filling a spot that's not otherwise filled. How many of the same pose do I really need? I look for quality poses that I don't already have.
2. There's a sale on and I'm combing through my wishlist. In this case I'm pretty much JUST looking for quality and price, as I've probably already decided whether or not it fills a role when I put it in my wishlist, so now it's a matter of how well the figure is posed in the pack. "Yes, I have twelve poses where the model is sitting down cross-legged, but THIS ONE does it better! AND it's only $X which gives me a further 10% off my other items, which is really 20% cause I bought that new release yesterday, and it qualifies me for the other discount thing percentage chummy blarga blarga DAZ discounts majiggy" kind of mentality
3. I'm doing a scene, and I need a specific pose that I couldn't be bothered to craft myself, in which case I'm just searching the store for, say "Gun poses" cause I need a shooty one, opening them all up, and trying to find which pack best replicates what I'm trying to accomplish with minimal adjusting. In this instance, I'm not so much looking at the PACK of poses, but combing through for an individual pose.
I look to see if I like the expressions, if any, in a pose pack. If I do then I'll buy it if they are really good & there are a lot of them.
Many pose packs are given these sort of 'vague utopian or dramatic lifestyle' sorts of names but when you look they are just minor alterations of general 'photo studio' pose sets not even really coherant thematically.
Sometimes, like the recent Hacky-Sack pose set there are really good poses quality wise and consistant thematically.
...and they should not jump to 000 when using them
no back breaking pose
full body and partials (upper, lower, hands)
free prop(s)
flat feet
When trying to decide i'll look to see if the pose is natural or if its even possible. If i were to act out a pose or action how does it compare to what i see in a pose pack? is the pose pack exaggerating a pose? did they go too far on a range of motion to where if i try to do it irl it doesnt feel comfortable or it hurts?
Thank you all for the replies.
Very helpful indeed.
Pose set that are within the character bend limits, rotation only (not origin point reset), natural, not pinup-py, have atleast a few truly unique uncommon poses included, and atleast 40 poses included in the set. Partials are a nice bonus. The default should be a flat foot, cause most shoes include a partial pose for the specific heel. There are dedicated hand pose sets available, so that part of a pose is easily adjustable. If the pose can tell a story or indicate a bahviour or action that's also beneficial.
Besides this, I also get really annoyed at poses which reset a character's scale to 100%.
That is why poses should always be saved ROTATION ONLY. The exception are interactive multi person or couple pose that need specific positioning, or poses for specific characters because their bulk or mass will affect the location and placement of limbs. As a general rule you can't use a pose specifically made for the Freak on a waify cartoon character without expecting some tweaking work afterwards.
If you have Ati's add-on, check out the links to the forum or the images in the gallery. See how others talked about the pack and any issues or what they liked. Or how they used the pose in their renders.
Personnally I desperately look for pose sets that could be used in a professional setting, whether contemporary, military, or sci-fi. Too many are over sexualized and if a person behaved like that, they would be either up on charges (military) or dismissed from their positions (and that was before the MeToo era). Or at least they should have been.
Power Pose will keep you from going crazy and help you make those small adjustments. Especially as a hand is impalling an outfit and thigh or arm.
What I am careful of, older sets pre-dForce, where it wasn't a concern if body parts went through each other. Yet, I have found some sets from the G2 era that are great and I have moved them up to G8 with conversions.
I also take note of any vendor that takes the time to have their icon enlarge when I hover over it on my screen. So helpful.
I have a ton of pose packs thanks to character bundles, but I honestly don't use a lot of them for various reasons. I do buy pose packs on occasion but I'm very picky on them. I don't expect to like every pose in a pack but I'll look at the cost and say, "For this price, I need to like x number in the pack to buy it." Pose complexity and frequency of usefulness also factor in - e.g. if there are a few great poses in the pack that would take a lot of time to recreate and that I'd use alot, I'll buy it even if I don't like a lot of the other poses. Here's how I judge a pack:
How different are the poses compared to other packs I have? I really, really, really don't need another pin-up pack.
Are the poses at least slightly asymmetrical? (Only in rare instances, like military formations, are people standing with near perfect symmetry.)
Are the shoulders natural? Most people, especially these days with so much desk work, have their shoulders rounded down and in a little towards their chest. I think rigid shoulders are the #1 reason I skip pose packs.
Do the hips and shoulders balance each other in the poses? E.g. if one shoulder is lowered, the same side hip should be angled upward by roughly the same amount.
For every day poses, would I be able to do that pose comfortably? Some poses have overly curved spines, knees/ankles oddly rotated, etc. Unless the pose is exagerated for comedic effect, I should be able to physically duplicate the pose without needing painkiller and a heating pad afterward.
Do the poses look like they're at the beginning or end of a range of motion? Unfortunately, I can't find the wonderful reference for this, but there was a drawing site showing that the best stances to draw, overall, are at the begining or end of a move. It used a baseball pitcher as a reference. The initial pose - the pitcher balanced on one leg with his hands together and body twisted to one side - and the end pose - the body forward, balanced on the opposite leg and the arm outstretched - were the best balanced and gave the most dynamic feel to the scene. Poses that are mid-motion tend to be clunky because the body is shifting its balance so it looks off-center. As with anything else, there are times an inbetween pose works better, but most of the time, the start or end of a motion works best. (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/25/Baseball_pitching_motion_2004.jpg/600px-Baseball_pitching_motion_2004.jpg - doesn't image 1 and 4 look more dynamic yet balanced than 2 and 3 for pitching? Image 2 isn't bad, but you can't tell if they're pitching to the mound or throwing to a base, plus the feet aren't planted on the ground so the weight is a bit off.)
Does the body properly interact with its surroundings? If a character is up against a wall, is their back flattened against it or just kinda touching it in one or two spots? If they're lying on their side, does their ribcage sag to meet the floor or does it hover parallel to the floor? This is right up there with the rigid shoulders for reasons why I'll skip a pack.
Is the weight distributed properly? If the character is standing, does their stance look steady - e.g. if it's mostly on the back foot, is their pelvis shifted more towards the back leg? If they're leaning on a counter, are the shoulders raised slightly to indicate support?
For females, is the spine in a natural position or is there a lot of BBJ - breast, butt jut? https://d1466nnw0ex81e.cloudfront.net/n_iv/600/649823.jpg
Don't get me started on facial expressions. I have a novel-length rant on facial expressions.
You might want to look at some drawing/animation tutorial sites to get an idea of what makes a good pose. Bad poses can kill your art whether you go for photoreal or not. For me, it's even worse than bad lighting.
Hope this helps.