macOS Catalina

Looks like it's not entirely compatible with Carrara. Anyways, some of the file dialog funcrions seem to be broken (File Import, for example). Basic project open & save seems to be fine though. I haven't played with browser presets etc yet, although I don't anticipate them being broken.

But if a working Carrara is important to you (and if you're here, I suspect it is), then I'd suggest holding off on Catalina.

Comments

  • DiomedeDiomede Posts: 12,594

    no

  • Bunyip02Bunyip02 Posts: 5,404
    Diomede said:

    no

    angrycrying

     

  • de3ande3an Posts: 911

    ...Anyways, some of the file dialog functions seem to be broken (File Import, for example)...

     

    Could you be more specific? There have been broken file dialogs in Carara since version 8 on the Mac version.

    If you try to open a saved scene file, and Carrara cannot locate one of its texture files, a file dialog box will be presented that is intended to be used to locate and open the missing texture file. However, ever since Carrara 8 , this dialog box is missing the name of the file that it is looking for.

    Is this the problem that you are talking about? Or are there additional issues in Catalina?

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 31,493

    Sadly DAZ aint gonna fix it

    but Apple seems determined to make just about everything difficult I have quite gone off the thoughts I had of getting a Macintosh rig one day, I will stick with their iOS devices instead  

    Linux and Blender might be our futures crying

  • TangoAlphaTangoAlpha Posts: 4,579
    de3an said:

    ...Anyways, some of the file dialog functions seem to be broken (File Import, for example)...

     

    Could you be more specific? There have been broken file dialogs in Carara since version 8 on the Mac version.

    If you try to open a saved scene file, and Carrara cannot locate one of its texture files, a file dialog box will be presented that is intended to be used to locate and open the missing texture file. However, ever since Carrara 8 , this dialog box is missing the name of the file that it is looking for.

    Is this the problem that you are talking about? Or are there additional issues in Catalina?

     

    No. I mean basic fundamentals like File->Open. Select your .car file to load, okay the dialog, and nothing happens.

    You can load a file from the browser tray, that works fine, as does Load Preset. But you can't add a new folder to the browser (because that invokes the file dialog, and the results get ignored)

  • TangoAlphaTangoAlpha Posts: 4,579

    Sadly DAZ aint gonna fix it

    but Apple seems determined to make just about everything difficult I have quite gone off the thoughts I had of getting a Macintosh rig one day, I will stick with their iOS devices instead  

    Linux and Blender might be our futures crying

     

    Yeah, Apple are rapidly removing any remaining reasons to keep using a Mac... sad

  • VyusurVyusur Posts: 2,151

    Macintosh is nothing more than an expensive photo frame to me already for more than a year.

  • bytescapesbytescapes Posts: 1,553

    Go64, which is a tool for checking for Catalina compatibility, reports that Carrara contains 32-bit components that may give problems on Catalina.

    The analysis actually says

    Carrara is a 64-bit app with some internal components that are still 32-bit.

    It may or may not run correctly on macOS 10.15, depending on how the app handles situations where its 32-bit components would normally be used. Check for a more recent version or contact the application's developer for more information.

    These components are 32-bit:

    /Contents/MacOS/HelperTool
    /Contents/MacOS/InstallTool

    I had actually hoped that these might be minor pieces of the application, and that most operations would still work normally. I guess that either this isn't the case, or that the problems @TangoAlpha reported are due to other incompatibilities between Carrara and Catalina (i.e. something other than the 32-bit/64-bit issue).

    As for "holding off" on the transition to Catalina, I think that it's probably overoptimistic to hope for a resolution. Whatever the issue is, I doubt that Apple will make any changes in Catalina that will resolve it, so it's down to DAZ to do the necessary engineering to make Carrara fully compatible with Catalina. Based on past performance, I'm not optimistic about that happening.

    This is, of course, uninformed speculation. It's perfectly possible that whatever's breaking file loads in Carrara is a glitch in Catalina that affects other Mac apps as well and that Apple will thus be forced to fix. But I think it's more likely that, if it's not related to Carrara's 32-bit elements, it'll be that Carrara is programmed against an old API that has changed or been deprecated in Catalina. If that's the case, we shouldn't look to Apple for a solution.

    Although I have seen other app developers complain that there are things in Catalina that are, in their words, 'broken' (as opposed to just 'changed'), so Apple may still have some work to do.

    Mac users who want to keep using Carrara may need to choose between (a) staying on Mojave or earlier, or (b) running Carrara under a virtualization tool such as Parallels.

  • TangoAlphaTangoAlpha Posts: 4,579

    The issues that I've seen have all been related to the file dialogs, so it's all part of the new sandboxing rules.

    Oh, and 32-bit support is totally gone now, but I don't think that's much of an issue unless you were relying on 32-bit Quicktime.

    I've put in a bug report, but I don't hold much (any) hope that anything'll get done.

  • ed3Ded3D Posts: 1,219
    edited October 2019

    _Or run Win's Version _,,or not  (Boot Camp Assistant)

    Post edited by ed3D on
  • wsterdanwsterdan Posts: 1,584
    edited October 2019

    Oh, and 32-bit support is totally gone now, but I don't think that's much of an issue unless you were relying on 32-bit Quicktime.

    Or using the lip sync tab.  I've had to keep a 32-bit version of D|S for the last few years just to use that as there's not a lot of other D|S/Mac options. sad

    -- Walt Sterdan

    Post edited by wsterdan on
  • TangoAlphaTangoAlpha Posts: 4,579

    Yeah, Catalina is a killer if you're relying on old stuff that's never gonna get updated.

  • I can't install Carrara 8.5 Pro, 64 bit, in Catalina. The DIM 64 bit keeps giving me an "installation failed" msg.  And, the Bit Rock installer used for Carrara CAN NOT be opened in Catalina.  
     

    help . . . desperate

     

    thanks,

    weet

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 31,493
    edited October 2019

    time to abandon Machintosh maybe or at least updating it devil its going to get worse

    I am keeping a Windows 7 rig as well as my Win10 one for that reason too

    as things change

    Post edited by WendyLuvsCatz on
  • No! I will not abandon Macintosh for one program! And I'll NEVER run Windoze! I want to know how some people in this thread got Carrara installed into Catalina! That's all!

  • Have you tried a manual install?

  • de3ande3an Posts: 911
    edited October 2019

    No! I will not abandon Macintosh for one program! And I'll NEVER run Windoze! I want to know how some people in this thread got Carrara installed into Catalina! That's all!

     

    As far as I'm aware, Carrara is not compatible with Catalina due to some 32 bit code that remains in Carrara. It's unclear to me at this point if this can be worked around. The BitRock Installer is also 32 bit, so you would need to find another way to install it.

    You indicated that Daz's DIM failed to install Carrara, raising the question whether the DIM is compatible with Catalina. If not, then that should be reported to Daz.

    I haven't used the DIM in years, but I did use it when I originally installed Carrara. For me the DIM downloaded Carrara install files as Zip files and stored them in

    Users/Shared/DAZ 3D/InstallManager/Downloads

    The file names were:
    IM00016777-04_Carrara85ProMac64bit.zip
    IM00016175-01_Carrara8NativeContent.zip
    IM00017078-01_Carrara85NativeContent.zip
    IM00017079-01_Carrara85ProNativeContent.zip

    If the DIM got as far as downloading these files onto your Mac you can unzip them yourself and manually install them.

    The default location for the Carrara App is in:
    /Applications/DAZ 3D/

    The native content is installed into the "Carrara.app" application bundle:
    /Applications/DAZ 3D/Carrara8.5 64-bit/Carrara.app/Contents/MacOS/Presets
    and
    /Applications/DAZ 3D/Carrara8.5 64-bit/Carrara.app/Contents/MacOS/Scenes

    Unfortunately, I don't recall where the contents of the other two content files go (Carrara85NativeContent and Carrara85ProNativeContent). Prehaps someone else remembers.

    You could also install Carrara on an older Mac OS and copy the installed folder to the new OS. Install Carrara and all of the Native Content files before you try to transfer it to the new system.

    Additionally, I've come across older content that would not be able to be reinstalled due to the installer being 32 bit.

    Some of our favorite plug-ins may also be incompatible if they are 32 bit. I haven't investigated this yet, but many of the plug-in in use today have been abandoned and are not likely to be updated.

    Hope this info is helpful.

    Let us know if you're successful.

    Post edited by de3an on
  • TangoAlphaTangoAlpha Posts: 4,579

    If you want to use Carrara without problems on a Mac, you need to stick with Mojave or earlier. There's no way around that.

  • Thanks for all of the info. I have an ssd external drive that is new. I'll format it and install Mojave on it.

  • I'm installing Catalina on an external drive and plan on doing a lot of testing to see what works and what doesn't. I'll make a list and post it here  

    Tango,

    have you found anything besides import that doesn't work?

  • BrianP21361BrianP21361 Posts: 718
    edited October 2019

    I cloned my hard drive with Carrara on it and DIM (my content is on an external drive). I installed Catalina on the cloned drive and I've been running Carara for a few hours without any issues. Here are some of the things I've tried:

    • Imported a DUF file - no issues
    • Imported a Carrara file - no issues
    • Added a runtime to the content tab
    • Dragged numerous shaders to content
    • Exported an obj then reimported - some issues with transparency channel in shaders
    • Posed figues by applying purchased poses - V4, G3M, G8M
    • Adjusted morphs on figures - V4, G3M, G8M
    • Rendered numerous scenes
    • Rendered with displacement
    • Saved rendered images as PNG files
    • Created a very simple key frame animation with a sphere and exported it as sequenced PNG files
    • Saved a new Carrara file
    • Opened a Carrara file saved in Catalina
    • Used open dialog to load a scene
    • Drag and dropped a Carrara file to the Carrara program to load it
    • The icon for CAR files is different with Catalina - doesn't seem to be an issue

    I did see in the Studio forum that DIM doesn't work correctly. Daz is "working" on it. I've also seen that a lot of people are having issues installing Carrara on new machines. I think the manual installers are 32-bit and DIM isn't working. Hopefully, Carrara installation will be fixed onece DIM is fixed. 

    If you have specific things, you'd like me to try, let me know. 

    (The attached picture is George (G3M) as Captain Marvel rendered in Catalina) :)

    Test Render G3M Captain Marvel George.png
    1200 x 900 - 262K
    Post edited by BrianP21361 on
  • de3ande3an Posts: 911

    Thanks for this detailed report Brian!

    We now seem to have conflicting reports on the viability of Carrara under Mac OS Catalina.

    Unfortunately, I don't currently have the resources to set up a separate Catalina boot drive. And I have way too many important 32 bit programs to take the Catalina plunge. So I won't be able to contribute any useful information here. But, I will be very interested in the results that others are having!

    Hopefully Weet will report back with his results.

     

  • TangoAlphaTangoAlpha Posts: 4,579

    File Open doesn't work for me either. (although I can open from a preset or the browser tray)

  • It's strange that my results are different than TangoAlpha's. I might have an idea why. When the "file not found" issue came up a few years ago, my son came up with a plug in that has a window pop up with the name of the missing file. I posted the fix in the forums (can't find where right now). My son doesn't think his update would have fixed the issues you are seeing, but I'll remove the plug in and see if I experience the same issues as TangoAlpha. I can't do it until after work. I'll keep you posted. 

  • It's strange that my results are different than TangoAlpha's. I might have an idea why. When the "file not found" issue came up a few years ago, my son came up with a plug in that has a window pop up with the name of the missing file. I posted the fix in the forums (can't find where right now). My son doesn't think his update would have fixed the issues you are seeing, but I'll remove the plug in and see if I experience the same issues as TangoAlpha. I can't do it until after work. I'll keep you posted. 

    That wasn't it. Sorry.

    When you launch Carrara does it ask if you want to allow it to access your folders and discks? Also, does Carrara have access as indicated in the Security Preferences. See attached screen shots. I don't understand why it asks everytime I open Carrara.I would think I'd only have to allow it once and it would remember. 

    Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 6.55.35 PM.png
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    Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 6.56.38 PM.png
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    Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 6.56.46 PM.png
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    Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 6.56.55 PM.png
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  • TangoAlphaTangoAlpha Posts: 4,579

    Mine only asked the first time. I don't have the plugin you mentioned in the previous post.

  • TangoAlpha,

    The plugin was a red herring. I have no idea why it works for me and not you. Maybe if others weigh in as they try Catalina we can figure it out. 

  • bkotulisbkotulis Posts: 0

    Although this article calls out Yosemite, this trick worked for me as I am also running MacOS Catalina 10.15.6.

    https://www.versluis.com/2015/02/how-to-install-carrara-8-5-in-mac-os-x-yosemite/

    The install trouble mostly comes from Carrara not recognizing you as having "Admin" privileges, even if you do, and thus you need to install a level deeper as a root-user. Installation was successful for me, and the program opens files and functions at 90%. But this problem also prevents functioning versions of Carrara to import ANY objects or import any textures — making the program mostly useless, which I have still not resolved.

    For good measure, once installed, you will also want to go to System Preferences > Security & Privacy and add Carrara to the Full Disk Access and Files and Folders categories.

    I have used the technique described in the link above and it worked for me. Although I still cannot import objects or texture files (JPGs, PNGs, etc)...  Still very frustrated by this.

    If anyone has discovered a way to resolve importing files/textures, I am very curious.

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