Cinder without Kanade Base
SBibb
Posts: 600
in The Commons
Does anyone have any renders (even just really quick ones) of what Cinder ( https://www.daz3d.com/cinder-for-kanade-8 ) looks like without the Kanade base? And mixed with other characters?
I'm curious to see whether or not she has a decent look on her own, or if the Kanade base is necessary.
(I'm also curious about how Hana and Amerie look without the base, but the primary one I'd like to see is Cinder).
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Comments
I wonder what most of them would look like with Sakura or Aiko instead too.
@SBibb I did a render of Cinder without Kanade 8 for you. I stopped it early because I noticed all the lines on her texture so there are stilll some fireflies. I'm not sure if those lines are from my lighting or her skin, possibly set with the wrong UV. I'm investigating it with different lighting now to see if those lines still show up.
As for her morph, it's distinctly different without Kanade 8 mixed in. She sort of looks like an older, more wiser version of Kanade. My first instinct on seeing her in the viewport was to say she is the one figure I might consider telling people not to buy unless you get the required figures because she looks terrible. But, that's only in the viewport. Rendered, she actually looks like an interesting character, especially with the makeup that drew me to her in the first place. She has a more Gothic feel to her that I love.
I have not rendered her with Kanade 8 yet. Once I suss out the issue with the skin, I plan to render a side by side. Assuming I can figure out the skin issue, I think she's worth getting even without Kanade 8, depending on what style you go for. I won't put the image in the post. I'll wait until I have a proper full render for that, but you should be able to click on the attachment to see it at full size in a new tab.
edit: I thought it wasn't going to a new tab so scratched it out, but it looks like it actually is so I undid the strikethrough.
Awesome, thank you! :-D
I've been really curious to see this. She definitely has a different look without the base, but thus far I'm thinking I still like how she looks even without it (though I'd love to work with the base, too). I suspect some of her facial features could be tweaked pretty easily with other morphs.
I think it was the gothic look that I liked about her, too. (And the promo pics kind of remind me of some of the gothic BJD / ball jointed doll art I've seen, which could be a fun aesthetic to play with).
I'm definitely interested in seeing how your other renders turn out if you can figure out what was causing the line issue. (Is it possible that it needed more render time? I know that my early renders sometimes have odd lighting until they've sat a while).
That looks like something is off with her skin's opacity or translucency settings to me.
Cinder without Kanade 8 might mix well with another small-mouthed character, like Young Minto. But I don't have Cinder to find out.
The shape without Kanade 8 looks great to me.
So, turns out it was just a lighting issue. I'd never seen that happen with lighting before but it was a new HDRI I was testing out. As @SBibb suggested, the render just needed to go longer. Which I ended up doing after testing several other lighting setups and getting no skin irregularities. So, here is the final render, rendered longer under the same lights as the one I posted earlier.
Cinder - No Kanade 8
Glad you got the issue figured out. I know I've had that happen a couple times, but I hadn't pegged it to the HDRI being the issue.
Thanks for posting the full version, and I would be happy to see any other versions you make with her, both with and without the base. :-D
I don't have Young Minto, either. But I was thinking it shouldn't be too hard to dial the mouth down a bit if desired (at least, not if you have something like 200+ Face Morphs).
But I like both the shape and the skin without the base, so I think Cinder is going to go on my to-buy list.
@MimicMolly You mentioned Minto and I was curious so I mixed her in with the base Cinder figure without Kanade 8. Minto Young is at about 77% in this render. She looks pretty good.
edit: It really helps to upload the correct image. :)
Wow, both of these renders without Kanade dialed in look fantastic! It's a whole different character.
Last render from me. This is Cinder out of the box. She's cute even without emphasizing the gothic feel to her. I need to sit down and work up a proper gothic render with her. I really like how she looks in all the renders I've done with her.
@ALLIEKATBLUE Thanks.
Yep, that's the one. Except I didn't use the mask.
This is actually a pretty typical kind of render for me, but it is using Cinder with Kanade dialed out so thought I'd pop it up here.
One thing, of note, is that I used Design Anvil's Glowing Eyes for G3 but took the emissive light all the way down to 10 from like, 400-Gazillion. The glow is just faint enough that her eyes don't fade out in the shadow.
BOSS Pro Light Set, and Classic Long Curly Hair by Linday.
Oh that's very nice @Gogger! I love it. I have those eyes on my wishlist, but I never thought of using them like that. Gonna have to definitely pick it up since it's on sale.
Thanks @Knittingmommy - It can be hard to see past the promos and use things in ways other than intended, but I love it when it happens. Using assets in unexpected ways definetly gives more bang-for-the-buck!
That's a clever idea, I think I might try it with regular emissive settings sometime.
@Knittingmommy Thank you for posting your renders of Cinder. I made the descision to splurge and get her. :-D
These are my "out of the box" renders of Cinder without the base or any other characters dialed in. (At least, not to my knowledge).
I also ran into the issue of the strange lines forming across her skin if not enough time was given to render. But they go away quite nicely in the long run. (I was using two spotlights and the basic daz setting environment IBL at about .2).
@Gogger Neat idea on using the glowing eye materials to help them stand out a bit. I might have to give that a try sometime. :-)
I've got another render I plan to test later tonight that uses a mix of dial-spun characters and 200 Plus Face Morphs to give Cinder a bit of a more stylised look. I'll see how that goes and then post it once it's finished.
@SBibb Those are very nice renders. Happy to have helped. That skin thing is very strange. I'm kind of glad it wasn't just me and my lights. As you say, it clears up given enough render time. Just weird because I've never seen that happen before.
@Knittingmommy Thanks. :-) I'm wondering if the skin issue might be related to the top coat settings, but I haven't had a chance to do any experimentation with it. I usually don't use top coat, but I noticed that Cinder has those settings in use. It's something I want to look into later.
In the meantime, I had a chance to do a full render and postwork with Cinder, this time using a bunch of dial-spinning to stylize her. No Kanade base, but Cinder is at 100% and I have several other characters in the mix. I also used 200 Plus Face Morphs for further adjustments, including turning off the parameter lock on the mouth adjustments to further stylize it.
If all goes well, I'll also do a full body variation.
Long story short, it looks like Cinder works really well for creating a variety of characters. :-)
@SBibb I love this one! She looks fantastic. I haven't had a chance to do that, but after seeing your results, I'll have to go in and mix more and see what I can do with the 200 morphs product. I also have RareStone's morphs for G8 Female so those are an option, too. I think very glad I got Cinder even before I broke down and bought Kanade 8. I think she might be the most versatile starting character who has been released in a while.
I got Cinder and didn't have any weird rectangular render artifacts when I rendered her but I was using the Ultra Genesis HDRI and the BOSS lights. I made my own dial-spun character that was close to Kanade and dialed Cinder at 100%. (Should've asked how much of the base character was actually used. Oh well.) The Tasha 8 fibermesh eyebrows are kind of close to Cinder's eyebrows. Glad I picked her up.
@MimicMolly Cinder was dialed in at 100%, both head and body. Kanade was also dialed in at 100%, both head and body, on Cinder out of the box.
She's cute! I like what you did with her. :)
@ALLIEKATBLUE Thank you! I'm glad you like it. I wasn't sure how well the dial-spinning would come out, but I was pleased with the results. I definitely want to do more renders with her, and I think I'm going to try working more with that kind of lighting in the future, too. :-)
@Knittingmommy Thanks! :-D I definitely have had some good results with 200 Plus Face Morphs. I don't have Rarestone's morphs, so I don't know how well that will do, but it looks like it should have some nice options. I'm really happy with Cinder as a starting character, too. I've alreay been able to use her in smaller degrees with a couple other characters, and I'm looking forward to seeing what else I can do.
Also looks like her skin works well with G8 males if you want the more gothic eyes look. I took a shot at 200 Plus Face morphs and Genesis 8 Male Body Morphs to create a male counterpart with her makeup, and while it's not the best, I'm still pretty happy with it. I used the female variation to also dial the Cinder dial-spin to a more childlike version. I'll see if I can post her and the full-body shot of the earlier image when I get the chance. :-)
@MimicMolly Very nice render. She turned out great! Out of curiousity, which outfit are you using? :-)
@SBibb The outfit is from several pieces with the Mec4d PBS Vol. 2 cloth shaders applied to them. I had used some of AllenArt's shaders but it was mostly for the lace.
"Classic Top" https://www.daz3d.com/dforce-loincloth-collection-for-genesis-8-females
Pants and Belt https://www.daz3d.com/dforce-panthera-outfit-for-genesis-8-females
Jacket https://www.daz3d.com/dforce-femme-fatale-dress-for-genesis-3-and-8-females
Choker https://www.daz3d.com/dforce-seven-seas-outfit-for-genesis-8-females
I don't have Cinder...But, I would think that a combo of Aiko and Karyssa would get you very close to a Kanade shape. Also, Ayako from the Lolita Kimono bundle has a bit of a Kanade vibe going on. Even Tika would probably work or many of the Asian teen characters.
I don't have Karyssa, Ayako, or Tika. So I used Josie (75%) and Aiko (55%) in this render. No facial expression and lighter eyes, so we could get a better look at her face. This time I also got those rectangular artifacts, but it seems that the Cinder shape will look great with any of the cute toony stylized G8Fs.
EDIT: I think I realized what the problem is with the artifacts. Likely the reason I've not been getting them until now is because I've been using brighter lights and HDRIs. This light is bright at the top and darker at the bottom, and why the rectangles are on her stomach and not on her face. Pretty weird.
@MimicMolly Nice job pieceing together the outfit from several products. :-D
It very well could be the darker lighting that's causing them. I was using darker lighting when I noticed them, as well.
Seems like Cinder works well with serveral characters, so those are good to know about, too.
*
In the meantime, sorry for the delay in posting the full-body of Cinder with the dial-spinning morphs I used earlier. I didn't do any postwork except to lighten the image so her shape would be more visible.
I later did another full-body of her with postwork, but this gives you an idea of how front of the body looks with adjustments.
I also tried doing a bit more tweaks with 200 Plus Face Morphs and the Genesis 8 Female Body Morphs to make a child version of her.
And here I applied Carmelita's Skin and Maps to her in a very short render (while keeping the previous shapes).
Needless to say, I really like the Cinder base. I think it has potential to be really versatile. :-)