Why Poser? (serious question from a DAZ Studio user)

13»

Comments

  • marblemarble Posts: 6,546
    edited December 1969

    Kerya said:
    I did the jump from P8 to PP2012 because of 64bit ... more RAM!!!
    After having crashes with a simple portrait and IDL in P8 and having to do it in area renders I wanted 64bit.

    Ahh, the crashing again. But again, a valid point: Poser 10 is only 32 bit, right? I'm not too worried about 64 bit rendering because I have Reality (for both DS and Poser). But the app itself is only 32 bit, I believe. Does that make a big difference?

  • WandWWandW Posts: 2,497
    edited March 2014

    I was referring to the Copy Morphs utility which is new to PP2012, not the Morph Brush.

    V4WM is Poser 9 and up only. She and the Outfitter utility to weight map clothing are free at RDNA...

    Link removed by mod

    Post edited by frank0314 on
  • KeryaKerya Posts: 10,700
    edited March 2014

    Morphing clothes is this piece of nifty software
    link removed

    V4WM is a Poser weightmapped version of V4
    I know of two free ones:
    http://www.renderforever.com/
    http://www.runtimedna.com/WMV4.html

    Post edited by Chohole on
  • KeryaKerya Posts: 10,700
    edited December 1969

    Crossposting is fun ... WandW was faster, but I have more links - are we even?
    ;)

  • marblemarble Posts: 6,546
    edited March 2014

    WandW said:
    I was referring to the Copy Morphs utility which is new to PP2012, not the Morph Brush.

    V4WM is Poser 9 and up only. She and the Outfitter utility to weight map clothing are free at RDNA...

    link removed

    Oh boy - another utility I had missed. Yes, that's like the Morph Transfer utility in DS right? Sadly only available in the Pro 2014 version. Again, making clothes fit is an expensive business, it seems. Just when I was thinking that P10 might be ok.

    I'm reading about V4 WM now :)

    Post edited by Chohole on
  • marblemarble Posts: 6,546
    edited March 2014

    OK - SM put P10 on sale too and also reduced the upgrade price so I went ahead and bought it. Now to try it but I'd bet there are some things I will do in DS and others - as discussed above - I hope to use Poser for.

    Post edited by marble on
  • Lissa_xyzLissa_xyz Posts: 6,107
    edited March 2014

    Why are all these links getting removed? I can possibly see Morphing Clothes since it's a paid product, but V4WM (which requires V4 anyways) and Outfitter are both free (and require Poser as DS can't use them, so they don't directly compete with an existing DS product), so why remove those? o_O

    Post edited by Lissa_xyz on
  • justThornejustThorne Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Hi. I'm getting back into the 3D character world after a few years away. I fooled around with Poser a lot during versions 1, 2, and 3, and then got into DAZ for a while about three years ago. Now I'm back in DAZ, and have found this thread very useful, but it omits one subject of comparison almost completely.

    That is, as a quite experienced amateur animator, I find the DAZ timeline and tools very crude, so I've been wondering how Poser fares by comparison? Does it have more traditional/versatile keyframing and interface?

    (As a side note, I'm already quite comfortable with AniMate from my work three years ago, though it still has annoying bugs and irregularities that drive me nuts, so neither AniMate nor DAZ's own timeline features are really doing the job for me.)

  • WandWWandW Posts: 2,497
    edited December 1969

    I just do simple animation, but here's some info on Poser 7's animation interface. Later versions add layers and groups, but I haven't used those features...

    http://my.smithmicro.com/tutorials/1705.html

  • justThornejustThorne Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks, that's very interesting. So to relate all that to this thread, DAZ Studio has one advantage by including AniMate, but if AniMate is inadequate or inappropriate for a user's needs, then Poser would definitely be worth the money, because THAT is a proper animation interface. (I.e., I'll struggle with AniMate a bit more, but I may be adding Poser to my budget soon/after March Madness is over.)

    How about posing the hip? Is that much more feasible in Poser? Do your "simple animations" butt up against DAZ's limitations in that regard? (pun only halfway intended)

  • WandWWandW Posts: 2,497
    edited December 1969

    I'm not sure quite what you mean about posing the hip; it can be posed like any other actor. Of course, if Inverse Kinematics is turned off for the legs it will of course translate or rotate the figure, but IK can be on to set things up, and turned off for the animation to actually run if needed.

    As an aside, Poser 10 is on sale for $70 through tomorrow, bundled with MIki4, Blackhearted's GND Tyler and a set of business clothing for the Poser 10 figures Roxie and Rex. It's only $65 at Amazon, but it doesn't include the extra stuff...

    http://my.smithmicro.com/marcom/eblasts/poser/20140314/index-web.html

  • Consumer573Consumer573 Posts: 274
    edited April 2014

    Vaskania said:
    Kerya said:
    Vaskania said:
    If I could bring 1 thing into Poser from DS it would be the visual component of working with cameras. I hate Poser's little DOF crosshair thing. Sure I do photog stuff irl, but having a visible plane for dof and such in DS is so handy.
    ...

    http://www.runtimedna.com/Advanced-Lights-and-Camera-Guides.html


    Holy crap you really are the queen of links. I should've known it'd be one of Semidieu's, and I have no idea why I haven't seen this sooner!

    Into the wishlist, thank you!

    I like Poser, most probably because it is what I started with. I also like Carrara, and if Carrara was more cutting edge had more popular support in the Poser figures communities I would probably use that more.

    "HATE THE DOF CROSS HAIRS"
    I almost laughed out loud when I saw Vaskania's ' Holy Crap' response. I also find Poser's DOF (Depth of Field) Cross-hairs to be limiting and frustrating, so the Advanced lights will go into my wishlist, too. Thanks so much for the link. I didn't realize that someone had a work-around.

    POSER HAS LONG HAD A DEPTH OF FIELD 'FOG' PREVIEW; WHY DID THEY NEVER LET YOU RENDER THAT?
    In a related depth of field issue, I've often wondered, Poser has a preview screen that easily shows a depth of field with w 'fog' like view, and yet if you want to render any images with fog you have to resort to props and tricks that are resource intensive. Why didn't they ever capitalize on that preview screen so you could do a simulated fog render with it?? That would have been cool.

    Post edited by Consumer573 on
  • Consumer573Consumer573 Posts: 274
    edited April 2014

    Poser 9 is worth the $29.95 that I spent. :) I use it for rendering old skin textures. Some generation 3 textures don't look good in Daz Studio. Plus, I can load some light sets from the Dream House series in Poser. The lights in some sets and vehicles only work in Poser, not Daz Studio 3 and above.

    sorry I can't answer any of your other questions. I just bought Poser 9 a few months ago when it was on sale.

    um, that is all I can think of now.

    edit:

    The main reason that I use older generation figures is that they use less memory than Genesis 1 and 2 and their clothes. I use 32 bit windows. Please, no lectures about me upgrading my computer. lol

    Poser has a hair room. I can create body, armpit and chest hair.

    I can play with Alyson, Jessie, James, Kate, Ben and Simon in Poser.

    FYI to whom it concerns. In Forums here and, I think RDNA, I was looking to build a new computer because I was using win XP 32 bit and I had come across a phrase from a Poser user, "If it takes more than 15 minutes for me to do a render I generally move on." Well, my renders were taking hours and I was at a point that I was even doing them overnight.

    So I started a couple of threads aimed at research and looking to build or purchase a speedy graphics computer.

    What I found, interestingly enough, was that I followed a suggestion by one of the respondents in my threads to look at used computers. What he said made some sense; that companies using graphics need the latest tools to be productive, and during their three year life times the machines tend to be well maintained by an IT department. I didn't buy specifically what he suggested, but it set me on a path of research.

    I have now twice successfully found and helped purchase Dell Computers - powerful server type computers that run the multi core hyper threading Xeon Chips - that came loaded with Windows 7 and are coming off three year leases, for about $400.

    The hardest part was in researching what I wanted in a machine, having the desired Intel chip comparisons as a short-cut to my desktop, reviewing the Dell website to make sure the specific computer I was looking at was designed to work with Win7 and not Vista, etc., and then regularly checking the auction site until I found one in my price range. It sounds like a mouthful, but it worked.

    In the past I NEVER would have considered a used computer. But now it may be an alternative way to go.

    In using PPRo2014 on WIn 7 the result is that renders in P7 that might have taken overnight or been kicked out for using too much memory get done in about five minutes.

    Wouldn't mind if this comment stays buried here in this thread for a bit, as I have another friend looking for a new computer.....

    Post edited by Consumer573 on
  • Blackbirdx61Blackbirdx61 Posts: 294
    edited December 1969

    If I may, I have a couple Questions that I think dovetail with the OP?

    I own Poser Debut; but have not used it since the day I bought it; is Debut a significantly nerfed version of Poser?

    If I fire up Poser now, will it mangle my DAZ content directories?

    Almost all my content library is V4 so Im thinking there are something's it might make sense to try in Poser;
    but I really don't want it to wack my DAZ content.

  • WandWWandW Posts: 2,497
    edited May 2014

    Poser Debut was recently updated to be based on Poser 10; the update can be gotten here; it's actually the Smith Micro Download Manager, which, if you put in your Poser Debut Serial Number, will download the latest version.

    http://poser.smithmicro.com/debut-updates.html

    The biggest drawback to the original Poser Debut is it is without the Face, Cloth, Hair, Set-up and Content room and material settings and render options were limited. Also, running Python scripts was disabled, but you could call them from a Pose file to get around it. I haven't played with the latest update.

    Poser, Debut or otherwise, won't harm your Studio libraries; just add the folder containing the Runtime folder to the Poser Library as an external Runtime

    Post edited by WandW on
  • Blackbirdx61Blackbirdx61 Posts: 294
    edited December 1969

    Thanyou much for your help BB.

  • Kerya said:

    Crossposting is fun ... WandW was faster, but I have more links - are we even?
    ;)

    More links is good feel free to message to me :) LOL

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,416

    For what its worth , I use Carrara as my software but own latest Poser.

    I mainly use Poser because I use Crossdresser to fit clothing from different figures and I need to adjust the weight maps most of the time.

    I also use Poser to inject morphs from a donor figure to the cross dresser clothing.

    I used the fitting room a lot initially and it does have it's uses but I wasnt patient enough to solve the fitting problems at the legs with dresses

    With the advent of VWD's cloth sim that works in Poser and Carrara and soon for Studio  I cant really see myself buying another version of Poser though.

     

     

  • LimbaLimba Posts: 51

    I use mostly DAZ for creating wallpapers and Poser with Unity (Training and testing). I also have DAZ gamedev indie license so both initially cost me about same amount.

    I like morph tool in new Poser. It's pretty easy to use and can do many things without using other 3D software (Trying to do new character from Pauline). In DAZ the morph tool was limited or I didn't know how to use it.

    Working with Unity: With Pauline I need to check do I have to export face expression as one frame animations or do I need script for face rig. With Genesis 3 needed to add support scripts for bone twist in mecanim. No other problems found in animation.

    DAZ have better export tool. When exporting from Poser you need to combine skeleton from clothes to figure in Unity or other software. I also need use animation or scripts to combine and set morph values. Because of FBX or exporter limitation I need to create PBR material converting/exporting script or search needed textures.

    For DAZ Connect: I did't like it in this way because I need to keep DAZ Orginals and PA models in different library. Maybe if they can improve it like that I can select that I only use DAZ Orginal models and it prevent to use others (I think this is not easy task). Also models need to be available to export to game engine if you have license.

    So both have good and bad features. At this point for lazy gamedev DAZ does have more models and clothes to use.

    Now looking DAZ orignal character and trying to think ideas for games.

    Also this is still my hobby.

    I hope this was litle help if someone want to use DAZ or Poser in gamedev.

  • MasterstrokeMasterstroke Posts: 1,288

    I love the morph brush and the dependency editor in Poser. I am more used to the Poser UI in general. So I "kind of" prefer Poser. Recentley DAZ did something right and SM did something wrong. DAZ introduced IRAY and Genesis3. A cool render engine and a Figure that needs minimum post work when posed into position. The latest Poser release was a shocker. Superfly is not much of an advantage of Firefly. It doesn't look better, but takes longer. The new figures are just bad. The mesh looks bad, the bending is bad and the shape is bad. No attempt to improve the rigging system.

    There are 3 figures to be released, where I as a Poser user put all my hopes on: http://ambientshade.tumblr.com/  ; http://www.mankahoo.com/index.php ; and projectE. Untill then, I don't see any reason to go on using Poser.

    So I'll stay with DS 4.08. I don't like to upgrade to 4.09 yet, for I don't trust it and my hard drive is full anyway. I'd like to buy a new computer then, we'll see. Maybe I wait to jump right onto DS 5.00 when the time has come.

  • KitsumoKitsumo Posts: 1,128

    In response to the OP, I just started using DS about 2 months ago.  I used Poser since 2005 or so, and tried DS a few times over the years but could never get the hang of it.  I could never figure out the whack-a-doodle lighting system Daz uses, but when DS added IRAY, I found it was pretty much the same as mesh lighs in Poser/Reality.  Anyway, the main benefit of Poser is the dynamic cloth.  Yes, vendors sell dynamic cloth for Poser, but with a simple Youtube tutorial you can figure out how to turn pretty much anything into cloth.  Not just clothes, anything.  I've spent hours watching cloth cars and buildings fall apart in Poser.  Useless, I know, but fun.  The next is the material room.  Hands down better than Daz.  If you haven't seen it, look for some Youtube videos.  Poser physics plugin (not a part of the program, I realize) offers rigid body and ragdoll physics, something you don't have the option for on DS.  Poser cameras make more sense to me, but that may just be personal preference.  Poser crashes often (for me), DS has only crashed when I did something stupid with the camera using Iray preview.

    Now for the downside (here we go):  Poser file formats don't seem too stable.  I can save a scene, close Poser, come back later and reopen it and it will be corrupted (models not loading correctly mostly).  Poser's content organization is a dog's breakfast (a complete mess).  DS is much better but still not perfect.  I know most serious users will come up with their own system, but with DS at least you have a head start.  Memory management.  With Poser/Reality, the most I can render is 2 Genesis characters and a simple background before my GTX 770 4gb runs out of memory.  With DS/Iray, I can render 3 or 4 Genesis figures with a background.  You know how in DS you can select any random object and duplicate it?  Not with Poser.  Select several objects and edit/move them all at once?  No.  Edit multiple textures at once?  No.

    As far as renderers, I've had similar results with both, but DS/Iray is easier to set up.  With Poser/Reality you can use either major brand card in as many computers as you can connect to each other.  With DS/Iray it's all Nvidia and no network, so you're limited to how many cards you can fit in one box.  For rendering speed, they seemed about the same with the same hardware for me.  My advice is if you can get the previous version of Poser Pro on sale, it's worth trying.  I love Poser, but DS is a much more finished product in my opinion.  P.S. I'm using Poser Pro 2012 so some of my info may be out of date.

  • HI

    I've used Poser since version 3, at present I have both Poser 11, and Poser Pro 2014 installed.

    I also have Daz studio installed and for about the 5 time over the years I'm trying to learn to use it, there were some things that I liked about it the last time I used it, like the animating walks by dragging the animations into the scene.

    But for me the interface is a lot less familiar to use.

    Poser is very complicated at first glance, but a lot of the advanced options can be ignored by the new user and you can be creating and animating characteres in no time.

    Plus you can have pretty much every option right in front of you, on the screen, all the movements, light options, camera adjustments etc, character morphs what have you are just a click away.  It always seems like I'm looking for things in DAZ.

    One thing that makes Poser worth the money is that a lot of content comes with it, many characters, clothes, Props, light sets, and the lip sync utility which I use a lot works pretty well and is very easy.

    Just select the audio file, and a document with the text, select the character and press the button and your character is talking.

    Animation is quite easy to do as well and very complete, every joint right down to the fingers is completley controlable.

    Rendering is reasoanble fast, but I'm an animator, I don't want to spend hours and hours animating my clips.

    So I do them in Preview mode at a high resolution i.e. 1920 by 1080, sometimes larger, the finished video is very sharp and clear and I can animate a clip 1000 frames long it a matter of minutes not hours, when the video is reduced in size for the the computer, there is very little difference in the quality of the image you get from one that is renderd in Firefly that would take many hours.

    I've actually posted images side by side and people have a hard time telling which is which.

    I'm talking multiple frames renderd per second not multiple minutes per frame.

    And the advantage is that you get exactly what you see on the screen, get your preview right and the whole film will look just like that.

    I'm going to work with DAZ and see what I can do, but I'm not sure that I can get the same kind of results in the same kind of time frame.

    If anyone is interested animating in Poser make sure that you take the time to learn how the Animation Pallet works, one you have a handle on that the rest just falls into place.

     

Sign In or Register to comment.