Is this rig good for Daz Studio ? and any recommendations.
daveso
Posts: 7,838
I have secured financing form Cyberpower .... this rig I can maybe afford ... $1600 over a fairly long period which would also stop any future DS content until its paid off ...
If anything can be changed for better but remaining at or less in price, please state. thanks
*BASE_PRICE:[+1275] I upgrsaded ram from 16>32gig and the GPU from 1660 to RTX 2070
CASE:Cooler Master MasterBox 5t Mid-Tower Gaming Case w/ Tempered Glass Window Panel
**** CPU:AMD Ryzen 7 2700X 3.7GHz [4.3GHz Turbo] Eight-Core 20MB Cache 105W Processor
CS_FAN:Default case fans
FAN:Corsair Hydro Series H60 120mm Liquid CPU Cooling System w/ Copper Cold Plate (Single Standard 120MM Fan)
**** HDD:240GB WD Green SSD + 2TB SATA III Hard Drive Combo (Combo Drive)
KEYBOARD:CyberPowerPC RGB 7 Color Premium Gaming Keyboard
***** MEMORY:32GB (8GBx4) DDR4/3000MHz Dual Channel Memory [+120] (ADATA XPG Z1)
MOTHERBOARD:MSI X470 GAMING PLUS AM4 ATX w/ RGB, USB 3.1, Gbt LAN, 3 PCIe x16, 3 PCIe x1, 6 SATA3, 2 M.2 SATA/PCIe
MOUSE:CyberPowerPC Standard 4000 DPI with Weight System Optical Gaming Mouse
NETWORK:Onboard Gigabit LAN Network
OS:Windows 10 Home (64-bit Edition)
POWERSUPPLY:600 Watts - Standard 600Watts 80 Plus Gold high-efficient Power Supply
SOUND:HIGH DEFINITION ON-BOARD 7.1 AUDIO VIDEO:
**** GeForce® RTX 2070 8GB GDDR6 (Turing) [VR Ready] [+231] (Single Card) _
PRICE:(+1626)
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Comments
I'd maybe try to get a bigger SSD instead of the 32GB, and take "only" 16 GB.
Memory is one of the easiest components to upgrade in the future, but for now, 32GB is overkill for most games and it's also overkill for DAZ, which benefits more from those 8GB on the videocard than it does from even 16GB of RAM.
On the other hand, you'll find your primary bootdisk, which your SSD is, to fill up rapidly. Windows takes a nice chunk out of it, but so will bad software writing stuff to C:/ by default, and there's still a lot of that going round.
Me, I would keep the SSD AND the 32 gig ram. You'll thank yourself for all that ram down the road, and hard drives are cheap.
One can get a 2gb external USB3 hd now for less than a hundred bucks. I'd rather have the ram. If you're able, cannibalize the drives from your old computer to the new. I'm sure it'll fit a few inside. That way you won't fill up the C drive so fast. But the 32 gigs of ram you are gonna NEED.
All else looks fine to me. Ya might want more than 8 gigs of vram, but I know it's probably a chunk of money between a 2070 and 2080, so work with what ya got there ;).
Laurie
its a $880 jump to the 2080 Ti ... to get 11 gig VRAM ..otherwise all of the 2080 cards have 8gig ... and are still $500 + more, although it cost me $300 more for the 2070. I've never had an SSD , so if I have to use the regualr HD, it won;t be much different for me ... but, yeah, I can up the SSD to 512 and also the HD to 3tb for $65. I'm so far out of my buying power now it probably doesn;t matter another $65 :) comes to $100 a month or so.
Yeah, 880 bucks for 3 more gigs of ram is just....ridiculous ;). Spring for the bigger drives....gonna cost ya a lot less than 16 more gigs of ram would and you are gonna need all that ram. DS isn't the only thing on your computer I'm sure ;). 16 is about the bare minimum anymore, unless you're running nothing but office programs and a browser.
Laurie
yeah .. i have Vue, Poser, Paint Shop Pro, Carrara, Hex, Bryce and a lot of music software..plus some games, etc etc etc. most are older though, so not as system needy as the new stuff
32GB on an SSD seems pretty small. When I bought my computer from Cyberpower, there was a special, that included a 512GB SSD from Intel. That's my C-Drive on The Beast, and I'm using 109GB of it. That's while storing as much data as possible on the other drives. (The C-Drive Downloads folder, for example, has a one item, a shortcut to the Downloads on my E-Drive!)
When I was looking for a new computer, I was looking at getting an 800W power supply, and both Charlie Judge and @InaneGlory suggested I spend a bit more and get a more robust Power Supply. (That conversation is here.) I was planning on adding a second GPU at some point. Still am. Maybe an RTX, though, instead of a matching GTX.
Anyway, I wouldn't go with less RAM. Maybe forego the SSD for more power. But all in all, sounds like a nice rig for the money.
I dunno where you folks are getting a 32GB SSD...the SSD he has listed above is 240GB ;). The system RAM is 32GB LOL.
Laurie
LOL
Okay. That makes a lot more sense to me. Still "small," but usable! (Read 32GB in a response post—which I didn't agree with—and wanted to post quickly. Ya' never know when daveso is going to hit that Buy Now button!)
Nice. If you can swing it, upgrade the SSD. An SSD is amazing. I would not recomend a "hybrid" drive (SSD cache on a large spinny drive). Those things die like flies. Seperate drives are the way to go.
You'll be very happy with this system.
My recommendation would normally be to wait a few days before you pull the trigger. We are seeing some interesting price drops now, but we may see even better deals after the AMD Computex keynote on Monday ((10 AM Taipei Taiwan time, Sunday night for you Western Hemisphere Types). They will be announcing their 7nm Ryzen lineup, and motherboard makers will be showcasing their X570 motherboards. I suspect that the X570 boards will become available in mid-June, with the 3xxx series Ryzen Matisse CPUs becoming available in July.
I'm not necessarily suggesting waiting on the new chips, although it'd be nice to see independent benchmarks on the new chips. But that should spur better deals on the current gen hardware. I recently saw mention of a Ryzen 7 2700 (non X) on sale for less than $200.
https://wccftech.com/amd-ryzen-cpu-and-radeon-rx-gpu-deals-8-core-2700-200-usd-6-core-2600-140-usd/
That being said, that 'rumored' 16 core chip Ryzen AM4 chip looks really sweet. It probably won't be cheap though, although it will very likely be less than $1000 US, possibly as low as $600 US. It might not be available right out of the gate though/may be a few months off still. Again, we'll know more when Lisa Su and the gang do their Keynote presentation at Computex.
But, since you are taking advantage of the CyberpowerPC Memorial day sale...Well I understand your desire to get moving on this. Just needed to mention what's going on in AMD land. Nvidia will likely be announcing a few refresh cards as Computex as well, or maybe at E3, which is June 11-13th...
Anyways, going over your choices, the 8 GB 2070 is a good choice, so I understand why you end up picking it over the 1660 Ti. Once we get RTX support in the 'non-beta' version of Daz Studio that'll be nice. You may need to use the Beta software for that card currently. There's a separate thread elsewhere on this forum about the current stability, new features, and such with the beta Studio software.
The amount of VRAM is a primary consideration, with render speed being a close second. I was able to fill up the ram on the 8 GB card fairly regularly, but usually could find ways to shoehorn my scenes into said 8 GB. It was actualy 6.4 GB after the 18% Windows 10 VRAM tax, but I digress... This is why I eventually upgraded to a 1080 Ti though. 6 GB would have been a bit more limiting, so you won't regret that 'upgrade' to 8 GB of VRAM.
The jump from 16 GB to 32 GB with Daz Studio is a significant one performance wise. More than 32 GB is often considered overkill, but I do think that 64 GB does help a bit more. So if you can bump your ram to 32 GB, that might be a good idea. Try to get DDR4 3200 CL14 if you can, but the 3000 clockpseed ram you picked isn't a bad choice, and is probably a bit cheaper.
R.E. that combo drive. I think you'll be happier with an NVME SSD, and a separate HDD. Not sure if that's actually a combo drive, it's most likely two separate drives. .
Looking at the Cyberpower configurator now. There's an 800W power supply with a discount on the list. It's a gold supply, so that's good. I'd suggest that one, so that you have wattage headroom to add a second GPU later. As for the drive, there's a 240 GB Corsair NVME drive for $9 add'l, with a 1TB HDD included in price. I'm looking here btw:
https://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Memorial-Special-II
With the 'default' choices, but with a 2700X, the 800W PS, the 240GB Corsair NVME and the 'generic' 2 TB 7200 RPM HDD and the 'basic' RTX 2070, my configurator is showing $1643 for me. It's a bit more than with your choices, but has the 800W power supply.
The NVME drive will give you faster boots, and faster access to the files on the NVME drive. It's a small thing, but it's worth the $9 add'l I mentioned. The 2 TB HDD drive adds +66 to the price. Keep in mind that you may be able to find a good deal on a 2 TB drive at your local Best Buy, on Amazon or something... it's pretty easy to install a HDD at a later date if you wanted to delete that from your choices for now, but $66 is about par for the course for a 2 TB 7200 RPM drive.
By having the HDD as a separate drive, this allows you to to put all of your 'My Library' and 'My Daz 3D Library' files on the HDD. This will make it easier to transplant your Daz install to a new system down the road. Also, if the 'C' drive ever fails or gets corrupted, say with an out of control Windows update that disrupts your Daz install and 'deletes' your documents folder, well your 'D' drive should remain unaffected. Someone recently had exactly that happen with an automatic Windows update. Fortunately, he was able to find a temp folder where the Windows installer moved all of his Daz files, but that was several days of hell for that person. Food for thought.
Daz Studio loves multiple GPUs, so keeping your options open for a second graphics card later (doesn't really matter what card it is) is a good plan. Even if you got a cheap AMD or Nvidia card, you could use the cheap card to drive your monitor, leaving the 2070 completely free to render. This will help your system responsiveness while a render is baking. Of course, if you plan to do serious gaming on this system, yeah then you'll probably want the 2070 driving your monitor. But that's food for thought for later. Mainly, I'm just illustrating why a larger power supply might be a good idea.
You could also swap out the 2700X for a 2400G and use the Ryzen integrated graphics to do the same thing, but you'll lose four cores in the process. I'm happy with that choice, but I only had 1 PCie slot to work with. IMHO the extra four cores (2700X) should help with responsiveness in Daz Studio, particularly when compiling a scene for the graphics card memory when beginning a render.
I wouldn't. You will outgrow this in six months.
Does 'Combo Drive' have a technical meaning here? Sounds like the SSD and HDD are in the same device!
If that's the case then it might be cheaper to get seperate drives. Even if it's not cheaper you get many more options with seperate drives. Get a simple HDD and have the SSD in M.2 format. For example the much, much faster Intel 760p NVMe. NVME is worth getting as mentioned by others earlier.
On the specified motherboard, NVMe will disable that last x16 slot, which may be a problem if you want to put in a third GPU.
I have a combo drive in my system (Also a WD, though different model) as content drive, and it's giving me better loading times for things I use regularly, compared to my second content drive, which is a regular HDD of same speed. But when you use a lot of different items all the time, that speed advantage goes away very fast.
Looks like this will be a nice system for you. I'll second the suggestion for looking at installing the drives from your old machine into the new one if they are of a reasonable size (though I would run the new machine through its paces for a few days first to make sure everything is ok).
My system originally had the 980ti with 6GB GRAM and I managed fine with it for a couple of years. Now that I've added the 1080ti, I still try to fit scenes into the 6GB memory of the 980ti just for the extra rendering speed. With that in mind, you shouldn't have much trouble fitting renders into the 2080 card - you just sometimes have to be imaginitive in how you render scenes, or use something like scene optimiser.
The only minor suggestion I would have is, do you have the opportunity to go for Windows 10 Pro? Not sure of the cost difference or if it's possible in the order time you have, but it can be useful in giving more control over when Windows 10 installs its updates.
Anyway, please post back here once you've run the new machine through a few renders and let us all know how it compares to your old machine.
Re the SSD - I'm building a new machine now and it'll have an M.2 as the main C drive + 3 SSDs (I've abandoned HDDs altogether). M.2s are around 5-6 times faster than SSDs and the prices aren't that bad. (My Samsung 970 Evo 250Gb M.2 was about 75 euros). I'm curious to see what my boot time is with the M.2. Right now, with an SSD it's around 14 seconds, but I expect that to drop.
Of course, it all depends on whether the motherboard supports M.2 or not, but most new ones do. Oh, and if you still use win 7 (like I do), you have to slipstream the NVMe drivers to get Windows to recognise it. But hey, that's part of the fun with a new machine. LOL.
Edit - Just re-read the OP and that mobo does support M.2
As an aside: After some research I found WD do make something called a 'Dual Drive'. It installs with only the SSD accessable and after you install windows you run the WD software to activate the included HDD as second drive.
They've been selling these for some time but it's new to me.
I have 64GB of RAM; I have never used above 50GB as far as I can recall. I fairly often go above 32GB but not usually for long periods of time, but every day I go above 16 often getting to around 32GB. I don't game really; I have, and used to be an Everquest 1 player, but am only a very casual player games-wise; generally any system great for rendering will manage gaming very well too.
I'm tempted to say get a propper SSD; 500GB for your C drive, or if that is too much, a 256; get a 2TB mechanical for storage - or larger.
I use a 500GB for C and a 2TB SSD for storage, with backups (done daily) to mechanicals; I also archive rarely used items. M.2 SSDs are much lower in price than they used to be, but SATA SSDs are cheaper still. Your system will be more responsibe. Too much RAM is potentially a waste of cash; not enough is frustrating. Paging to Disk slows a system down, even when its an SSD (they are far slower than RAM).
You might consider doing a little more checking, and look at the memorial day sales. These are the "Early" weekend sales. They might have additional ones on Monday. For something like Daz, you could consider going down a notch or two on the CPU. Here is a pretty closely comperable cyberpower system, 32 gb ram, 480 gb SSD, 3 TB hard drive (seperate), same GPU, price is $1522.00.
thanks everyone for responses... a lot to think about. I was wondering myself about the combo drive.
This baby is already a bit higher than I can afford without pinching pennies a bit on other stuff, but doable, the point being I'm not really in position to go above where I'm already at ... maybe a little bit.
Yeah ..using CPU render now on a system that is 2014 or so vintage, anything from 2016 on would be like night and day ... i could buy something for $800 and be in heaven
well, turned into a no buy..checked my system, out of stock.
will use the commments here to help with next rig. It will be awhile before it happens though.
Shame that you missed out this time, but you can use the extra time to have a few options for what you want and next time know exactly what to go for right at the start of the sale. Also, the same money will get you a better machine in the future.
Dual drives aren't hyrbid drives. Dual drives are twio drives in one package. I'd avoid them they sound pretty sketchy.
Hybrid drives are primarily HDD's with a small amount of persistent solid state storage, effectively an SSD, that acts as a cache for the HDD. The idea is it speeds up the HDD when accessing frequently used files. If the ration between the solid state storage and the HDD is reasonable it does work that way.
Cyberpower PC has sales pretty regularly, and of course there are other places to check, such as Amazon and Newegg.
AMD's 7nm processors and associated chipsets are looking quite good at the moment, and are due to hit retail channels around 7/7/2019. At that time, there will probably be some pretty sweet deals on the current hardware. Definitely pay attention to the E3 News Coverage on June 11th-13th to get a good idea of what's coming down the pike.
There's already a lot of buzz from the Computex keynotes and showroom floor.
one thing I've learned is to save money on a system go back at least 1 generation .. maybe 2. :In my case I could go 2 without problem considering where I'm at now, but it all depends on the value/bang index. $1600 is about as high as I can afford. I will keep my eyes wide open :)
At $1600 if you are able to build a system yourself a Ryzen 5 1600 with either of a B350 or X370 motherboard is a good base for a computer.
I put this together pretty quickly and it comes in under your budget, slightly, with a 2080.
https://pcpartpicker.com/user/kbs666/saved/#view=3sh7TW
The link says permission denied.
But yes, if you wish you could go with something just like that and you'll probably be very happy. If you pick a motherboard that is compatible, you'll options to upgrade the Ryzen to the very latest ones that are releasing in a week.
Which means you will have a fantastic upgrade path should you wish to upgrade in a few years time. But the new Ryzens look freakin' amazing, and have great prices on top of that.
Seriously, just a wait a couple more weeks for this to go down. AMD will be releasing some very good stuff just days from now. Even if you don't buy one of these new parts, the previous gen models will be on great sales as they make room for new inventory.
This chart shows what motherboards are compatible. A X570 would be fantastic, you could get a 2nd gen Ryzen for it. However it does not work with the 1st gen Ryzen. Still, I think the X570 is a good choice as it is likely the most forward compatible of the bunch for the future. It will likely work with the Ryzen that gets launched in 2020, and possibly beyond, though AMD has not committed to that. Plus the X570 will have the brand new PCIe 4.0 spec, further future proofing itself, which is why I think it will be great. The A320 board is the only board that will not support the new Ryzen. Some other boards need BIOS updates provided by the manufacturer.
This compatibility is why I think AMD is a great choice. If you buy the right board you will have tons of options moving forward.
Oops, my bad. This should work.
https://pcpartpicker.com/user/kbs666/saved/#view=3sh7TW
It's been around $150 since it came out. i know there was supposed to a roughly $100 version come out but I've never seen it. Maybe you got it.
IMO it's the best case for the cost you can get with modern features like USB C. The 2 big fans move a lot of air through the whole case.