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Bra Morph..?

Melissa ConwayMelissa Conway Posts: 590
in The Commons

Lot of morph products out there for the female chest. Been searching but not finding a simple "she's wearing a bra under that shirt" type morph. Dforce clothing in particular seem to emphasize the figure's body shape. I know I could spend time and effort attempting to round things out, but hoping this already exists as a morph dial easy peasy? For G8 female. Thanks.

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Comments

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 108,227

    The base shape is wearing a bra - the Breasts Natural morph is without.

  • Melissa ConwayMelissa Conway Posts: 590

    Sorry, should have mentioned this is a purchased character. If the head and body were separate morphs, I'd definitely use the base body shape. tx

    Richard Haseltine said:

    The base shape is wearing a bra - the Breasts Natural morph is without.

     

  • AlmightyQUESTAlmightyQUEST Posts: 2,006
    Could removing limits (if they are on) and lowering the breasts natural morph below zero help with that? I imagine it is hit or miss on how well a particular body shape will take it though.
  • Melissa ConwayMelissa Conway Posts: 590

    I'll give that a try, thanks. I did end up tweaking it as best I could. Wish PAs would make "bra" morphs standard in all their characters.  

    AlmightyQUEST said:
    Could removing limits (if they are on) and lowering the breasts natural morph below zero help with that? I imagine it is hit or miss on how well a particular body shape will take it though.

     

  • fastbike1fastbike1 Posts: 4,078

    @Melissa Conway 

    Sorry, but I'm not quite understanding the issue. The "Breasts Natural" morphs (e.g. https://www.daz3d.com/genesis-8-female-body-morphs) work on all associated Genesis characters.

    Nipples can always be hidden and are usually that way by default.

  • FSMCDesignsFSMCDesigns Posts: 12,844

    Yeah, I am not following this either. What exactly are you trying to do?  What look are you trying to achieve?

    I am assuming you want the figure to look like they have a bra on and have support, correct? No matter the chatcater you are using, you can always use the DAZ (or 3rd party) breast morphs in addition to that and also if you just select each pectorial, you can pose each breast in various ways.

  • L'AdairL'Adair Posts: 9,479
    fastbike1 said:

    Sorry, but I'm not quite understanding the issue.

    FSMCDesigns said:

    Yeah, I am not following this either. What exactly are you trying to do?  What look are you trying to achieve?

    It's an issue that's probably more obvious to women, most of whom wouldn't be caught dead going braless in public once their "melons" start to shift downwards. Take Mrs. Chow for example. If she were a real woman, her breasts might look like that under her bathrobe or nightgown, or while bathing/showering, but when she dresses up in her classy Daytime Noir outfit—I guarantee you—she's not going braless!

    What Melissa wants, along with numerous other women in this hobby, is a morph to snug those babies up into a more realistic, corralled shape. As the artists for these characters create a wide variety of shapes and sizes of breasts, we'd dearly love for those artists to include a custom morph with each of the character/figures that emulates what the breast would look like if the character was wearing a bra. If Daz would do that for all the named figures, too, artists could rely on that morph for their characters based on any given female figure.

    I mean, seriously, would you really want to see your mother, (or grandmother,) walking around braless all of the time? Regardless of what she's wearing, or where she's wearing it?

  • AlmightyQUESTAlmightyQUEST Posts: 2,006
    The issue/confusion may be that "breasts natural" is designed to do the opposite of what they want, and based on the default G8F shape? So negative values may not work well with all characters.
  • FSMCDesignsFSMCDesigns Posts: 12,844
    L'Adair said:
    fastbike1 said:

    Sorry, but I'm not quite understanding the issue.

    FSMCDesigns said:

    Yeah, I am not following this either. What exactly are you trying to do?  What look are you trying to achieve?

    It's an issue that's probably more obvious to women, most of whom wouldn't be caught dead going braless in public once their "melons" start to shift downwards. Take Mrs. Chow for example. If she were a real woman, her breasts might look like that under her bathrobe or nightgown, or while bathing/showering, but when she dresses up in her classy Daytime Noir outfit—I guarantee you—she's not going braless!

    What Melissa wants, along with numerous other women in this hobby, is a morph to snug those babies up into a more realistic, corralled shape. As the artists for these characters create a wide variety of shapes and sizes of breasts, we'd dearly love for those artists to include a custom morph with each of the character/figures that emulates what the breast would look like if the character was wearing a bra. If Daz would do that for all the named figures, too, artists could rely on that morph for their characters based on any given female figure.

    I mean, seriously, would you really want to see your mother, (or grandmother,) walking around braless all of the time? Regardless of what she's wearing, or where she's wearing it?

    Thanks for the reply and the explanation.  I disagree with having a custom morph with each character though, that would be a ton of work for each PA and inconsistant. There are already plenty of breast morphs that will move the breast in any direction already including the default ones for each pectorial (see image).

    these 2 products can acheive the look you are going for easily

    https://www.daz3d.com/breast-utilities-for-genesis-8-female-s

    https://www.daz3d.com/breast-control-genesis-8-female-s

    breasts.jpg
    1730 x 914 - 628K
  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 108,227

    I think the issue is perhaps the older characters. The younder mostly are mdoelled as if wearing a bra, but the older characters (perhaps in response to complaints in the past about faces showing the effect of age on bodies that don't) often have at least a partially unsupported look. One fix might be to include either an in-bra shape for the figure or to model in bra (which makes life easier for the cases where clothes are worn) and have an MCM for Breasts Natural that would kick in only when both that shape and the character shape were set. Although I doubt such a thing will be added to existing characters you coudl make a feature request, along those lines or with some other suggestion, in the hope of influencing future releases.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 40,162

    You could maybe use attenuate in morphloader to isolate the pectorals for corrective morphs on a FBM

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 40,162

    Or XMorphs

  • L'AdairL'Adair Posts: 9,479
    FSMCDesigns said:
    L'Adair said:
    fastbike1 said:

    Sorry, but I'm not quite understanding the issue.

    FSMCDesigns said:

    Yeah, I am not following this either. What exactly are you trying to do?  What look are you trying to achieve?

    It's an issue that's probably more obvious to women, most of whom wouldn't be caught dead going braless in public once their "melons" start to shift downwards. Take Mrs. Chow for example. If she were a real woman, her breasts might look like that under her bathrobe or nightgown, or while bathing/showering, but when she dresses up in her classy Daytime Noir outfit—I guarantee you—she's not going braless!

    What Melissa wants, along with numerous other women in this hobby, is a morph to snug those babies up into a more realistic, corralled shape. As the artists for these characters create a wide variety of shapes and sizes of breasts, we'd dearly love for those artists to include a custom morph with each of the character/figures that emulates what the breast would look like if the character was wearing a bra. If Daz would do that for all the named figures, too, artists could rely on that morph for their characters based on any given female figure.

    I mean, seriously, would you really want to see your mother, (or grandmother,) walking around braless all of the time? Regardless of what she's wearing, or where she's wearing it?

    Thanks for the reply and the explanation.  I disagree with having a custom morph with each character though, that would be a ton of work for each PA and inconsistant. There are already plenty of breast morphs that will move the breast in any direction already including the default ones for each pectorial (see image).

    these 2 products can acheive the look you are going for easily

    https://www.daz3d.com/breast-utilities-for-genesis-8-female-s

    https://www.daz3d.com/breast-control-genesis-8-female-s

    I have Zev0's breast contol utilties for G2 through G8. I love his utilities, but they can only do so much. I remember wasting a lot of time, trying to get a decent shape to the breasts on Sydney, and I couldn't do it.

    The simplest solution is usually the easiest. I'll just have to stop buying females that I feel need a custom breast morph to use. (And I can spend my time creating my own morphs in Hexagon for the females I already own, like Sydney and Mrs. Chow, rather than fiddling with 3rd party morphs that try to work for all characters,).

  • Melissa ConwayMelissa Conway Posts: 590

    Thank you so much, L'Adair for stepping in with the perfect defense of my request!  

    L'Adair said:
    fastbike1 said:

    Sorry, but I'm not quite understanding the issue.

    FSMCDesigns said:

    Yeah, I am not following this either. What exactly are you trying to do?  What look are you trying to achieve?

    It's an issue that's probably more obvious to women, most of whom wouldn't be caught dead going braless in public once their "melons" start to shift downwards. Take Mrs. Chow for example. If she were a real woman, her breasts might look like that under her bathrobe or nightgown, or while bathing/showering, but when she dresses up in her classy Daytime Noir outfit—I guarantee you—she's not going braless!

    What Melissa wants, along with numerous other women in this hobby, is a morph to snug those babies up into a more realistic, corralled shape. As the artists for these characters create a wide variety of shapes and sizes of breasts, we'd dearly love for those artists to include a custom morph with each of the character/figures that emulates what the breast would look like if the character was wearing a bra. If Daz would do that for all the named figures, too, artists could rely on that morph for their characters based on any given female figure.

    I mean, seriously, would you really want to see your mother, (or grandmother,) walking around braless all of the time? Regardless of what she's wearing, or where she's wearing it?

     

  • Melissa ConwayMelissa Conway Posts: 590

    I have Zevo's Breast Control, too. It's mostly what I ended up using to fix the problem. It took a lot of experimentation to get a decent shape. For those who don't understand what the big problem is, my project involves creating teenage characters in real world settings. No high schooler in her right mind would go to class without a bra. Maybe it would help to imagine a male character with a similar problem - clothes only emphasize the shape of parts he would prefer to keep more modestly covered. 

    L'Adair said:
    FSMCDesigns said:
    L'Adair said:
    fastbike1 said:

     

    I have Zev0's breast contol utilties for G2 through G8. I love his utilities, but they can only do so much. I remember wasting a lot of time, trying to get a decent shape to the breasts on Sydney, and I couldn't do it.

    The simplest solution is usually the easiest. I'll just have to stop buying females that I feel need a custom breast morph to use. (And I can spend my time creating my own morphs in Hexagon for the females I already own, like Sydney and Mrs. Chow, rather than fiddling with 3rd party morphs that try to work for all characters,).

     

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 108,227
    edited March 2019
    Melissa Conway said:

    I have Zevo's Breast Control, too. It's mostly what I ended up using to fix the problem. It took a lot of experimentation to get a decent shape. For those who don't understand what the big problem is, my project involves creating teenage characters in real world settings. No high schooler in her right mind would go to class without a bra. Maybe it would help to imagine a male character with a similar problem - clothes only emphasize the shape of parts he would prefer to keep more modestly covered. 

    L'Adair said:
    FSMCDesigns said:
    L'Adair said:
    fastbike1 said:

     

    I have Zev0's breast contol utilties for G2 through G8. I love his utilities, but they can only do so much. I remember wasting a lot of time, trying to get a decent shape to the breasts on Sydney, and I couldn't do it.

    The simplest solution is usually the easiest. I'll just have to stop buying females that I feel need a custom breast morph to use. (And I can spend my time creating my own morphs in Hexagon for the females I already own, like Sydney and Mrs. Chow, rather than fiddling with 3rd party morphs that try to work for all characters,).

     

    For teens I satnd by my original answer - they are, at least the Daz ones, (intended to be) shaped as if wearing a bra by default.

    Post edited by Richard Haseltine on
  • Melissa ConwayMelissa Conway Posts: 590

    I'm not using the DAZ teens for this project, although that's very good to know! Thanks.

    Richard Haseltine said:
    Melissa Conway said:

     

     

    For teens I satnd by my original answer - they are, at least the Daz ones, (intended to be) shaped as if wearing a bra by default.

     

  • L'AdairL'Adair Posts: 9,479
    Melissa Conway said:

    I have Zevo's Breast Control, too. It's mostly what I ended up using to fix the problem. It took a lot of experimentation to get a decent shape. For those who don't understand what the big problem is, my project involves creating teenage characters in real world settings. No high schooler in her right mind would go to class without a bra. Maybe it would help to imagine a male character with a similar problem - clothes only emphasize the shape of parts he would prefer to keep more modestly covered.

    As a work around, you could start with one of the young/teen characters and change out the head shape. If you have several of the younger characters, you will also have a variety of body shapes for the cast of characters in your project without necessarily needing to use any of the body shape morphs.

    It's an easy solution, compared to "putting a bra" on Mrs. Chow! lol

  • Melissa ConwayMelissa Conway Posts: 590

    Wish I had realized this issue might crop up, but I've already completed dozens of renders and can't change characters now. But I'll know better next time! :) 

    L'Adair said:
    Melissa Conway said:

     

    As a work around, you could start with one of the young/teen characters and change out the head shape. If you have several of the younger characters, you will also have a variety of body shapes for the cast of characters in your project without necessarily needing to use any of the body shape morphs.

    It's an easy solution, compared to "putting a bra" on Mrs. Chow! lol

     

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 108,227

    Does adjusting the pectoral bones help?

  • MazhMazh Posts: 498
    edited April 2019

    I'm just a guy, but I must admit, I've sometimes (secretly) studied the anatomy of clothed women.

    I guess, this "braless" look is mostly the result of bigger breast sizes and "sticky" looking clothing.

    Just to show what I mean:

    The first one is the basic G2F shape, smaller breasts, but definitely no braless look (at least imo).

    Second one with increased breast size, imo not really braless but more like glued the shirt to your skin.

    Third one same size, dialed in "breast upwards slope" and increased smoothing iterations in the smoothing modifier of the shirt, imo a plausible impersonation of a bra wearing female.

    Forth one, same as the third one, but also used some morphs of Zev0's fit control here.

    Or are you looking for this "extremly padded with strong outlines" look ?

     

    Braless.jpg
    1440 x 1080 - 1M
    Post edited by Mazh on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 40,162

    Another solution could be to dial the FBM out of the clothing under hidden and then just use a loosen morph if it has one and hide the figures pectorals 

  • L'AdairL'Adair Posts: 9,479
    Mazh said:

    I'm just a guy, but I must admit, I've sometimes (secretly) studied the anatomy of clothed women.

    I guess, this "braless" look is mostly the result of bigger breast sizes and "sticky" looking clothing.

    Just to show what I mean:

    The first one is the basic G2F shape, smaller breasts, but definitely no braless look (at least imo).

    Second one with increased breast size, imo not really braless but more like glued the shirt to your skin.

    Third one same size, dialed in "breast upwards slope" and increased smoothing iterations in the smoothing modifier of the shirt, imo a plausible impersonation of a bra wearing female.

    Forth one, same as the third one, but also used some morphs of Zev0's fit control here.

    Or are you looking for this "extremly padded with strong outlines" look ?

    Aside from the problematic fit, (cloth looks glued to the underside of the breasts,) any of these would pass for a woman wearing a bra under her shirt.

    I'll have to whip up a render showing a few "braless" shapes.

  • MazhMazh Posts: 498
    edited April 2019

    @L'Adair I totally agree with you that this could be an issue with elder females shapes with "baked in" breast morph, but the TO talked about younger females, and these body shapes are normally "gravity defying".

     

    Braless_1.jpg
    1080 x 1440 - 1M
    Post edited by Mazh on
  • MazhMazh Posts: 498

    Same shape (3D Celebrity's Lola transferred to G2F).

    Daz posing morphs, Zev0's Breast Control and increased smoothing iterations/ t-shirt, but yes, to have an morph to dial back extreme breast morphs (coming with the character) would be nicer.

    So, and now I'll stop fiddling with.....

     

    Braless_2.jpg
    1080 x 1440 - 1M
  • jardinejardine Posts: 1,217

    there's a 'breasts gone' morph in the core g8f body morphs set that might be what you're looking for. 

    j

  • ParadigmParadigm Posts: 423

    A dformer is generally my answer to these kinds of questions 

  • L'AdairL'Adair Posts: 9,479
    edited April 2019
    Paradigm said:

    A dformer is generally my answer to these kinds of questions 

    I use dForms a lot, (Influence: Weight Map). I've also gotten comfortable enough in Hexagon to create the occasional morph. For fixing breast shapes, I'd rather use Hex. I haven't tried it just yet, (too busy IRL,) but I'm pretty sure using symmetry, I can make my changes to one and fix both at the same time.


    I'm still working on a set of images to show what I'm talking about. Just ran it past a mod, first, to make sure I won't violate the TOS.

    Post edited by L'Adair on
  • Melissa ConwayMelissa Conway Posts: 590

    Sorry I've been MOA in my own post, but dealing with some health issues at the mo. Thanks so much for all the suggestions/discussion!

  • Silver DolphinSilver Dolphin Posts: 1,638

    Now we need is something that shows that there is a bra panties there by showing the lines of the bra on the shirt! No more undetectable bra but some kind of displacement or bump map that can be added to all clothes! For added realism! Something useful and worth buying! Hint Hint

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