Computer Advice

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  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,919

    ...I just know what I've seen and tested. there is a positive difference.  Yeah, it's not as much as with liquid cooling, but that is a rather expensive alternative and not always compatible with older hardware like I have.  So I have to make do with the best solution I have.  Yes it requires a bit more attention to maintenance to clean, Don't really see that as a big issue, particularly as I use a removable, washable filter and all my intake fans have washable filter screens to reduce dust contamination).

    Because of the standard design of most cases, there is usually provision for only a single rear (120mm) exhaust fan to pull all the waste heat out.  Having dual or triple fans on top is far better as heat usually rises.  Diesel locomotives have multiple exhaust fans on the top for this same reason.

  • nicsttnicstt Posts: 11,715
    edited January 2019

    I hope you don't mind my throwing this post in here. I have some very compelling ideas for "cartoons" that would (perhaps loosely) portray some of my life events. The concept would be the struggles of a man to "grow up," deal with family dynamics, and the challenges of aging. I intend to make this series one that would appeal to a variety of people. 

    I want the ability to assemble my scenes, and render them in a reasonable amount of time. I work in burst of inspiration. I get the idea, and want to crank out scene after scene. Sometimes I'm actually able to come up with good camera angles, whatever. I just want the ability to follow my inspiration without needing to wait hours or days for an image to render!

    Do a low resolution render; say 300 ish by whatever to keep aspect ratio; you keep the idea, it doesn't take as long. Save the scene obviously(?), then when needed can change the render resolution/size.

    Of course, camera angle etc, can be saved as a Camera Preset.

    Edit: on a 980ti - decent but no longer anywhere near the best available.

    Total Rendering Time: 12 minutes 57.38 seconds (1273x1800)

    Same scene 200x283

    Total Rendering Time: 1 minutes 17.63 seconds

    Back OT.

    Change your computer to get what you want render-time-wise; or change what and how you render so you get them in the time you need or want... Or some combination

    Willow Creek Tiny.jpg
    200 x 283 - 55K
    Post edited by nicstt on
  • ebergerlyebergerly Posts: 3,255
    edited January 2019

    It appears the recommended video card could easily cost as much as the rest of the computer.

    Yes, which is why you should probably first figure out how much $$ you're actually willing to spend on this computer in total, and then decide what to buy. You could spend $$ on the absolutely optimum case that has the best cooling, but then realize you can only spend $300 on a low end GPU. Pretty much a waste of money, IMO. You only need world class case cooling if you're going to spend thousands of $$ on high end GPU's that push 250 watts when rendering. And if, practically, you're not going to spend that much to upgrade in the next 5 years, why waste the money?

    Like I always say, the first step to building a PC is figuring out exactly how much you're willing to spend, what your needs are (how long are you willing to wait for renders, how big your scenes typcially are, whether you're willing to do postwork to cut down the load on your PC, etc.). I realize it's fun for enthusiasts to discuss the fine details of the absolute optimum components, but if you're not going to need all of that...

     

    I get confused on the issue of system RAM compared to GPU RAM. Is there a ratio that makes it work?

    As was mentioned in the locked thread, in order to fill the GPU VRAM fully, you will need 2-3 times that much system RAM. It depends. It's not a fixed value. I've done a ton of testing on my 1080ti, adding scenes together until the tipping point where it drops to CPU, and often it requires 3x GPU VRAM for system RAM. Usually my 11GB 1080ti uses just about 32 GB of my 64 GB system RAM. I'm not certain of what the variables are (scene composition, available system RAM, GPU architecture, etc.), but if you're really concerned about using all your GPU VRAM, then I'd stick with 3x.

    But again, you first need to figure if you're willing to spend like $1,000 on a GPU. If you're only going to get a 4GB GPU, then it's not really an issue. Like I say, before you design something first determine what you need and what you're willing to spend. Saying stuff like "this component is good and this one isn't as good" doesn't really solve much.  

    In my estimation, it would be great to build a PC. I relish the idea of actually being able to render my silly pictures in a reasonable amount of time.

    Sounds like your interested in a fairly budget PC without a ton of bells and whistles. Are you willing to spend $300 on a GTX-1060? You can check the benchmark thread and see how relatively fast it renders compared to others. I think that's a 120watt card, so you might not need tons of cooling. If that's too expensive, then you may be able to get by with a smaller case to house a smaller GPU. 

    Personally, I'd first say something like "okay, I'm willing to spend a total of $XXX on a PC, and the most important thing is Iray rendering, so how would I best spend that money?". It might be better to skimp on cases and other components if they're ultimately not that important based on what you ACTUALLY need. 

     

    Post edited by ebergerly on
  • nicsttnicstt Posts: 11,715

    One thing to consider; no matter how much you spend on GPUs, sooner or later, they are going to become paperweights as the scene drops to CPU.

    Only you know how likely that is - and it is worth the time now trying to figure out how likely that is, and how often it might occur.

    You may decide that allowing more cash on CPU and RAM might be of benefit, or less because the scenes you do will rarely not fit on the card.

    Time spent beforehand, considering what you do, what you need, what you want to do in the future and also what that will entail will not be a waste, and could save you some cash.

  • kyoto kid said:

    ...I just know what I've seen and tested. there is a positive difference.  Yeah, it's not as much as with liquid cooling, but that is a rather expensive alternative and not always compatible with older hardware like I have.  So I have to make do with the best solution I have.  Yes it requires a bit more attention to maintenance to clean, Don't really see that as a big issue, particularly as I use a removable, washable filter and all my intake fans have washable filter screens to reduce dust contamination).

    Because of the standard design of most cases, there is usually provision for only a single rear (120mm) exhaust fan to pull all the waste heat out.  Having dual or triple fans on top is far better as heat usually rises.  Diesel locomotives have multiple exhaust fans on the top for this same reason.

    Heat rising is also a misnomer. If there were no fans the heat would rise. But if you have intake fans in the front of the case and an exhaust fan in the rear the air flow is through the case and the hot air has minimal time to rise, again this is just basic physics.

    Putting a bunch of exhaust fans in the top of the case just creates the worst possible situation. You have almost certainly overwhelmed your intake fans so instead of a positive pressure system where the cracks and vents in the case force dust out  you have created a negative pressure system where they are now intakes sucking dust in.People who test this stuff for a living have pretty thoroughly shown that slapping all those fans in the case is simply a waste. 2 or 3 fans in front for intake, with good filtered ventilation tolet them actually pull in air, and a single rear exhaust plus the PSU's fan is more than sufficient. Even with servers the only places where there are more cooling than that is on on spinning drives which run 24/7. Those get dedicated fans since the rack mounts have so little air flow and we pack those drives in so close together.

  • nicsttnicstt Posts: 11,715
    edited January 2019

    Agreeing with Kenshaw; basically what I said earlier, and with more detail.

    More fans NOT equal better cooling; they might or might not. (Basically marketting crap tells folks about the features, which they all too often claim are benefits, then spin it faster than any fan ever created to portray it in the best light.)

    Post edited by nicstt on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,919
    edited January 2019

    ...umm, as I mentioned all the intake fans all have filter screens which are very effective at keeping dust contamination to a minimum.   I also live in a more "dust free" environment than I used to.

    If there was more than a single small (80 or 120mm) rear exhaust fan the positive pressure theory would make more sense. Again, I have seen the difference. One of the front intake fans is also dedicated to the drives. 

    However, I see this discussion is pretty much heading nowhere.  I know what I have observed and am satisfied with the results.

    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • hphoenixhphoenix Posts: 1,335

    Yeah I saw Microcenter listed on Google. The site didn't appear all that friendly. Yeah, it would take some time after I relocate before I could consider building a new PC.

    Don't let the website intimidate you.  They have some of the best prices on hardware for the DIY PC builder, especially when you bundle a few things.  There are basically three stores I go to for PC building:

    Microcenter, Fry's, and Newegg

    I'm fortunate that I have TWO of each in my area (Atlanta, GA).  It makes it very easy to shop locally for stuff, so if there's a problem it's easy to resolve quickly.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,919
    edited January 2019

    ...yeah I have Newegg "just down the road" from me in California.  Even their regular shipping (as long as it is direct from them and not one of their other vendors) takes only two to three days (at the most) depending on when I place my order.  If I place it Monday morning, I usually have it by late Wednesday afternoon or mid day Thursday at the latest (provided it isn't during the holiday shopping/shipping season).

    Post edited by kyoto kid on
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