Character's face doesn't look identical

mehas

Daz world, I've been working in DS for few months now and getting pretty savvy with it. I'm happy with what I'm able to achieve and the way my projects look. I've purchased a lot of characters and other accessories from here as well as Renderosity website. However, my problem is that characters I purchased, their faces don't look identical to faces on pictures I see from the sellers of the products. Once I render my work their faces look beautiful but still not identical to sellers pictures. Let's put it this way, comparing my render to seller's characters look like they are siblings but not the same person. I use the same skin mats along with all other materials provided in the package. I use iray for rendering and light is pretty good so I don't think render is an issue. Sellers I bought the products from tend to be very respectable and have a lot of experience. Also I see other sellers using that same character to sell accessories and the pictures look exactly the same to the originals. I wonder if they use some picture editing app after the initial render like PS or something of that nature to enrich the quality or is it just me doing something wrong?

dragotx

Could you provide a sample so we can get a better idea of what's going on?  Something else to check is on the Parameters tab, select "All Used" (or something like that, not at my PC at the moment) to show everything that has been applied to the character.  Check and make sure there isn't an extraneous morph being added.  I've run into that a couple of times where a character morph isn't save quite right and winds up applying to every character, instead of the one that it's meant to be for.

Matt_Castle

It might be worth checking the "Currently Used" morphs list, as it is possible to accidentally get morphs to automatically load - I had an issue where I managed to save a copy of the Charlotte 8 shape that was automatically loading on all G8F characters except my personally saved ones.

FirstBastion

The exact same light HDRI will affect color tone of the skin.  The exact same loaded morphs will affect the face shape.  A morph can work on the base figure,  but some times requires an add on shape or the HD addon to look identicall to the promos.  Required products matter.  You will need to provide specific information.  There are too many variables otherwise.

 

Virtual_World

As FirstBastion mention, lights affect the look of a character; but also the camera settings affect it.  To test this assertion, please try swiching the Perspective parameter in the camera that you are using on and off.  You are going to see a difference.  Then try changing other parameters too, like the focal length.  Unless you use the same lights and cameras the PA used in his/her renders, your characters will look slightly different.

mehas

Thanks guys, you gave me a lot to work with. FirstBastion I do have all the required products, I just double checked. I'm leaning towards camera setting, that's my weakest spot so I'll attack that first and see what happens.In your experience, if I load the Face INJ-REM, it should be all set and not requiring any additional facial shaping ...right? I think make up doesn't really have much of the effects on overall face looks.

grinch2901

This is something to keep in mind. http://www.danvojtech.cz/blog/2016/07/amazing-how-focal-length-affect-shape-of-the-face/

daveso

way back many years ago, probably Poser 4 even, I had a serious problem with face shape... it was exactly the focal length of the camera. With poser I set it to 105-115. It changes the shape drastically... 

the default camera made the faces look alien. it was a flabbergaster to even the creator of the figure at the time. 

mehas

I think you're all right on the spot. I'm playing with camera settings and face is improving. Thanks all for prompt responses

3-D Arena

I was going to say check the camera.  A few years ago I was working on a character and somehow in the process perspective was turned off - I thought the morph was messed up because suddenly the face looked more square and heavy.

FSMCDesigns

lighting, then camera then hair. I can't begin to tell you how many times I saw a great promo and couldn;t figure our why my version looked different and it was usually because the hair was different

mehas

FSMCDesigns said:

lighting, then camera then hair. I can't begin to tell you how many times I saw a great promo and couldn;t figure our why my version looked different and it was usually because the hair was different

So you are saying it will have a drastic difference with different type of hair ? By the way, since you touched lighting, is there some sort of a rule of thumb when it comes to lighting, like should character mostly be under strong direct light? Would that bring the face look closer to original ?

Taoz

mehas said:

FSMCDesigns said:

lighting, then camera then hair. I can't begin to tell you how many times I saw a great promo and couldn;t figure our why my version looked different and it was usually because the hair was different

 

So you are saying it will have a drastic difference with different type of hair ? By the way, since you touched lighting, is there some sort of a rule of thumb when it comes to lighting, like should character mostly be under strong direct light? Would that bring the face look closer to original ?

Yes, the hair can make a huge difference.

grinch2901

Taoz said:

mehas said:

FSMCDesigns said:

lighting, then camera then hair. I can't begin to tell you how many times I saw a great promo and couldn;t figure our why my version looked different and it was usually because the hair was different

 

So you are saying it will have a drastic difference with different type of hair ? By the way, since you touched lighting, is there some sort of a rule of thumb when it comes to lighting, like should character mostly be under strong direct light? Would that bring the face look closer to original ?

Yes, the hair can make a huge difference.

As a real world example I was just telling my wife that Jennifer Garner looks, to me, quite different based on whether her hair is up versus having it down. She has very angular features, square jaw, high cheeks, etc. They really jump out at you when her hair is up. When it's down, it softens all that a lot.  To my eyes, at least.

Worlds_Edge

I rarely play with camera settings, I guess I will have to now!

Virtual_World

FSMCDesigns said:

lighting, then camera then hair. I can't begin to tell you how many times I saw a great promo and couldn;t figure our why my version looked different and it was usually because the hair was different

+1

Yes, hair style and color are very important to change the look of a character!

mehas

grinch2901 said:

Taoz said:

mehas said:

FSMCDesigns said:

lighting, then camera then hair. I can't begin to tell you how many times I saw a great promo and couldn;t figure our why my version looked different and it was usually because the hair was different

 

So you are saying it will have a drastic difference with different type of hair ? By the way, since you touched lighting, is there some sort of a rule of thumb when it comes to lighting, like should character mostly be under strong direct light? Would that bring the face look closer to original ?

Yes, the hair can make a huge difference.

As a real world example I was just telling my wife that Jennifer Garner looks, to me, quite different based on whether her hair is up versus having it down. She has very angular features, square jaw, high cheeks, etc. They really jump out at you when her hair is up. When it's down, it softens all that a lot.  To my eyes, at least.

I agree, hair up verus hair down. My character has hair down just as the promo does only not the same hair type. Here is the example, sorry about the quality, I cropped it on my phone. And here is the link to promo character I purchasedhttps://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/?ViewProduct=108320

Virtual_World

mehas said:

grinch2901 said:

Taoz said:

mehas said:

FSMCDesigns said:

lighting, then camera then hair. I can't begin to tell you how many times I saw a great promo and couldn;t figure our why my version looked different and it was usually because the hair was different

 

So you are saying it will have a drastic difference with different type of hair ? By the way, since you touched lighting, is there some sort of a rule of thumb when it comes to lighting, like should character mostly be under strong direct light? Would that bring the face look closer to original ?

Yes, the hair can make a huge difference.

As a real world example I was just telling my wife that Jennifer Garner looks, to me, quite different based on whether her hair is up versus having it down. She has very angular features, square jaw, high cheeks, etc. They really jump out at you when her hair is up. When it's down, it softens all that a lot.  To my eyes, at least.

 

I agree, hair up verus hair down. My character has hair down just as the promo does only not the same hair type. Here is the example, sorry about the quality, I cropped it on my phone. And here is the link to promo character I purchasedhttps://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/?ViewProduct=108320

I think that your render looks great!

FSMCDesigns

mehas said:

grinch2901 said:

Taoz said:

mehas said:

FSMCDesigns said:

lighting, then camera then hair. I can't begin to tell you how many times I saw a great promo and couldn;t figure our why my version looked different and it was usually because the hair was different

 

So you are saying it will have a drastic difference with different type of hair ? By the way, since you touched lighting, is there some sort of a rule of thumb when it comes to lighting, like should character mostly be under strong direct light? Would that bring the face look closer to original ?

Yes, the hair can make a huge difference.

As a real world example I was just telling my wife that Jennifer Garner looks, to me, quite different based on whether her hair is up versus having it down. She has very angular features, square jaw, high cheeks, etc. They really jump out at you when her hair is up. When it's down, it softens all that a lot.  To my eyes, at least.

 

I agree, hair up verus hair down. My character has hair down just as the promo does only not the same hair type. Here is the example, sorry about the quality, I cropped it on my phone. And here is the link to promo character I purchasedhttps://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/?ViewProduct=108320

lorelei is a V4 character and the promo images are rendered in poser, so the chance fo you getting your render from DS to look anything like the product promos are very slim bascially because of the 2 different render engines used.

Fauvist

mehas said:

 By the way, since you touched lighting, is there some sort of a rule of thumb when it comes to lighting, like should character mostly be under strong direct light? Would that bring the face look closer to original ?

If you are using a lighting preset product that you purchase - be aware that the lighting is most often set up for a camera loaded in the default position, pointing at a character who is positioned in the "zero" spot.  If you move the camera to a different angle, or move the character somewhere else in the 3D universe away from "zero", then the expensive and perfect looking lighting in the promo images for the lighting product will likely look nothing like your render, and may be very disappointing.

Also look carefully at the "Required Products" on the product page for the character you are using.  If you don't have ALL the require products then the character won't look identical.  And maybe check the Read Me file to see if the artist who created the character has any tips on using it.

Oso3D

Hair affects look, definitely.

One of my favorite examples:

 

Zooey Deschanel without bangs blew my mind.

 

Oso3D

Also makeup

mehas

Now that so many good points have been addressed in this post, let me ask this question: Has anyone been successful in rendering character in DS identical to character which was originally rendered in Poser? If yes, please point us to a right direction.

SixDs

If the entire object of the exercise is to recreate those promo images, then FSMCDesigns defined the problem. Not only are we talking about a different render engine, but material settings that are also different when used in DAZ Studio and unerringly require adjustment. Etc. Is it hypothetically possible to reproduce those results in DAZ Studio? Possibly in 3Delight if you are really willing to go to some considerable effort. But I highly doubt you have a snowball's hope of doing so if you are using Iray.

Instead of focusing on reproducing the promos, I would suggest that you simply focus on producing credible reproductions of your own. With proper material settings designed for your render engine of choice, and proper lighting, that should be very doable, even with a V4 character.

mehas

SixDs said:

If the entire object of the exercise is to recreate those promo images, then FSMCDesigns defined the problem. Not only are we talking about a different render engine, but material settings that are also different when used in DAZ Studio and unerringly require adjustment. Etc. Is it hypothetically possible to reproduce those results in DAZ Studio? Possibly in 3Delight if you are really willing to go to some considerable effort. But I highly doubt you have a snowball's hope of doing so if you are using Iray.

Instead of focusing on reproducing the promos, I would suggest that you simply focus on producing credible reproductions of your own. With proper material settings designed for your render engine of choice, and proper lighting, that should be very doable, even with a V4 character.

I've explored a bit of a Poser last night and your comment makes a lot of sense now. As I mentioned in my original post, I'm happy with my work and I think my character looks beautiful, I just wanted to dig deeper and get some input as for why the character is not identical to promo.

AllenArt

Worlds_Edge said:

I rarely play with camera settings, I guess I will have to now!

I always change the camera settings when doing portaits especially...the default is just too low a setting. For a portrait I go between 90 and 110 on the focal length. When you back the camera away from the subject you can then lower the focal length.

Laurie

Wonderland

Also, expressions can change the look of a character drastically!