Postwork advice
believeinhumans
Posts: 38
Greetings,
Eternal noob here, amongst many of my weaknesses involved in the creation of art, I realise one of my major weak points is postwork. Ive been making art for a little while and no matter how good (or not good) my renders turn out, when I put them into Photoshop CC, I sometimes even ruin it somehow, including even loosing quality in the render, I basically have no idea what im doing haha. How do I make the image 'pop', or look pleasing to the eye?. I know there is a ton of tuts on youtube, and ones you can buy. Apart from just learning over time and gaining experience, I was wondering what are you guys favourite tutorials that really helped you? Or any other tips or thoughts on postwork?
I am greatful to anyone that reads this post, and also if it turns into a helpful discussion for absolute postwork noobs, that would be awesome!
Good day to all!!
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Comments
These ones by isikol can help
https://superherorenders.deviantart.com/art/WAR-WORKFLOW-TUTORIAL-253647576
https://superherorenders.deviantart.com/art/AQUAMAN-11-PAGE-TUTORIAL-158080187
Probably the first thing you want to research, is photography/cinematic lighting setups. Then composition. This is a pretty good primer for composition
Postwork, I try to avoid it as much as I can lol. Moslty I might adjust the levels a bit, or vibrance, paint out any wierd issues like pokethrough.
keyword searh might help too
deviantart photoshop tutorial postwork
this is really great!! Thank you so much for sharing!!
ps I really enjoy your products!!
lol I hear you!..This is awesome though, thank you!
The Bold wordd are terms you can search tutorials for.
Learn to use Layers and nondestructive editing, this will help you edit without permanently changing the image.
Vibrance, levels and contrast can help make image pop.
Lossy and Lossless image formats to know which file formats preserve quality. In General PNG retains 100% quality, JPG uses compression and depending on the level can make image look blurry.
Those are basics, you can search photoshop compositing tutorials to find just general visual techniques, even though compositing may not be something you want to do, these tutorials usually use many art techniques that can be applied like Color Correction and post work.
agree with the above, learning composition is your 1st step in getting something that is "pleasing to the eye"
That said my favorite videos for learning photoshop is anything by RafyA https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCB69iibkyOYlODhrwJlrzsw just replace your photos with renders and your golden.
There's not much currently on my channel https://www.youtube.com/user/dcartphoto/videos?view_as=subscriber&shelf_id=0&view=0&sort=dd but I have an upload going as I am typing this, the 1st in a series covering using photoshop to produce a 3D composite. Also if you have questions, about photoshop , you can ask there or in my art thread - linked in my signature.
Good luck and happy creating!
I'm of the school of thought that the image should "pop", while it's still in it's un-postworked state. In other words, if your lighting's wrong, posing's stiff, etc no amount of postwork is going to improve the overall image.
So, by all means, learn about and use postwork, but don't forget to learn how to create a good image to begin with.
Always save your initial render as a .png file. It's a lossless format. .jpg files can end up losing definition due to compression.
General tips:
Hope this helps,
Cres
This is all sound advice! really appreciate this.
heh.....never even thought of that, thats pretty interesting ~
One thing you'll notice is a lot of effects like rain, sweat, and such look good at 1280x720p HD but not so great at 4K.
The best basic postwork advice I can give is to get an inexpensive introductory secondhand book concerning Photoshop and basic digital photography. Most that I've found are comptently written and illustrated. There are dozens of them out there.
Virtually everything you read in such a book will help you learn the techniques you can apply to doing postwork on Daz Studio images. After all, photos taken with digital cameras are just digital files. A JPG taken from life is still just a JPG.
I learn best by doing. I also love postwork and consider renders the canvas to really spring into action. Since I don’t have a high end computer I do what I can to add some extra details post to make it pop. My best advice if you find something you like or a certain technique... write it down so you can remember later.
Here are a few bits of advice.
Tone Mapping Advice :
For a quick way to make your renders "Pop" without any post processing (if you are rendering in Iray) Set your Tonemapping to a setting other than default.
Here is what I change on mine :
Shutter Speed (1/x) = 1200.00
F/Stop = 1.80
Burn Highlights = 0.00
Crush Blacks = 0.00
Gamma = 1.00
These settings are good for daylight outdoor scenes.
Most well made indoor scenes will render nice with these settings if you lower the shutter speed to somewere between 60 - 200
By setting the Gamma down to 1.00 you will produce a much richer range of light to dark (I always felt that the default 2.20 setting produces washed out looking renders)
One of the great things in Iray is the ability to open the tonemapping settings mid render and adjust them on the fly. sometimes all a render needs to truely "pop" is to add a bit of burn highlights, crush blacks, or a bit more saturation.
Image Quality Advice :
Save your render as a .png file in Daz Studio. (.png files come in two flavors. Compressed and uncompressed, both formats are 100% lossless. You loose zero quality saving as a compressed png file.)
Never use .jpg files in your workflow. This is a lossy compression, the more times you save a file to worse it looks.
The only time you should use a .jpg file is when creating a COPY of your work to post somewhere that has a file size limitation that the .png version will not fit into.
While working on edits you should use the native file format for your layered image editing program. Always copy your render to a new layer to start postwork. Keep the original as the bottom layer and locked to avoid accidental edits.
When you have competed your editing, you should have at least three files.
1. Your original render (render.png)
2. Your layered image editor work file. (render_wip.psd)
3. Your complete edited version (render_complete.png)
4. Any other version you need resized oor smaller file sizes (render_resize.jpg , render_compressed.jpg)
There is my big workflow advice for you.
Rule #1: NEVER NEVER NEVER do ANYTHING to the original image. Make a copy of the original image, and then do your postwork on that.
Rule #2: BACKUP every original image - on an external drive, or a CD, or a DVD, or somthing.
Rule #3: When you are working in Photoshop - click SAVE after EVERY change you make - so you don't create a masterpiece and then lose all the brilliant changes if Photoshop or your computer freezes or crashes, or the electricty goes off.
Trying to learn Photoshop is overwhelming. Choose ONE thing you want to know how to do - like making the colors more vibrant - and learn how to do that one thing. Then choose another thing you want to do - like changing the contrast of your image - and learn how to do that.
If you are thinking you want to make your images look like someone else's images - it may not be possible. I can use SEVEN different software applications to alter ONE picture. Sometimes I apply half a dozen commercial filters to alter the image. Sometimes it will take me 20 hours to make a picture look the way I want it to look. 20 hours of constant experimentation and changes. When I'm finished working on an image I can't even duplicate it.
These are very good rules to drill into your head. Before I ever open anything with PS, I rightclick > Add to archive with 7zip, then move that archive to my original render/untouched photo folder. That way I know I can't posiibly mess up and accidentally alter the original.
Ive learnt so much from this this thread, so grateful to everyone who took the time to answer and contribute to it, Thank you!!
I always save my render in TIF or PNG format. To render faster, I tend to render piece mill then assemble the image in Photoshop. l consider lighting in Daz Studio to be the first step in a good render. Sometimes, I will render two or three versions of the image with different lighting then use these images in Photoshop to build one image. I always render to a size bigger than my final Photoshop output image will be. I like to save my scene so I can render the image again so if I get to photoshop and realize something is wrong with render I can fix whatever and redo scene. Just be sure to start by create a camera and use this to shoot your image so your scene when you open is the same scene shot you rendered. (I learned that if you render to perspective view that it doesn't save as the same shot you thought you saved the hard way.)
If you find a routine you want to follow with most or all of your images, make yourself an action. This action could even be just a recording of the adjustment layers you plan to utilize throughout your editing process. If you want to record something more complex than duplicating your original image and creating a set of adjustment layers to be used, be sure to include stops for things like changing filter settings or prompts to use brush tool or whatever needs to be done otherwise action will just run the list of steps without stopping.
Don't edit on your image directly. Use layers. Naming your layers for what that layer does (example: lips highlight for a layer that highlights the lips) or the filter and filter settings used will help you find that layer in the stack if you need to change something. I would also recommend using smart layers for filters when possible so you can change settings on the fly.
ALWAYS work on a duplicate NEVER your original. ALWAYS use layers. I recommend learning and practicing using layer masking and blend modes. When possible, use adjustment layers. For contrast, the curves tool is the most powerful. SAVE often. If Photoshop crashes, you don't want to lose all of your work!
The internet is full of free Photoshop tutorials and resources. Don't get stuck on only using Photoshop CC tutorials. Most if not all Photoshop tutorials are applicable. Keep in mind that there are always several ways to do anything in Photoshop so try reading or watching several tutorials on subjects that interest you. With CC, you should pretty much be able to use any of the actions, brushes, layer styles etc that are available...lots of paid and free stuff out there.
If you don't have one, I'd recommend getting a Wacom tablet.
First thing you do, make a copy of the original. Save at least 2: in a physical backup and cloud (if available). Trust me, not saving at least one of the original has bitten more people in the ass here than anything.
Save often (regardless of what editor you use), especially when you've been working on something for more than 30 minutes. A lot of artists have pulled their eyebrows out in rage after forgetting to CTRL+S and then lost everything thanks to acts of God (i.e. power failure, BSOD, etc.).
Bookmarked. Even though, I knew most of this, I still got some good stuff out of it. I really love the Daz communiy. You all have taught me soooo much.
The voice in this video sounds like the professor from the Big Bang Theory that Sheldon hates.
I will add my 2 cents about post. Think of it as woman`s makeup - begin small, and always try to make it as less obvious as possible. I would advice you just start with some basic photo style exposure, brightness, and color editing, as if it was your digital camera pic you wanted to enhance. Start from there, and see how you can make it more vivid, with great highlights, good contrast, right hue etc.
Have any good tips on making quick masks, or do you paint those by hand? I used to do a lot more compositing because I had to, I would have to paint my masks by hand, which took forever in spots, like hair. I could never figure out a way to have studio make me a clean mask, like I could get mantra to do :(
I almost always render in TIF format which opens in Photoshop with a transparent background. I made myself an action that I use when I open my daz renders that aren't fully rendered scenes so I can do my little routine in one click. Here are the steps in my homemade Daz Image Starter Action: Open image; start recording: Image<Duplicate Image; Close out original daz Tif File; ctrl J to duplicate my layer 0; Control click on the top layer in the palette which auto names to "layer 0 copy"; go to menu then select<Modify<feather<1 px accept; create layer mask for layer 0 copy; drop down to original layer and change blend mode to multiply and drop the opacity down to 15%; shift select both layers (layer 0 and layer 0 copy) then click the link button in the layers palette; stop recording action. By creating an action, I do all these things with one click.
If I want to tamper with hair, I usually grab some good hair then transform and masking it to coverup or make hair do what I want. Next, I use a photshop brush that's basically just three to five random dots to paint in new hair using two colors that are similar to that in the hair texture. After painting the hair, I apply some Unsharp mask to the painted hair to get the brush strokes sharper. Next, I hit the painted hair with the noise filter. I use fade...edit<fade directly after the filter...to reduce the opacity of noise filter applied. (You see in the fade window how it looks so you can judge the amount of noise needed to make the painted hair blend in with original texture.) Lastly, I like to do a little "painting with light" to make it pop.
For hair selections, I prefer to do it in the channels palette to make selection. If a real photo I'd use this for initial selection then probably follow up with Refine Mask. The fastest way to do this is to have the layer you want a mask for then use Calculations. Image< Calculations. Use the dialog to mix a new high contrast channel...make source the highest contrast channel. Usually, I end up mixing the source with itself in Multiply blend mode. The newly mixed channel will appear in the channels pallette below the red/blue/green channels. You can do this more than once if you want. You can edit this channel ...usually I select and paint in the interior black staying away from the edge and the area outside white again staying away from the edge. I then change color chips in tool box to black and white; grab paint brush set to Overlay blend mode in menu bar and use black and white paint to push pixels to either black or white to refine the mask. (Edit: I usually set the Overlay brush to something around 20% opacity to build the effect.) When happy, I Control A (select all); Control C (copy) to copy into my clipboard the newly created channel. Next, I go to my image to be masked and click on the mask icon to create a mask. I then, Alt Click on the mask to make mask visible...image will go white...then use the paste command to insert the new channel image into the mask.
Alternately, you can use Image<Apply Image but it's a couple more steps. You have to open channels pallette; select a high contrast channel; create a duplicate of your channel to create a new channel so that you can mix a new mask and work on it. The rest of the steps to make the mask are the same...similar dialog box.
Masking tips. I paint with a harder edge brush (not 100% but pretty high) then use gaussian blur when done to set my selection softness when working with masks. You can view a mask as with red tink if you alt shift click on mask. Shift clicking on mask turns disables/enables mask. Curves and Levels can be used on masks to firm up masks or when used with gaussian blur to contract or expand selections. You can paste an image into a mask by alt clicking a mask then using paste shortcut.
Channel tips: Channels can be pasted into a mask but you need to alt click the mask to make mask visible then use the paste command. If you want to use a channel in your image on it's own layer, you must use the paste into place command (paste<paste special<paste into place) to get it to register in place.
Just a quick and dirty steps in fixing a bad hair render. (Easier to just redo in this image's case but I had this in my render library so went with it to show how you can use pieces of your existing hair and hair painting to get a decent result. This was just a quick and dirty only hair is edited...I'm not totally in love with the full result but still much better than the original rendered hair.) The overlay step is to give the hair pop...just white paint on a separate layer that is in overlay blend mode with gaussian blur applied. I really dislike that curl on face of last image but it was a good demo showing that the faked hair blended well with hair originally rendered hair. Note: Image was girl over transparency in TIF format. I just added a background so you could see the white matt before removal.
Can you use Lightroon filters in Topaz?
Put images in Dropbox. Open them with an iPad filter app with presets. There are hundreds and are cheap and high quality. Snapseed, affinity photo, any number of photo film simulators. For $10 you can have an app that will do many things faster and easier than photoshop. Contrast brightness levels exposure...all easily controlled.
Ah good tips. I usually render fully built scenes, getting back into messing with 32bit renders. If you use them, you can do a beauty pass of anything you think you might need to isolate, and use that as a mask. Only issues I have had with that today, was with transparency on clothing. If there is clothing transparency, might be better off making a naked pass, so you can easily tweak the skin underneath without messing with the clothing, not sure, haven't tried the idea just yet. Sounds logical though lol.
I don't think Topaz Studio can import filters from other software. It looks like Topaz Labs filters can be used in Lightroom, though.
I think I remember a post here in the forums indication that the Lightroom brushes available here can run on Gimp..... is that accurate?
I stumbled on Photoshop for... twenty years or so. I eventually picked up a written tutorial elsesite from Sveva and it changed my life. It was exactly the kind of gentle hand-holding with screenshots that I needed to get over how deeply intimidated I was by Photoshop. And once I got past that, it was like unlocking a treasure vault. She provides a good introduction to heavy postwork (like, making it look painted), too.