Lighting: Doing Something Wrong- Spot Renders Really Different From Viewport

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  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited March 2013

    WIP (work in progress)
    I think the background plants are showing through the wings, not sure. (As I said, I like it. I wanted some transparency.) And will have to do smoothing as one wing is jagged. Anyway, this is what you can accomplish if you copy spotlights and move them up slightly using Y translation. Now to get you the settings. :) (If anyone is interested, otherwise, I'll just entertain myself by posting, lol!)

    EDIT- after looking at this, is the blue body reflecting up in the wing? I'll have to go check that setting you were telling me about Szark! (the one I didnt understand, a couple posts up.) I think I like it this way, as the dragonfly is much smaller in the render and the blue and images in the wings add contrast.

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    Post edited by Novica on
  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited December 1969

    I did a copy/paste- the first attempts are listed, then the current settings in RED

    Surfaces: for Dragonfly
    BODY
    diffuse color light pink, strength 100 medium purple (128, 0, 128) strength 100%
    glossy 0 same
    specular is white, strength 20 light blue (0, 255, 255) strength 44.5%
    multiply specular through opacity on OFF
    ambient color hot pink, strength 50 same, hot pink (255, 0, 128) strength 13.6%
    opacity strength 100 same
    bump strength 100 same
    negative bump -.010, positive bump .010 same
    displacement strength 0 same
    reflection color white, strength 80 same
    refraction color white, strength 0 same
    light model plastic same
    smooth on same
    default UV’s same

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited December 1969

    Surfaces: for Dragonfly
    WINGS

    diffuse color light pink, strength 100% white (255, 255, 255) strength 25.5%
    glossy 0 same
    specular is white, strength 20% white (255, 255, 255) strength 42.9%
    multiply specular through opacity on OFF
    ambient color hot pink, strength 50% THIS IS VERY DIFFERENT THAN BODY, hot pink (255, 128, 255) strength 50%
    opacity strength 100 48.4%
    bump strength 100 same
    negative bump -.010, positive bump .010 same
    displacement strength 0 same
    reflection color white, strength 80 same
    refraction color white, strength 0 same
    light model plastic same
    smooth on same
    default UV’s same

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited December 1969

    Surfaces: for Dragonfly
    EYES

    diffuse color light pink, strength 100% Very Different! bluish purple (185, 176, 255) strength 100%
    glossy 0 same
    specular is white, strength 20% light pink (255,128, 255) strength 44.6%
    multiply specular through opacity on OFF
    ambient color hot pink, strength 50% SAME AS WINGS hot pink (255, 128, 255) strength 50%
    opacity strength 100 48.4%
    bump strength 100 same
    negative bump -.010, positive bump .010 same
    displacement strength 0 same
    reflection color white, strength 80 same
    refraction color white, strength 0 same
    light model plastic same
    smooth on same
    default UV’s same

  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    edited December 1969

    Why are you making the surfaces reflective?

    Without a complete, enclosed environment, (cube, sphere, dome/ground) you will be reflecting 'blank space', too...

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited December 1969

    The settings just posed for Surfaces will make your dragonfly "receptive" to the spotlights, which varied in intensity. Until I adjusted my Surfaces, the lights didn't "take" for me. (Again, this is just what worked for ME.)

    Here's some of the lights you might want to try- use 3 bright neon greens, some blues, and one pink to get the results I posted.
    Due to dragonfly being tipped a bit in flight, took 2 spotlights, bright green (0, 255, 0) shining on the underbelly, one directly underneath, another coming from underneath but also from out front. 200% intensity, spread angle 7.0

    A third green spotlight shone from the lower front to hit by the chin and front legs intensity 76%
    The pink spotlight was literally almost on top of the green one (shooting to the lower front) and was 109% intensity, hitting just the face. The angles on these were only 5 to 8 degrees, very focused on one area.

    The blue spotlights in the wings were 0,0,255 and were 128% intensity. The angle was 5.35%, again, very focused.

    Cathie

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited March 2013

    mjc1016 said:
    Why are you making the surfaces reflective?

    Without a complete, enclosed environment, (cube, sphere, dome/ground) you will be reflecting 'blank space', too...

    I think I changed that and didn't do anything? So it should just be 0, right?

    EDIT: "Why...."
    Answer: Because I haven't a clue. :) :) :) That's why you are keeping me straight!

    Post edited by Novica on
  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    edited December 1969

    With reflections on, you'll get some reflections, no matter what...but without a 'full' environment (top, bottom, sides) you'll end up with blank spots that tend to render as black blobs. They can, also, under some conditions (view angle, lighting, etc), reduce the apparent transparency of some things...think of looking out a window at night, from inside a well lit room.

    If you want the dragonfly to be 'shiny'...kill the reflections, pull down the specular strength to like about 40% and set the glossiness to around 60%...

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited December 1969

    I'll do that and see how it looks, also so other people can see. You're a great teacher :)

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited March 2013

    Whew, totally different bug. The scene spotlights/feeling is the glowing pinks, blues, purples- this is too dark. All my spotlight work is lost, not happy about that, may take a look at increasing the intensity on those and see what happens.
    EDIT- Turned intensity of the colors on the wings up past 200% and there is no change in color.

    But it's neat! I'll play around and see what it takes to get something in between, or may just stick with the original, but definitely want to play with it and keep this information handy. Thank you so much!!!

    Question- this was messing with the specular. How does ambient affect glossy?

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    Post edited by Novica on
  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 15,001
    edited December 1969

    In the drop down box that shows the camera, views, etc...and select each spot light that's supposed to be hitting the dragonfly and see if it is actually visible through the light...

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited December 1969

    Here's with the body glossy and with the purple replaced with blue in diffuse, and reflection zero. The body is a darker blue. The original is the first one, the second is with the glossy body/blue diffuse.

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  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited December 1969

    Szark, you said "For something this small shadow bias could work better at 0.10" so I just did that.

    Any recommendations for shadow softness on something this small? (It is larger than a normal dragonfly, btw, since it is a fantasy scene, it is a fantasy bug. It's about twice the size of a big dragonfly.)

  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited March 2013

    Surfs Up! Reminds me of the designs on some of the surfboards I see at the beach! (Or T shirts.)
    What did I do? Well...believe it or not, just added a distant light (whitish light blue) and it barely touches the dragonfly. Intensity 80%. Just playin' around. But if you're messing with Surface and Lighting, try a distant light from behind and see what it does to your object. Pretty cool. Not keeping it, but thought I'd let you see it. NOTHING was changed from the last dragonfly except adding the distant light.

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    Post edited by Novica on
  • SzarkSzark Posts: 10,633
    edited March 2013

    Novica said:
    I'll have to go check that setting you were telling me about Szark! (the one I didnt understand, a couple posts up.) I think I like it this way, as the dragonfly is much smaller in the render and the blue and images in the wings add contrast.
    What exactly don't use understand about making something transparent and trying to keep reflections and highlights when the surface is invisible or nearly invisiable. Just think about it logically. You make something transparent in Daz Studio then the highlights and relfections will disappear..yes? So when we want something that is see through and want full highlights and reflections we turn Multiply Through Opacity OFF.

    Szark, you said "For something this small shadow bias could work better at 0.10" so I just did that.

    Any recommendations for shadow softness on something this small? (It is larger than a normal dragonfly, btw, since it is a fantasy scene, it is a fantasy bug. It's about twice the size of a big dragonfly.)

    Shadow softness well that is down to taste and how soft you want them. I am not being difficult but this type of aspect is down to you. May I suggest setting up a scene with a Plane, Cylinder and Cube and throw in a spot and test out shadow softness. Plane flat and get the Cylinder to cast shadow on to the cube. Start with no softness and then increase and render etc.
    Post edited by Szark on
  • NovicaNovica Posts: 22,244
    edited December 1969

    "So when we want something that is see through and want full highlights and reflections we turn Multiply Through Opacity OFF."

    That explains it very well :)
    Already did a few tests on the shadow softness and bias- still testing to see which one does what. And you're not being difficult, you're being helpful!
    Cathie

  • SzarkSzark Posts: 10,633
    edited December 1969

    LOL I may sound blunt at times becasue well I am but it is with good intent. :) Yeah a few folks have trouble with that one and wonder why they can't get good reflections and highlights on Glass etc.

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