Daz 4.9 + Windows 10 = Low memory (Advice needed)
N-RArts
Posts: 1,436
A couple of weeks ago, I did a fresh install of Windows 10 on my desktop. I felt that I had no other choice because the computer was just so unresponsive.
I re-installed all of my Daz content and upgraded to DAZ 4.9.
I must admit that I tried to clear the hard drive in BIOS before re-installing Win 10, so I wouldn't be surprised if I did something wrong.
Ever since, when I've tried to do renders (mostly Iray), Windows gets tetchy and throws out Low Memory messages. There are time where Daz stops working too (fatal error - something about Kernel 32).
One of the things that I have to do is disconnect from my internet (so I can't surf the web while rendering).
Expanding the RAM isn't possible at the moment or at any point in the future. So, I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.
Will adding more memory to the pagefile make any difference?
If anyone wants to see specifications, I can grab a screenshot of them, but I can't do it until I've finished my current Iray render (I'm writing and posting this from my laptop).
Oh, and Happy New Year everyone :)
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Comments
Happy New Year's Day to you too! How much ram do you have?
These are the memory specs for my desktop:
Installed Physical Memory (RAM): 6.00GB
Total Physical Memory 1.44GB
Avaliable Physical Memory: 620MB
Total Virtual Memory: 5.94GB
Avaliable Virtual Memory: 2.67GB
Page File Space: 4.50GB
If that is accurate you really are running out of memory!
Can you confirm, in the BIOS exactly how much physical RAM you have installed?
Are you on 32 bit windows or 64 bit? you have 6 installed, but the computer is only using 1.44
2GB is the limit of a 32 bit system and this seems like what is going on
To be honest, I have no idea how to find that out in BIOS. I had to use the internet to find out how to boot from USB when I did the clean install.
If you give me while, I can find out.
EDIT: It's saying that the total memory is 2048MB... Now that is wrong
This is the weirdest thing about my setup. The computer is 64bit, but the monitor is only 32bit.
Sounds like you have a laptop with that odd amount of RAM as a maximum and really, as I have upgraded my own laptop from 8GB to 16GB just because of the type of error messages you are getting I can tell you it is not a DAZ Studio bug but Windows 10 'proactively' protecting itself from runaway resource hogs.
About the only thing you can do with your current set up is to create DAZ scenes that don't overrun available RAM.
I've found, even wth my 16 GB RAM it is easy to create so-so complex scenes and then render at UHD resolution and cause computer run out of free memory for DAZ. What you can do:
1. Render no higher than 1920x1280 (simple scene) 1280x720 (complex scene) resolution
2. Close your browser(s) and you email client and other programs (especially if that email client is Outlook)
3. Use the texture reduction freebie at this link (I haven't needed to try it yet but others says it works):
http://daz3d.com/forums/discussion/137161/reduce-texture-sizes-easily-with-this-script#latest
Monitor bit depth has nothing to do with the bit depth the OS uses. That just determines the color combinations that it can display. The OS bit depth determines how many letters fit in a word (how many ones/zeros can fit in a 'word' of data).
If it is saying 2048 MB, then it sounds like you have 2 GB of PHYSICAL RAM...if you think you should have more than that, then you probably have a bad stick. Especially, if you had been running Studio without memory problems before the reinstall. And if everything was running slow, that's even more likely you have a bad stick of RAM.
The other was/is 'virtual' memory...or the swap space on disk, that is used when you run low on physical RAM. Windows will use most all of that 2 GB without launching any programs. Basically, what you had left, according to the first posted amount, was a bit over half a GB...
Funny that, Windows 10 seems to be a resource hog itself.
A part of me knew that it wasn't down to Daz.
Thanks for the link. I can't say I'm happy that i've got to reduce the resolution or textures for renders. But if it's the only way to use Daz without Windows 10 giving me errors, then I'm going to have to do it :(
I know for a fact that the RAM should be higher than 2GB. When I was looking for a new desktop, it was one of the main specifications that I was looking at (just because of Daz3D).
I've always thought that my RAM on the desktop was 8GB, so I had a bit of a shock when I only saw 6. I've got a TerraByte in Hard Drive space, but it's divided between two (seperate) partitions.
I've just run a Memory Diagnostic, but it must be okay as I didn't get any messages from Windows.
Will adding virtual memory make any difference to running Windows and Daz at the same time?
I think before you worry about virtual memory, we need to figure out what's going on with your physical RAM
Go to Settngs -> System -> About and take a screenshot (prt scrn button on the keyboard) and go into photoshop or paint or something and do an edit -> paste
Something has to be up. You had to do a fresh install of Windows because it was so unresponsive, and now it is showing a different ram spec?
I'm wondering if something has happening to the ram you have. Perhaps it has failed, or something else has failed.
I'm using Windows 10 on a desktop and a laptop and I am not seeing these kinds of numbers.
My laptop has 8 gb ram. I have 5.7 available, and 2.0 gb in use. I can have 50 tabs open in Google Chrome, which is notoriously a resource hog, and still be fine.
My desktop has 16 gb ram, and has 13.1 avilable, with 2.8 in use. I can have two browsers each with 50+ tabs plus Daz plus GIMP all at the same time.
In either case, Windows might be using around 2 gb to run.
So if you have 6 gb, and only 640 mb available, something has to be very wrong. Either you have a hardware issue or you have a software running wild and leaking ram.
Virtual memory will not help much, because odds are the hard drive is way to slow. The only possibility is if you have an SSD, and even then thats still slower than having real ram. But if all you have is 6 gb to work with, a SSD with a healthy page file *might* help. 6 gb is really poor regardless. You really need hardware if you wish to do Iray.
Check if there is a Memory Remap Feature in your BIOS (Chipset Settings), if it's disabled Windows may not be able to use all the RAM installed.
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_other-performance/how-do-i-enable-memory-remapping/8c0ab1ea-547b-4603-9b9a-fd72672eccb7
My advice is to never rely on built-in Windows diagnostics of any kind - they are notorious for taking shortcuts. I would download a copy of Memtest86+ here:
http://www.memtest.org/
You will need one of the ISO to create a bootable disc or the auto-installer for USB Key. The latter is only listed as working on Windows 7, but it may also work for Windows 10 to create a bootable thumbdrive. Alternatively, you could download a copy of Memtest86 (non plus) from http://www.memtest86.com/ . Once you have a bootable media, you will need to check your BIOS to ensure that it is set up to boot from that as a priority. Shut down your computer and boot with the media installed, and Memtest will start automatically. First, it will correctly identify the amount of installed RAM, and automatically begin a series of tests on it. If you are certain that you have 6 GB installed and Memtest says otherwise, you have a very fundamental problem and should report back here for further advice. If it indicates the correct amount of RAM, let the tests run - at least one complete pass (all tests completed). Warning: do this when you can let your computer run for awhile - the tests can take a long time to complete. You should not receive any error messages in the lower part of the window as the tests run - even one indicates a problem. Again, report back if this occurs.
Sorry for being a little late. I've been having DNS problems
Done and attached
(Coincidentally, I've actually been wondering how to find that system info page in Windows 10).
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
*I'm just checking BIOS. Will be back in a bit.
Wow. I can only dream of owning a computer like that.
Apart from Daz Studio. I don't really use the desktop for anything else.
I have done a lot of uninstalling to try an claim back some memory, but I don't think it's really worked. Although, the desktop is more responsive that it was before the clean install, but it's just the Memory window messages that are the main problem.
I've got a funny feeling that it'll have to go to the repair shop at some point.
I've been very throrough, and I cannot find Memory Remap in BIOS.
At the moment Memtest is doing what it does. Although, I get very uneasy when it comes to doing this sort of stuff (just in case I make the problem worse).
Would RAM problems affect Task Manager?
It's not present in all types of BIOS, or may be called something else, but from your screenshot it doesn't look like that's the problem. It use to say here if not all RAM is being utilized.
RAM problems can affect almost anything but usually in the way that programs or system is crashing or malfunctioning, or files are being corrupted when copying/saving them. MemTest will not cause any damage but if the RAM is bad it may become worse by being used no matter what you do, and you can't do anything about that. I don't think bad RAM is the problem here though.
Try to open Task Manager and click the Open Resource Monitor link at the bottom of the window, click the Memory tab and post a screenshot of it.
I was wrong here, the screenshot actually does say only 1.44 GB is available.
This is for Windows 8, but I know it has solved the problem for others in Win 8 so you could give it a try:
http://www.ricksdailytips.com/windows-8-not-using-all-ram/
BTW, got a link to the mainboard manual (can usually be found at the manufacturers site)?
For what it's worth, Windows 10 has a bad, bad memory management. I made a Daz scene on win 7, when I had 4 go RAM That I can't even load on my win 10 with 8 go (Same PC with different RAM, windows takes up arround 2 go, so I had arround 2 go available on win 7 and 6 go on win 10). I'm using win 10 for now as my win 7 needs to be re-installed, and I've daz crashes so frequently... But that's not daz fault, just win 10. Guaranteed.
I have Windows 10 on 5 year old laptop with integrated Intel GPU and it works like a better than any prior OS I've even used, including many varients of UNIX and osX and so on. It's been changed to act like a modern realtime OS that runs critical applications, eg your cell phone and no longer a toy that is easily crashed.
I have 16GB RAM and Windows 10 takes what it needs to run and leaves over 12GB RAM for DAZ Studio and other apps. Once the memory limit is exceeded, as soon as one of those running apps reveals itself to be consitently requesting more and more RAM in which to run, Windows 10 will shut it down rather than allow that app to crash the OS; it doesn't matter if the offending app is DAZ Studio, Outlook, Edge, Chrome, Firefox, Poser, Blender, or so on; Windows 10 will shut it down.
" it doesn't matter if the offending app is DAZ Studio, Outlook, Edge, Chrome, Firefox, Poser, Blender, or so on; Windows 10 will shut it down. "
Well no offense, but that's all the difference. In those cases, win 7 used SWAP. So it was really slower, but didn't crash. That been said, I can easily trust that 16 go is much more comfortable for win 10 that 6 go. But the only thing I noticed is that win 10 never cleans the ram, and can't even use SWAP.
Sorry if I appear to be a bit agressive, I really don't want to. I just hate windows, and Win 10 is clearly the worst to me... (OK, I should go now)
I really hope it's not down to bad RAM. I dread to think how much it would cost to repair :/
I had a look earlier and Maximum Memory was Unchecked. Out of curiosity, I enabled Maximum Memory, but the Avaliable Physical Memory went down to 454mb (disabled, it was 605mb). I've unchecked it again now.
I found the Manufacturer's site, but I'm going to look for it on my Laptop later.
That last screenshot lists 73% of your physical RAM in use. That's WAY too much. Sounds like you've got a bunch of unnecessary stuff running behind the scenes. Windows 10 plus the needed motherboard/device drivers shouldn't take up more than 2GB of RAM. On the resource monitor, can you drag that bottom pane to show more, and sort it (click on the header) by 'committed' so we can see what programs and what TSRs/Services/etc. are taking up so much memory.....
It's not the right screenshot you posted, you should select the Memory tab in the Resource Monitor, not the Overview...
And if Memtest could detect and scan all your RAM and didn't report any errors RAM should be OK.
I've just completed the test. Didn't download the Pro version, so I had to type everything out on my laptop.
CPU
CPU Type: AMD A6-6400K APU
CPU Clock: 3900MHz (Turbo: 4100MHz)
CPU Temperature: 42°c
# Logical Processors: 2 (1 enabled for testing)
L1 Cache: 2 x 80k (35494 MB/s)
L2 Cache: 2 x 1024k (27715 MBz)
L3 Cache: N/A
Memory
Total Physical Memory: 1519m (4392MB/s)
Memory Latency: 68.306 ns
Ecc enabled: N/A (Unknown)
2 Memory Capacities
1st Memory Capacity: 4096MB
2nd Memory Capacity: 2048MB
If those aren't typos, something is VERY wrong (either with the memory, or the motherboard)......it's showing 1519 MB of physical memory? But the two DIMM modules are reporting 4096+2048 = 6144 MB? That doesn't look correct.
What is the exact model of Pavillion you have?
Oops. Sorry.
Seeing all that hardware reserved memory and seeing that this cpu has an integrated video - I'm thinking that a significant amount of memory is being dedicated to the gpu by windows. I'm not familiar with this configuration, so I don't know how to confirm this. Anyone got suggestions here?
Right..."Hardware Reserved" of 4 GB?
Yeah, something fishy is going on here.
It's showing 2 sticks (a 4 GB and a 2 GB) one but, even without Windows running, it's showing a total that is way too low.
At this point, I think some investigation in the BIOS is needed. I'm thinking that 4 GB is being reserved for the onboard video...which, for the amount of actual RAM installed is way too much (that would also be consistent with the odd totals elsewhere). There should be a setting somewhere in the BIOS (I hope HP hasn't disabled that feature) for it. If not, possibly resetting to 'Factory Defaults' would free up some RAM.
I've attached the processes to this post.
Task Manager is saying that 1-4% of the CPU is being used. But it's also saying that 54% of the Memory is being used at the same time.
I'm thinking about trying Memtest on the computer again tomorrow, just to clarify that I hadn't messed up somewhere, But, I did copy everything word-for-word.
It's an Asus desktop. I only know the model of the CPU (AMD A6-6400K)
This some info on the graphics card (seeing that video was mentioned).
I've tried factory settings before, but the computer was even more "bogged down" and unresponsive.