I'm not going to lie, as much as I love my Lilith lore, this one has quite a few interesting promos, but what concerns me is that most of them heavily involve kit-bashing. Like, I saw her base promo and thought "Holy hell! That outfit looks amazing!" only to not be able to spot anything with those drapes in the Pro Bundle. Meanwhile, I love her skin and face in the Fallen Goddess Poses and Maxi Dress renders, only to once again, find them absent in the bundles. So, my only sliver hope for the character is that it's a something that may get released either later this week or next if it's just not another morph mixture.

You should never judge a character on what's bundled with them. I doubt most of us even have the money to spend on the 'Starter' or 'Pro' options for the majority of these characters, anyway. I've only ever obtained a very low number of them. Those are marketing deicisions from Daz and should not reflect upon the included base figure, itself.

So, what to think of Lilith 7?

I never liked how Lilith 6 was hyped as a vampire. Curvacious succubus kind of worked, but by the time Genesis 3 arrived, Arabella 7 fit the iconic vampiric look a lot better (not that I ever go with just one figure without some mix-and-match with other morphs, but Arabella 7 is an excellent base likeness to use for vampiric art).

Of course, if curves are your requirement, then Bethany is around with a number of shaping morphs (and frequently on discount for startlingly low prices). No reason you couldn't convert her into a succubus-like entity. Although, please, Daz, for the love of God, get those Creature Creator sets out there! Hallowe'en is fast coming up!

So, in regards for how Lilith 7, herself, looks? Well, she feels like she's in the category of another Victoria-alike: Perfectly fine as a generic female character, but nothing particularly unique about her features; which typically leaves me knowing I could effectively morph-dial a good approximation of her with the tools I already have. However... I must say I really like the promotional image of how she looks when mixed with other characters! Particularly love the one with 50% Lilith 7/60% Girl 7. That, combined with my mothly Platinum Club voucher, has made the decision for me. She looks like she'd allow some interesting morphed looks for other existing characters, too.

Sometimes, you obtain a character figure, not for the default appearance, but for that magical gene pool addition with another you already have. :)

Agree, those mixes helped me to decide to purchase her too. Specially, the rune and victoria combinations. And Lilith has possibly the best ass in Daz characters ever :P

The Morrigan outfit, Agnes HD and Katherine hair were interesting to me too, so I went for the Pro bundle. It's a pity about the Caged Belle outfit, as I doubt i'll ever use it.

K, first to answer Thomas:

I convert to a prop so I can use the transfer utility to copy the morphs from the original hair, to the prop hair, and have them located in the root node (as hair props almost always have only a root node). This way, when I use the transfer utility to convert the hair to G3F, the morphs are preserved.

Parenting doesn't work well with scaling, in my experience. I prefer to keep my scaling options open, as I tend to like to tweak scales. Also, if the hair hasn't actually been converted to fit the target figure, it doesn't fit as well, putting higher load on smoothing modifiers, which slows DS down. And finally, I'm particular about how I organize scenes (I optimize for speed), and hate digging through the hierarchy for parented objects. The only time I resort to parenting is with special problematic cases, like some ponytail hair. With conforming figure hair, I can put them wherever I like in the hierarchy, and they still fit the target properly.

I have several reasons for doing hair conversions the hard way:

1. Prop hairs, which auto-fit didn't work with, last time I checked (if there's some way to get AF to work with prop hairs, I'd love to know).
2. Hairs with morphs that auto-fit loses. In my experience, a lot of pre-Genesis 1 hairs fall into this category. I happen to have a lot of pre-G1 hairs that I like (more than a lot of the post-G1 hairs that I have, actually).
3. Hairs that consistently crash DS during the auto-fit process. It's not common, but it does happen. I've yet to find a single hair that gives me the same problem when converting the hard way.
4. I sometimes (usually, actually) get better results from hair converted the hard way. E.g., they bend slightly better. This usually isn't enough of a benefit to justify doing every hair the hard way, but I've gotten into the habit of doing hard conversions anyway, so...

All of that said, you have a point, I've probably gotten too much in the habit of hard conversions, and should swing back the other way and start trying auto-fit again. On the other hand, what really got me into the habit was the, oh, 2% (guesstimate) chance of crashing DS using auto-fit on hairs. I tend to be sitting on a big scene when I need a hair converted, and anything I can do to avoid a crash under these circumstances is a good thing; even if I remembered to save the scene first (sometimes I don't want to save, because I've got too much stuff in the scene and saving will take too long, and I don't want to pare it down first because that takes time, too), waiting for a heavy scene to load (and optimize the images) is a PITA.

You should never judge a character on what's bundled with them. I doubt most of us even have the money to spend on the 'Starter' or 'Pro' options for the majority of these characters, anyway. I've only ever obtained a very low number of them. Those are marketing deicisions from Daz and should not reflect upon the included base figure, itself.

So, what to think of Lilith 7?

I never liked how Lilith 6 was hyped as a vampire. Curvacious succubus kind of worked, but by the time Genesis 3 arrived, Arabella 7 fit the iconic vampiric look a lot better (not that I ever go with just one figure without some mix-and-match with other morphs, but Arabella 7 is an excellent base likeness to use for vampiric art).

Of course, if curves are your requirement, then Bethany is around with a number of shaping morphs (and frequently on discount for startlingly low prices). No reason you couldn't convert her into a succubus-like entity. Although, please, Daz, for the love of God, get those Creature Creator sets out there! Hallowe'en is fast coming up!

So, in regards for how Lilith 7, herself, looks? Well, she feels like she's in the category of another Victoria-alike: Perfectly fine as a generic female character, but nothing particularly unique about her features; which typically leaves me knowing I could effectively morph-dial a good approximation of her with the tools I already have. However... I must say I really like the promotional image of how she looks when mixed with other characters! Particularly love the one with 50% Lilith 7/60% Girl 7. That, combined with my mothly Platinum Club voucher, has made the decision for me. She looks like she'd allow some interesting morphed looks for other existing characters, too.

Sometimes, you obtain a character figure, not for the default appearance, but for that magical gene pool addition with another you already have. :)

Wow -- she's beautiful! I don't do Iray, only 3DL, but would get her for the morph and eyebrows alone. When you say "convertible for 3DL," what do you mean?

--MW

@ModernWizard,

Convertible just means that it is possible to switch over to 3DL with some work. (e.g., switch shader from iRay uber to AoA subsurface and reapply textures, etc.). I didn't want to give the impression that it is impossible. It will just take some tweaking. 

As an aside, I would like to offer a 3DL version of the skin shaders, but I am not very familiar with how to use 3DL, as all my work is done in iRay. Maybe that will change in the future though, as I learn more about character creation.

 

To all,
Glad you guys like my first character. It is reassuring that I am on the right track here. 

-P

Thanks for the reply! Do you have an ETA for her? Is she in the QA queue yet?

--MW

Also, (someone please correct me if I'm remembering things wrong, but I do believe) Adobe will transfer license of used software.

I certainly hope so.   I recently (last week) had a burgulary and someone stole all my laptops including a Surface Pro2 which I had just upgraded to CS6 solely for the purposes of digital artwork.  Fortunately had have the original on disc, but the licensing thing can get a bit dodgy.

...ahh but that would mean a "new" price as well which is why I never had PS to begin with.

No, it's not a new price. CS 6 is old software, so the price is discounted, even for a new copy of CS 6.

Also, (someone please correct me if I'm remembering things wrong, but I do believe) Adobe will transfer license of used software.

quick question!  I don't supose anyone knows of a decent English Bulldog morph for the milldog?  I need one for a commissioned render and I was hoping to save myself some time before attempting to mash one together from scratch.  Any suggestions are greatly appreciated :D

https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/mildog-improved-remapped/115572

Or, if you don't need a rigged character, there is a free prop: http://www.most-digital-creations.com/bulldog.htm

thanks! I do need rigged :) I have seen that one in Renderosity, actually.  Does anyone know if it actually works in daz, though?  The description says that's it's poser only, but I know that doesn't always mean anything

Very good question - I am not sure either. It could be that Lyrra used P10/P11 weightmapping - in that case it will NOT work in DS.

The readme shows it uses pz2 files to call PMD files and that doesn't work in Studio.

Edited to add...this is for Lyrra's reworking of the MilDog, not the HW cat. I grabbed the wonderful cat but haven't had a chance to play yet. Been really busy and haven't opened Studio for, arggghhhh, weeks. :((((((

Barbult

Here'is the path for George Body Shape 3 script

Content/data/Daz 3D/Genesis 3/Male/Morphs/Deepsea/George Body Shape 3

You can find these command line just before "morph"

]
                },
                {
                    "output" : "Genesis3Male:/data/DAZ%203D/Genesis%203/Male/Morphs/Deepsea/George%20HD%20Details/George%20HD%20Details.dsf#George%20HD%20Details?value",
                    "operations" : [
                        { "op" : "push", "url" : "Genesis3Male:#George%20Body%20Shape%203?value" },
                        { "op" : "push", "val" : 1 },
                        { "op" : "mult" }
                    ]
                },
                {
                    "output" : "Genesis3Male:/data/DAZ%203D/Genesis%203/Male/Morphs/Deepsea/George/George.dsf#George?value",
                    "operations" : [
                        { "op" : "push", "url" : "Genesis3Male:#George%20Body%20Shape%203?value" },
                        { "op" : "push", "val" : 0.75 },
                        { "op" : "mult" }
                    ]
                }
            ],

Ah. I have that file where it should be. And it explains what I did see, where George Body Shape 3 pulled in George HD even though I was using standard definition George.

Oh, I see. The preset deliberately zeroes George before it calls the "George Body Shape 3.dsf" file because THAT file calls both George and George HD. If the preset didn't zero George, it would try to double him -- which it probably couldn't do, but it might erase Body Shape 3 setting George to 75%.

I checked the zip file downloaded by DIM, modified/downloaded 10/4, and the data directory and file are definitely there, and they say what Deepsea says they should.

If you have a character with long fingernails, if you highlight the "currently used" in the parameters/shaping tab, you may be able to find the fingernail morph that is being used and turn it down perhaps? 

Oh my. I did the aging product on Sandra,  there's different face weights and it was...interesting. Poor Sandra!  This is using the Normals from the Iray product. But wait until you see Sandra as a sad little girl. Rendering now.

One question- how do we address the long fingernails? Kids don't have manicured, long fingernails. I don't recall a product that can cut fingernails. I know I can do geometry and then opague them out, or possibly a D-former, just wondering if there's a handy product. If not, a vendor should make one! 

Barbult

Here'is the path for George Body Shape 3 script

Content/data/Daz 3D/Genesis 3/Male/Morphs/Deepsea/George Body Shape 3

You can find these command line just before "morph"

]
                },
                {
                    "output" : "Genesis3Male:/data/DAZ%203D/Genesis%203/Male/Morphs/Deepsea/George%20HD%20Details/George%20HD%20Details.dsf#George%20HD%20Details?value",
                    "operations" : [
                        { "op" : "push", "url" : "Genesis3Male:#George%20Body%20Shape%203?value" },
                        { "op" : "push", "val" : 1 },
                        { "op" : "mult" }
                    ]
                },
                {
                    "output" : "Genesis3Male:/data/DAZ%203D/Genesis%203/Male/Morphs/Deepsea/George/George.dsf#George?value",
                    "operations" : [
                        { "op" : "push", "url" : "Genesis3Male:#George%20Body%20Shape%203?value" },
                        { "op" : "push", "val" : 0.75 },
                        { "op" : "mult" }
                    ]
                }
            ],

Weird. I have George Expandable as well, and I'm not seeing that.

When I load George HD and use "George Body Shape 3" from the "Character Body" folder, he gets less bulky but he's still pretty beefy. Enough smaller that, if he were a real person, you might wonder if he lost a little weight, but that's it. Before I use that option, the George and George HD sliders in the Parameters are both at 100%. After using "George Body Shape 3", a slider with that name appears in Currently Used and is at 100%, George at 75%, and George HD at 100%.

When I load George HD and use "George Character Shape 3", he gets a little shorter and a little more bulky, because that's a different slider. With that all three sliders -- George Character 3, George, George HD -- are all at 100%.

I wonder why we're getting such different results.

Just out of curiosity: @sapat, @barbuilt, are you using the Smart Content options, or using George Expandable from the Content Library? If it's Smart Content, I wonder if maybe the metadata got borked in the update, and now the Smart Content preset is missing some information? I use the Content Library directory section, and as mentioned, I'm not seeing these issues.

Do you get the same results with the standard resolution non-HD version of George? When I use that on non-HD George, the same sliders activate -- including the George HD one, which was a bit of a surprise, but not a huge deal.

We're using the body shape 3 from the Expandables pack, not from the George base pack.  Is that what you're doing as well?

I think maybe Sapat might be referring to the George Character 3 preset. In the Content Library, it sits completely outside the George folder, so it looks somewhat like it might not be part of the Expandables product. Also, it does something completely different than the George Body Shape 3 preset in the George/Character Body folder, which might add to the confusion.

@vwrangler If you examine your "\People\Genesis 3 Male\Characters\George\Character Body\George Body Shape 3.duf" in a text editor, do you see the same settings I see, where the George morph is set to 0, or do you see it set to 0.75?

Do you have the latest updated files from a couple days ago that made improvements to the teeth? I don't remember seeing this problem before that update. I don't have an old version of the files to go back and look at.

I have the latest updated files, and I see exactly what you see.

{
    "file_version" : "0.6.0.0",
    "asset_info" : {
        "id" : "/People/Genesis%203%20Male/Characters/George/Character%20Body/George%20Body%20Shape%203.duf",
        "type" : "preset_shape",
        "contributor" : {
            "author" : "Deepsea",
            "email" : "",
            "website" : ""
        },
        "revision" : "1.0",
        "modified" : "2016-09-27T20:19:53Z"
    },
    "scene" : {
        "animations" : [
            {
                "url" : "name://@selection#George%20Body%20Shape%201:?value/value",
                "keys" : [ [ 0, 0 ] ]
            },
            {
                "url" : "name://@selection#George%20Body%20Shape%202:?value/value",
                "keys" : [ [ 0, 0 ] ]
            },
            {
                "url" : "name://@selection#George%20Body%20Shape%203:?value/value",
                "keys" : [ [ 0, 1 ] ]
            },
            {
                "url" : "name://@selection#George:?value/value",
                "keys" : [ [ 0, 0 ] ]
            },
            {
                "url" : "name://@selection#George%20HD%20Details:?value/value",
                "keys" : [ [ 0, 1 ] ]
            }
        ]
    }
}

According to the file, it should be setting both overall George and George body to 0,0. But for some reason, it's doing exactly what Deepsea says it should.

Thank you Greg! It's all Growing Up, no tweaking on the morphs, then Apocalyptic light set with several point lights.

I have a question- there's a V4 character over at Rendo that has great brows- SO natural. But it says for Poser 7+, Poser Pro, Game Development. Can I use her in Daz Studio? I'm wonderfing if I can even transfer the V4 to Gen 2 (the materials) then apply an Iray converter, etc. These brows are so awesome- and would be stunning for kids. But Poser- I haven't a clue if I can use them. Help! 

http://www.daz3d.com/victoria-4-for-genesis-2-female

That is a FANTASTIC product! :D I really love being able to use V4 textures on G2F. That product also lets you use V4 clothing and shoes on G2F. I can't recommend it enough! :)

Thank you Greg! It's all Growing Up, no tweaking on the morphs, then Apocalyptic light set with several point lights.

I have a question- there's a V4 character over at Rendo that has great brows- SO natural. But it says for Poser 7+, Poser Pro, Game Development. Can I use her in Daz Studio? I'm wonderfing if I can even transfer the V4 to Gen 2 (the materials) then apply an Iray converter, etc. These brows are so awesome- and would be stunning for kids. But Poser- I haven't a clue if I can use them. Help! 

http://www.daz3d.com/victoria-4-for-genesis-2-female

new facial morph that cooperates with the rigging tweaks!  Updated the brows as well to blend better into the skin, some tweaking on settings and now to work on details on the bump and spec maps.

He's kind of cute!  :)  He has an interesting look with that jaw and square chin. 

Thank you Greg! It's all Growing Up, no tweaking on the morphs, then Apocalyptic light set with several point lights.

I have a question- there's a V4 character over at Rendo that has great brows- SO natural. But it says for Poser 7+, Poser Pro, Game Development. Can I use her in Daz Studio? I'm wonderfing if I can even transfer the V4 to Gen 2 (the materials) then apply an Iray converter, etc. These brows are so awesome- and would be stunning for kids. But Poser- I haven't a clue if I can use them. Help! 

...one issue I had using the Brow Remover and then Real Brows for G3F was after saving the file and opening it in Daz later I got one of those "cannot find" errors (like what happens when a path to a texture or morph is messed up) that opened up a totally unrelated folder when I clicked on  the "search" button.  I cancelled which required re-applying the original face map.  The  Real Brows I created were still parented to the character but obscured by the painted on brow from the original face map so it made me wonder what I may have done wrong when removing the original brows (I followed all the steps in both tutorials).

Thanks for the link diomede! Interesting and helpful.

Another tip I learned is to angle the loops surounding the geometry where you want it to bend. I made a quickie example where the first "elbow" has straight loops, the second "elbow" has angled loops (and I got sloppy so there is an unnatural bulge, sorry), but you can see it "collapses" a little but better, could be near perfect with some adjustments and fussing maybe, but I'm pretty lazy so I just created a morph for the last image. But like I said, the "rest" position of the angled loops is pretty lame looking, but I think you get the idea. You can do this for any bending joint area, angle those loops to minimize ugly collapsing. Hope that makes sense...

Your tips are impressive, Morkonan! But my version of poser is Poser Pro 2012 (yes, I'm a dinossaur). Also a have a very onl machine, I only use morph tool to adjust clothing, since the computer almost gasps with poser. I used magnets to change the morph and elongate it more, but the other two are truly kiling me. I'm almost giving up, to be honest...

About the morphs, I found a 3D file (freebie) of Jar Jar, maybe I can chop his head off and franksntein something with M4...

Now might be an excellent time to suggest folks visit the communism link in my signature. I have some iris shape morphs for gen3 there. A lot of Genesis's problems aren't helped by the eye geometry. Using my morphs to change the shape of the iris plus the cornea bulge morph (I usually set that one to 150%) that comes with the DAZ morph sets makes a world of difference. Also make sure the cornea has thin walled set off otherwise it doesn't handle refraction as well IMO.

J.Cade, I installed this morph, where do I find it?  In shapping or parameters?