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LOL, funny how we all have different perspectives. I found the default V4, V5 and V6 to be to chubby for my tastes and luckily I could change that with GenX. On the other hand, I find that V7 looks prettuy good and I don't have to change as much, maybe a touch of thin and fitness to suit my tastes.
Directly from my posterior ;) And I'm not denying that there are plenty of excellent vendors that make unique looking morphs SAV for instance is one I would imediately think of for unique looking characters, But again IMO those characters are outnumbered by the number of characters that look like V4 with a few dials spun. Perhaps another way to put it is V4 characters tend to look more like V4 than they do different from one another. And thats not even getting into differring bodyshapes.
But as I mentioned "looks better" and even "looks different" are really more personal taste. For instance I think Godin's V4 charaters are very V4-y looking, But that doesn't mean everyone will, and thats fine.
As someone who has not yet fallen for the charms of V7 (or G3F anybody), a more pertinent question for me would be, what are the advantages of V7 over V6 and her G2F friends? I have looked at the promo pictures throughout the store and failed to find anything that would entice me to embark on a new spending spree (not that I can afford to do so anyway) on G3F based characters and clothing.
I bought into G2F because I was impressed by the detail HD brings. I found I had to buy several extra morph packages to get the versatility I had with V4. I also bought the clones, etc. so that I could use V4 content with G2F but, sadly, the conversion of clothing from V4 to G2F is poor to abysmal. Also I have things like Beatiful Bends which do a decent job so I'm not convinced that G3F is worth buying for the realistic bending.
By the way, I agree with Peter Fulford (above) and his observations about the upper-inner thigh area - on G2F too.
It is quite simple. V7 has a health problem, she is anorexic.
it is harder to get good results out of G3F.
Hipbone and Hip crest on G3F is worse, it looks worse and if it comes to bendings it is getting much worse.
but even with HD morphs and such stuff it is much more difficult to get good resluts out of G3F even when it comes to the face. The face of V4 and its mrophs were much better.
You are absolutely right. Many V4 characters look much better, much much much better than these new anorexic models.
What I say the whole time. They had to improve V4 instead of creating new figures looking much worse. Bendings and so okay, these are improvements. The figures themselves (Characters and morphs) are not.
even if the latest and newest product is not really better when it comes to the look.
I got still asked by many people when I go back and create Dixie renders (Dixie is V4) because Dixie (V4) looks way better they say. And they are right, body of G3F okay, that is an improvement in some ways but the face is not and I can do what I want and try and try and try I am not even close to get a G3F Dixie. It is impossible.
What makes me most angry is, that one isn`t allowed to post images of the problematic regions of G3F because nude images are not allowed, a good way to silence criticism.
They should have taken V4, make a wheight mapped figure out of her with all the bending improvements and bring her out new with her morphs++ That is what DAZ should have done didn`t.
And by the way. HD morphs. V4 has more details than G3F and if you use HD morphs it goes to the recources of the machine, why? for a view rips that V4 have as standard? For dimple creases? G3F has no rips it is a flat ripcage for example. (Just one example). Face : dimple creases also not and for that HD morphs that as written slows the machine? Really good improvement.
Just a question for the contributors here: do you use these figures out-of-the-box, as it were? I have to say that a great deal of the pleasure I get from this hobby is in creating my own, "real-world" shapes and sizes. V4/V6 and all the other main figures are my starting point. I have Zev0's morphs, Beautiful Bends and a bundle of other figure shaping add-ons which are great fun to play with. I hardly ever buy characters unless they have an unusal shape/skin that I'm drawn to. So I have Joanie, Bellatrix and MeeMoo because they are so different from the flawless glamour models usually on offer. I think Joanie HD is my all time favourite, in fact.
I'm sorry, I think people need to look up anorexic.. It's an awful eating disorder and G3/V7 are nowhere close to being anorexic. People bandy that term around, but it's a hideous disease and shouldn't be used if you mean thin. V4 can look quite thin as well. It's all in how the figure is morphed.
If someone doesn't like the way a figure looks there are plenty of ways to work with the model to make her look the way you want. If you can't make morphs yourself, you are limited to what others make. With that in mind, you may not be able to achieve exactly what you want. That doesn't mean the model is not capable of having morphs that will produce what you want. G3 is quite morphable. As someone who works with the Daz meshes on an almost daily basis, I can attest to this.
I mean the cheeks dimples, not the crease. Such little details I really miss but I think that is not possible with these new low res SubD figures like G3F because this is the main difference between G3F and all Genesis figures and V4. V4 is a high resolution figure and these genesis figures are not, these genesis figures are low res figures. And if you make a SubD Character out of V4 like I have done you get much better results on details than with these genesis figures. Sure a SubD V4 is also recource eating but not that much than a G3F with HD morphs. And that is what I do not get. A low resolution figure with HD morphs cost more recources of the machine than a high resolution figure as SubD without HD but also with details in some body regions. And my V4 cost recources also because of some "specifics" she/it has than a normal V4 also as SubD has not. Badabing shaping tool, overhaul for DS and some other extra morphs + a real genital prob because she is a WWG II (woman with genitals which is based on V4) so she has an added gen figure which is also SubD.
There should be no reason to sub-d V4. While sub-d does increase the polygons it decreases details as the new polygons are averaged and smoothed. Make a cube and sub-d it a couple of time and it starts to become a sphere losing its sharp edges.
As I already posted, I prever V4 to V7; but I hate V7, and never use her or the skin. I'd return her if it was way over thirty days.
V4 is old tech; does that mean that it is obsolete? No. It does, however, mean that a lot more additons are required to get the model up to G3 level.
But look at the art produced, that should be part of your determination; which allows me to better produce what I want?
Folks still produce great images with V4, and probably will for years yet.
go back and look at any PA's V4 characters. They will all share a resemblance. I also think folks forget they are comparing a new product to a much more mature product. Both 3DL and V4. Anyone go back and look at some early 3DL renders or early V4? Pretty bad compared to now.
The expressions are what is making me move to use G3. You can achieve much more realistic facial expressions with G3 than you can with any previous DAZ female model. The posing is also much better without having to add a bunch of additional packages. I wish there was a better/more diverse set of facial sculpting dial packages out there for G3 though. I've bought the few that are available and they just don't offer the same range of customization as the packages for V4 did. I don't think that's a shortcomming of the model itself, just the availabilty of 3rd party packages in this area. Guess I should learn how to do my own morphs. The main drawback for G3 is that it can't be used in Poser, which is where I started. With the DRM on the horizon for Studio, it makes me a bit leary of completely comitting to G3 (and beyond). We'll see how it goes. While there are pose correction packages for V4 and G2, there's nothing out there that fixes their limited range of facial expressions - I think it would take some serious morphing or even model editing to get where G3 is in that department.
finer "realism" results with normals, bumps and displacements on closeups is a reason, at least in LuxRender.
When I put Iray skins on V4, I found it useful to add a little subd for stuff to stand out.
I don't what you guys are talking about. I don't see those morphs looking the same. We must be in a different dimension.
As for your analysis, where did you get that I didn't know the difference between a figure that's been around for years vs one the came out recently. My question was a valid one. Most of the Gn3F stuff is coming out looking about the same. So I asked whether this had to do with the new bones in the face or whatever. A simple question really.
Lets remember to keep the conversation civil.
Per TOS:
#2 Criticism should be directed towards the subject or topic at hand, rather than an individual. Posts which make blanket, unreasoned criticisms - of other members, of Daz 3D, of products or applications, or of merchants and their products - may be removed in a general effort to control negativity.
No, it has to do with a particular style that any PA favors. Certainly, the mesh is very sculptable. It deforms quite beautifully. The bones in the face facilitate morphing, particularly expressions. Personally, I find that a large number of vendors, in general, go for a particular type of female face (either because they like it or they believe will be more appealing to their customers, or both). I can tell some vendors by the style of lips and facial structure. That doesn't mean the mesh isn't capable of more and different, just that a vendor has preferences. There are plenty of vendors that strive to go for the different. I try to do that. Some will agree, others will not. It's always in how others perceive your work.
As a technical point, that's fair enough. A trained eye will be able to spot aspects of a model that are deeply set. But a look around (for example) StudioArtVartanian's offerings at Renderosity will quickly illustrate what a limited point it is (applies to M4 perhaps even moreso). These are (famous) people you know, not just V4 with eyeliner.
Will we get similar diversity out of G3/V7? I hope so.
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well, if you visit my gallery and have a look at all "DIXIE" renders, she is SubD and looks good as SubD :)
I never use any character out of the box. I discovered how to sculpt a full body morph during the V4 days and created a couple of morphs based on what I would consider the perfect female shape (my tastes based on a few models/dancers I know). These 4 shapes, thanks to GenX have been my base for all my characters up till GF3. While I wait for GenX to work with GF3, I have a few shapes I have done with the dials that I am happy with, so no, I never use any of the canned character shapes for the body, but do look for unique face morphs. My fav is Bianca for V4 from Liquid Rust which I use on all the genesis figures till now.
@ jestmart
Well that is what I want, a smooth character (body not face). Dixie (my selfmade character) is a bit chubby so she has to be smoother then these anorexic characters like V7 and so is AVA (my G3F character) she is also a bit more chubby :) but it was very difficult to get the body smoother without loosing the nipples and other details.
but over all, G3F is not so bad, the bendings are good and also the fitting of clothes is also not bad. And it is way easier to pose G3F then to pose V4 (poses I need and create) I use her right now but will also use V4 because of the wishes of a lot of people to do more Dixie renders. And what I most like are the tons of morphs that can be added to G3F
There was a glitch where this and another very large thread got merged. I have tried to correctly separate this and the http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/65813/show-us-your-iray-renders-part-iv/p1 threads. If I inadvertently left posts in the wrong thread, please pm me to let me know so I can rectify it.
I made the following having absolutely nothing beyond basic G3F stuff (because I have no interest in migrating to G3F any time soon).
It looks pretty darn sculptable to me!
I mean, sure, it looks like Dopey's older sister, but with practice I could do something different. At the VERY least, I think you could pull off broad noses and different ethnic eyeshapes pretty easily. With no morphs.
I'm loving V6 right now because of the utilities enabling her to wear V4/V5 clothes and use V4/V5 skins and morphs.
I think once V7 has more backwards compatability with 3rd party addons... then she'll really be the ultimate so far.
I'd love to know how you get V4 clothes on V6. I've got the necessary utilities to do the conversions but, apart from something like a bikini, nothing really works very well. To be more precise: I can run the conversion and apply smoothing (has to be Generic, not Base Matching) and all looks near perfect in T-Pose. But the moment I start to pose her, all manner of distortions are apparent and no amount of dial-turning can fix it.
Genesis One clothes do convert well to G2F, for the most part.
I have not played a lot with it, but the V4 clothes need to be weight mapped first. Then they should be able to be smoothed like Genesis clothes and also work well with poses.
Autofit converts them to weight-mapped.
Thanks Fixmypcmike!
Think I've been doing the long way :P
Isn't Autofit part of the conversion process anyway?
As I use Poser and not Daz, V4 / V6 are the only ones we can and will use.