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Looking for Advice/Opinions on a Product I'm Making

Lucky13guyLucky13guy Posts: 92
edited August 22 in The Commons

I’m building a Magic, the Gathering deck and accessories for Daz, but I’m torn on how to handle the deck part of my build.

I’m making a commander deck, which has 100 different cards. My first thought was to just have all 100 cards in a group and create some hierarchical poses to shuffle the deck, lay out certain cards, etc. But then I started thinking, “What if I rigged it instead?” I know some of the pros and cons of grouping and rigging the deck, but I’m curious to see what others think would be the best option from a user point of view. Would you guys find it easier to have the deck rigged, or grouped?

Thanks in advance!

Post edited by Lucky13guy on

Comments

  • felisfelis Posts: 5,772

    I must admit I have never played the Gathering.

    But I think I would find it most usefull in a group. Then a player could sit with the card in his hand (or a cat running away with it).

  • Lucky13guyLucky13guy Posts: 92

    felis said:

    I must admit I have never played the Gathering.

    But I think I would find it most usefull in a group. Then a player could sit with the card in his hand (or a cat running away with it).

    Haha! I love the cat idea! And I could totally see my cat doing that!

  • Phoenix1966Phoenix1966 Posts: 1,841

    If this is not a freebie for non-commercial use, you'll want to create your own cards and not use IP protected ones like Edgar Markov(unless that is just a placeholder for your original ones). 

    I think groups would be the way to go.

  • jmucchiellojmucchiello Posts: 627

    I don't think all 100 cards in a single rig is a good idea at all. They will usually not be in the same place when a game is being "played". And not all setups will want all 100 cards in play. A lot of the cards in a scene will be face down and can just be instances.

    A rigged hand with fanned card, a rigged "play mat" with deck, graveyard, etc would be cool. But the important part of any "cards" setup is that the user can apply individual card images to the fronts and backs, (Why backs? So the deck can be used for CCGs of other kinds besides MTG.

    OTOH, if you just provide G8/G9 card in hand partial poses and card objects that are props and objects that are wearables, most of the other stuff can be done with objects and instances.

    Poses for rolling/holding a die could be useful too.

    Shuffling the deck probably could be unrigged as long as the backs can be replaced (not individually). Unless you are serious about like providing an animated shuffle. smiley

    At that point, I'd wonder about the price point. 

  • Lucky13guyLucky13guy Posts: 92

    Phoenix1966 said:

    If this is not a freebie for non-commercial use, you'll want to create your own cards and not use IP protected ones like Edgar Markov(unless that is just a placeholder for your original ones). 

    I think groups would be the way to go. 

    Yeah, this will eventually be a freebie, so I'm not too worried. Just something I had a crazy idea to make, so I thought I'd give it a shot. Lol.

  • Lucky13guyLucky13guy Posts: 92

    jmucchiello said:

    I don't think all 100 cards in a single rig is a good idea at all. They will usually not be in the same place when a game is being "played". And not all setups will want all 100 cards in play. A lot of the cards in a scene will be face down and can just be instances.

    A rigged hand with fanned card, a rigged "play mat" with deck, graveyard, etc would be cool. But the important part of any "cards" setup is that the user can apply individual card images to the fronts and backs, (Why backs? So the deck can be used for CCGs of other kinds besides MTG.

    OTOH, if you just provide G8/G9 card in hand partial poses and card objects that are props and objects that are wearables, most of the other stuff can be done with objects and instances.

    Poses for rolling/holding a die could be useful too.

    Shuffling the deck probably could be unrigged as long as the backs can be replaced (not individually). Unless you are serious about like providing an animated shuffle. smiley

    At that point, I'd wonder about the price point. 

    I didn't think it would be a great idea either, but I'm no expert, so I figured I'd ask just in case I hadn't thought of a really good reason to rig it. Lol.

    You're reading my mind on all your other ideas. I figured more people out there might prefer Pokemon, or some other TCG, so I made the front and back of each card a separate surface. And I'm planning on making dice and a playmat next, then I'll work on poses. laugh

    As for price point, that would be a big, whoppin, $0. I started this project just for fun, but decided if it ends up being decent enough, I'll probably give it away as a freebie.  

  • crosswindcrosswind Posts: 9,575
    edited August 23

    I used to be an MTG player many many years ago but now I mainly play MTGO ~~ Well, since you're not making game-ready assets but just assets for DS, then two cents from me:

    - Make one card case like the black+red one shown in the above image. Rig it as a figure so that it can be opened.
    - Make one card Prop. The card needs a thickness to certain extent. You'll not have to make two surfaces for it but just a good UV will do ~. 

    Then to make a Deck, whatever for the case, library, graveyard or exile... etc., create Instance Nodes with a Card then form them as a Deck with Align plugin. That'll be a very easy process.

    To make cards in hand, battlefield or wherever needed, two options:1) group of Card props; 2) a rigged figure with multiple cards and control the number of cards (actually shown or hidden...) by using Conditional Graft. (I personally prefer to this way 'cause that'll be interesting, as you can show / hide card(s) as well as make the cards have sort of different  forms or "a bit messy form..." by translating / rotating them separately with morph properties... etc .etc.)

    Finally, save them as Scene Sub-sets, Pose Presets, Mat Presets, etc... as needed.  Suggest you make a PSD template as per the card UV layout so that the users can easily add MTG card images for the use of their own ~~

    Edit: If you really want to make it as a freebie, you may go for the easier ways ~blush

    Post edited by crosswind on
  • MattymanxMattymanx Posts: 6,996

    Static props would make more sense to me.  You would only need to make one card and then 100 textures for it.  Would be good if the center point of hte card, that point around which it will rotate, is at the center of the card.  If the card has enought geometry, you could also make some bending morphs for ir

  • crosswindcrosswind Posts: 9,575

    Yeah, if you make the card enough polygons, technically you can further create bend morphs as you wish. But playing MTG is not like Hold'em or other "gambling card games", i.e. we don't really need to bend MTG cards haha ~~ esp. with the cards of R / MR.

  • Lucky13guyLucky13guy Posts: 92

    Mattymanx said:

    Static props would make more sense to me.  You would only need to make one card and then 100 textures for it.  Would be good if the center point of hte card, that point around which it will rotate, is at the center of the card.  If the card has enought geometry, you could also make some bending morphs for ir

    I ended up doing it a little differently so I didn't have to have 100 different textures. I created 4 different UVs for my card so I could put 4 images per texture. And I modeled the card with morphs in mind, cause I wanted to be able to put a little curl in the foil cards.

     

    crosswind said:

    Yeah, if you make the card enough polygons, technically you can further create bend morphs as you wish. But playing MTG is not like Hold'em or other "gambling card games", i.e. we don't really need to bend MTG cards haha ~~ esp. with the cards of R / MR.

    Yeah, we definitely don't bend and fold them, but what about that authentic "magic curl" that you get with so many foils? Lol. That was actually the only reason I even wanted morph it in the first place. More realism. Haha

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,861

    felis said:

    I must admit I have never played the Gathering.

    But I think I would find it most usefull in a group. Then a player could sit with the card in his hand (or a cat running away with it).

    ...I participated in a playtest group at a sci-fi convention before it was released.  I felt it was "niche" and sort of "quaint" but rather limited in scope compared to the established tabletop role-play games that were highly popular at the time.  As I was walking down the hallway I gave a kid the box with the deck I used. 

    I don't ever want to know what it may be worth today, particularly when I would see the prices on some rare and one of a kind cards in game stores.

    Other companies got on board with their own card based games but they never developed the widespread following that Magic still enjoys. 

    Interestingly Wizards of the Coast which pioneered ( the fantasy card game concept (and now dominates market) purchased the TSR, the owner of the oldest and most famous RPG franchise, Dungeons and Dragons back in 1997. 

  • crosswindcrosswind Posts: 9,575

    crosswind said:

    Yeah, if you make the card enough polygons, technically you can further create bend morphs as you wish. But playing MTG is not like Hold'em or other "gambling card games", i.e. we don't really need to bend MTG cards haha ~~ esp. with the cards of R / MR.

    Yeah, we definitely don't bend and fold them, but what about that authentic "magic curl" that you get with so many foils? Lol. That was actually the only reason I even wanted morph it in the first place. More realism. Haha

    Indeed ! I usually had the foil partially bent near the seal before giving it a little yank ... But if making a foil prop in which you really don't need to literally place any cards there, making it a partial foil bend morph will just do, hoho ~

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