When will the next generation figure come?
lupus1982_face2d5d4a
Posts: 2
just a question, I stopped with V4.2/M4 because they were very versatile and many products made for them. The plus was they were available for quite some time so the vendors could concentrate on them. But since 2 years you flood the markets with new base figures as if there is nothing else. I thought about getting genesis figures because it seems logical and easy to change male/femals characters and their clothes. But then just a few weeks later, Gen2, now Gen3, so when comes Gen4,5,6,...1111111? Couldn't you just take while and make one figure as perfect and morphable with all the features the old ones had so that also all third-party vendors are able to provide over a longer time new clothes, addons, additional morphs as it was with V3 and V4? Honestly I don't get why always starting a new base figure if the previous is not yet fully developed and did not even have so much products and possibilities as it was before you started it all with DS4 shiny here newer and shinier there mentality. I have not even seen the same morphs for a Gen figure than I had on the old ones. Tested it with a friend who tried to get on with all your updates and I was not even able to recreate so many of my own morphed V4.2 and M4 chars in a Gen2 or Gen1 figure. So why should we not stop buying all new stuff when nothing of it will be compatible with each other. I mean now we have V7, just a few weeks ago V6 was presented as oh so new and cool. The vendors are also fragged up and need to do it all anew. Sorry but I am out of this.
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There was about two years between Genesis and Genesis 2 Female (it is hard to measure as Genesis released with the beta of DS4, so the starting point is unclear). It was two years pretty exactly between Genesis 2 Female (and Victoria 6) and Genesis 3 Female (and Victoria 7). Two years per generation is pretty standard - the fourth generation was exceptional, and its tail-off as Poser users continued to use it as the latest after Genesis was released has possibly made it seem even longer.
Technology in the realm of CG keeps improving at a much faster pace now, if Daz does not keep up with the curve, then someone else will come out something better and will lose the market. Active customers always want the best that they can get, so that market has to be provided for.
Whenever it happens, some will say it's too soon; others will have a different view.
But whenever it happens, each individual has the choice, upgrade or not; you existing content is still useful if you find it so.
I just hope they hit a point where they have a more scalable model so there's not such a disjunct between levels. That might very well be impossible or highly unlikely, I don't know. But it'd be nice. ;)
Me, my biggest hope is some sort of procedurally generated skin technology so that there's more ability to have model-agnostic texturing.
Its definitely a contentious issue. I like that the models are always evolving and improving and I do find myself wanting the most technologically advanced figure available in a quest for perfection. But at the same time I hate the lack of compatibility between generations and the inevitable obsoletion of items in my product library and subsequent need to re-buy those items for the new generation (such as shoes and skins). If they could find a way to avoid that it would take the hesitation out of upgrading to the next gen each time for me.
That said, I still maintain that all of the best character designs are still V4 ones (usually the PA ones). Character design (humans) has deteriorated since then, in my opinion.
Daz also worked hard to keep some level of compatibility between generations for a long time. It is just ith Gen3 that they finally decided that it was time to make a big change in how things were done. You can only keep the older compatibility going for so long.
But it is something they were well aware of and worked hard to provide. That is why it was so easy to fit skins and clothes and such from older generations to the earlier genesis figures. Even with Gen3, alot of the earlier genesis stuff still works with varying degrees of compatibility. That says alot of how hard they try to keep things functional.
Yeah, I have to say I appreciate the fact that SO MUCH stuff can be interchanged between V/M4, Genesis, and Genesis2. Skins, props, etc. With GenX2 you can even move morphs back and forth for more specialty stuff.
And, heck, you can still use props and most clothing pretty well with Genesis 3. So it's not a COMPLETE reset.
Really when you think in terms of other tech stuff a 2 year turnover is pretty normal.
The question is what is the next thing that needs to be incorporated, as much as some of the forumites think Daz upgrades to upgrade each new generation really has had a reason to be created: Genesis 1 was the birth of autofollow + weightmapped rigging, Genesis 2 reintroduced gendered bases, because as it turns out building female clothes on a mesh without breasts or hips was not easy. Genesis 3 introduced a new texture setup enabling more resolution and a switch to a more common/forward compatible weightmapping system. Point of fact, pretty much all of these are bigger changes that the shift from V3>V4, (and have more compatibility to boot)
Part of the reason V4 lasted so long was there wasn't that much to be done to improve her at that point, Remember, at the point Genesis came out there was no weight mapping or subdivision in Poser. I wonder if part of the reason V4 lasted so long is that Daz was waiting for poser to introduce rigging improvements in poser, before eventually deciding that they couldn't wait any longer. And then having to develop what they wanted for Studio
I'm hoping the next switch for characters is something like this.
@timmins My guess into the future would be the compatibility for G3>G4 would be more similar to G1>G2. At some point there had to be an update to the texture mapping setup, Its been the same since the onset of V4 and back then most textures weren't even 4k, Thats really the main incompatibility, but I would guess they'll keep it this way for as long as possible now.
Compared to a lot of other models in the market place, I think DAZ and its vendors do a good job in allowing you to use a lot of the older content on the latest figures. Morphs and clothing can transfer up relatively easily, although I know this is problematic for certain clothing, like long skirts and shoes. Generation 3 has made changes making skin migration much more difficult, but you can still use all your V4/M4 skins on Genesis 2, which is still a very good base model.
When I bought the panel for Dynamic clothing, at first I was incredibly annoyed that nearly all the clothing was V4-era.
Then I figured out it really didn't matter. Yay!
(I mean, fine, it makes it a LITTLE easier for the starting pose, but only a little)
Dear TS,
Ever wonder why there are Windows 98, XP, Vista, Server, 2000, 7, 8, 8.1, and 10?
Actually, I prefer the V4 stuff; it doesn't insist on parenting itself to the model; I can just get on with animate-poseing it.
I don't think it will help the business in the end, for the quality is already so high that many people might want to save their money and skip a generation and wait for the next which is coming soon anyway.
And at some point the technology will become so good that any improvement will be so marginal that it won't justify the cost. Even rendering speed will reach an optimum for whether it takes 1 minute or 1 hour to render a 2 hour HQ movie doesn't matter much, unless you produce 10+ movies a day which I doubt anyone will ever do, for there won't be a market for so many because it still takes 2 hours to watch the movie or those 1000 still renders no matter how fast you can produce them.
Of course, you can set your DVD or BR player to play at 32x but I don't think many will like that, and even at 2x it is starting to get hard to understand what people say even with pitch control. Some technologies reach their optimum when they hit the limits of human perception...
It'll be interesting to see what DAZ does whenever that point is reached, assuming that they're still around then.
you never know microsoft might buy daz they buy out everything else then you'll have to contantly upgrade and older stuff wont work at all hopefully daz will never sell oh I like new shiny stuff btw gen2 was my intro still use still like but love g3 have some older stuff v4/genesis got on the cheap but I prefer g2/g3 I can do more with them
You said it for me. That's the reason I'm still sticking to good ol' Genesis. Frankly, I find V7's looks unappealing and Scott 6 is just too stocky for my liking.
Re-buying the items for the new generation is all very well as long as the items are re-made to be useable for the new generation. Which unfortunately is not always the case.
Absolutely my opinion. This comment I can sign. And every new figure gets worse than the one before (bad crafted morphs, less opportunities for self designing an own character - at first it looks that you have more options but on a closer look you have not)
Thank you for your comment. You are absolutely right.
it's all ready happening, more and more people lost the interest in poser because they are late with improvements to the software. (people see what results blender can do today)
The blender imperium is growing really fast and even daz can 't change that against a carrara or hex modeler.
Also the real human project is in the very right direction and growing fast, it's very well supported to import in your daily use main software.
The main problem here is not figure/content, it's the main software to play with all this content that need to change faster/better (if they still like to move on offcourse).
Dazstudio 5 and it's promises is on high wanted list of many, guess even more as new content.
I editted this as some posts were no longer there.
I did initially have some concerns, and I'm still not happy with it, that muscle groups were ignored when determing the flow of geometry; I am, however, seeing much better bends on the stock/basic figures for G3F; I'm not talking about what can be bought for earlier generations to improve how bends and deformations work, but the default figure.
I see folks comparing a model that has had two, or in the case of Victoria 4, many years of development (and all the products that have been released to assist and improve) with a brand new model: that is rather disingenuous; I'm interested to see how G3F (and the male version) develop over the next couple of years.
I may have my concerns, but it will be interesting to watch (and no doubt costly as I see the latest must-have product), but I don't have to buy it: it is my choice.
Its an opinion, not a fact. Many people, including myself, prefer the newer figures, but that does not mean you can not continue to use the older stuff if you prefer it.
Slowly (very slowly) surely I will get a relativly good face for my new character (my opinion) but in some way something is needed on the face, anyone an idea or suggestion?
QFT. There are a lot of opinions out there, and if someone has the opinion A is worse than B, then don't use A. I still play video games from the 90's :) If I stated I preferred games from the 90's, people might respect that. If I said it's a fact games from the 90's were better, it may be hard for people to take me seriously.
I still mostly use G2F (but that's still pretty new tech IMO), but when I get to work with G3F I enjoy the natural elbow bends, how fast it is to pose/morph create expressions compared to the older Genesis figures. She seems "light weight" and Daz studio is way more responsive with her. Don't get me started on V4, she used to lock up my computer if I injected morphs wrong :( (user error, I get it. But It's not possible to have this issue anymore, yay! Remember not being able to have morph X and morph Y injected at the same time...lame...Gone forever that limitation)
I've seen a lot of great G3F faces and body morphs, and some not so impressive ones. I wouldn't generalize that the entire generation so far is bad or poorly crafted however.
As an aside, I'd love to be able to take the game design and ideas from the 90s and combine with modern graphics... mmm.
I'd say you're doing well with that, but would probably be best to put it in your own thread where you've been discussing the face, so that it doesn't derail this one.
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/64034/victoria-4-body-and-face-for-g3f#latest
well, breasts are not good crafted and and if you move the legs to side and bend them the this also effects the hip-bone. Never saw such in real life that a hip bone gets moved when legs move.
the whole geometry doesn`t fit to poses and morphs. Also the pubic bone area works not correct. Okay, this and the breast/ripcage and hipbone/leg issue are probably just details, but details make a good figure and these details are not good.