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Is there a way I can flip a clothing item?

Sphinx MagooSphinx Magoo Posts: 586
in The Commons

I used to be able to do this back in the old days with Poser, so I'm looking for a way to do this nowadays...

Let's say I have a clothing item like the Vrakaros Armor (which I'm not picking on specifically; it just happened to be the first item I saw when I searched the DAZ store) with shoulder armor for half of the body but not the other. In the old days, I could select the armor, scale it -100 percent along the X axis, conform it to my figure, and it would follow the poses on the opposite side of the body. So, in the case of the Vrakaros Armor, I could scale it, conform it, and then pose the figure and have a grand time. Usually I would take something like Vrakaros and cover both shoulders because I like my characters to be well-armored.  wink

Is this technique possible in DAZ Studio, or would I have to scale it -100 percent, export it as an OBJ, re-import it and then do something to re-rig the item?

I can't test right now, but I recall seeing someone state that this was possible. Does anyone have an inkling if there's a tutorial link or video that shows how something like this can be done?

Much thanks in advance for any help anyone can provide.

 

Comments

  • larsmidnattlarsmidnatt Posts: 4,511
    edited October 2015

    Is this technique possible in DAZ Studio, or would I have to scale it -100 percent, export it as an OBJ, re-import it and then do something to re-rig the item?

    This would work. You would just use the transfer utilty to auto rig it. However  for metal armor, it might butcher it (won't be rigid) but for cloth it should be fine.

    Not sure if there is a simplier way, but this method isn't that hard. I've done it a few times.

    If I was doing this I would put the clothes on the unmorphed figure. Zero out the pose and shape. It will make it easier.

    1. with the clothes not fit to the shape, scale it in the X axis -100, you may need to show hidden properties to see this
    2. export obj
    3. import obj
    4. use transfer utility
      1. source would be the figure
      2. Target would be the obj you imported
      3. defaults for rest of settings should be fine
    5. success? Worked for me at least.

    These are just quick steps assuming you know your way around a bit. Can explain more if needed. (in my case I just sent to hexagon and back as it's quicker than setting up obj settings and I was just testing this so no need to have an obj sitting around)

    This is also assuming the clothes you want are the same generation as the figure. If not you need to auto fit them first. Then unfit them and follow those steps.

    Post edited by larsmidnatt on
  • Sphinx MagooSphinx Magoo Posts: 586

    Thanks, larsmidnatt.

    I finally got a chance to try your suggestion out, and after a few tries I got most of it to work. I ran into a couple of issues when I used the Heracles set as my experimental piece:

    1) It is an armor piece. How might I maintain the rigidity so that the metal pieces don't bend.

    2) Transfer Utility used the Genesis Neck for the shoulder guard so that it distorts when I pose the neck. Is there a way to change that?

    3) Is there a way to look at the original un-mirrored Heracles chest piece to see how it is rigged? Maybe I can tweak the rigging so it matches the original more closely.

    If this is beyond what you'd like to help with, please let me know. If there's a video or tutorial that addresses these issues, just point me in that direction. Otherwise, this has been pretty exciting to try out! I've been mystified about what to do for quite a while and this is actually fun! Thanks for your help!

     

    HeraclesChestSample.jpg
    500 x 375 - 73K
  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,085

    Your best bet, with metal pieces, is to see if you can not have them autofit and just pose/scale them appropriately, perhaps with a little collision to get some of the edges to flow well.

    This is a frequent problem/complaint.

     

  • larsmidnattlarsmidnatt Posts: 4,511
    edited October 2015

    yeah rigidity is a pain, and why I mentioned it earlier because I KNEW it was going to come up when you said armor. I can't help there, there are some threads on it but I think a lot of people basically give up. I've had very minor success in that area and agree with Timmins, when possible use armor props instead.

    There is a way to fix the rigging of the neck/shoulder guard. You will want to look up weight mapping tutorials. You can change the weight mapping of the piece so the neck has no influence over the shoulder. THis is not too bad to figure out how to do and will be useful going forward. It's not super duper easy but much more doable than fixing metal. Though for some metal pieces, weight mapping could at least help the metal issues, though might not be a complete cure.

    Yes you can look at the weight maps of the original piece. When you find a tutorial on weight mapping, you can look at the original pice and try to mimic that on the cloned piece.

    I would start here.

    http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/userguide/creating_content/rigging/tutorials/weight_mapping_a_figure/start
    you will likely need more, but this should start you off on the journey.

    Post edited by larsmidnatt on
  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,085
    edited October 2015

    What I've had good luck with is keeping a breastplate as a rigid prop, maybe also shoulders, and then have a chain or scale 'underarmor,' which doesn't look so bad with mild distortion.

    Example:

    http://willbear.deviantart.com/art/Fight-like-a-girl-556779099

    (Hmm, I should adjust the tone mapping on that)

    The breastplate is not 'fitted,' and I think many of the other pieces are fitted to a Genesis Supersuit, with the underlying mail... I think it might actually be a texture on the figure, I'll have to peer at it.

    The 'skirt' was adjusted for the pose, and I used some collision on various pieces to keep pokethrough problems at bay.

    Edit:
    Same image with better post work: http://willbear.deviantart.com/art/Fight-Like-A-GirlD2-563631208

     

    Post edited by Oso3D on
  • Sphinx MagooSphinx Magoo Posts: 586
    larsmidnatt said:

    yeah rigidity is a pain, and why I mentioned it earlier because I KNEW it was going to come up when you said armor. I can't help there, there are some threads on it but I think a lot of people basically give up. I've had very minor success in that area and agree with Timmins, when possible use armor props instead.

    There is a way to fix the rigging of the neck/shoulder guard. You will want to look up weight mapping tutorials. You can change the weight mapping of the piece so the neck has no influence over the shoulder. THis is not too bad to figure out how to do and will be useful going forward. It's not super duper easy but much more doable than fixing metal. Though for some metal pieces, weight mapping could at least help the metal issues, though might not be a complete cure.

    Yes you can look at the weight maps of the original piece. When you find a tutorial on weight mapping, you can look at the original pice and try to mimic that on the cloned piece.

    I would start here.

    http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/userguide/creating_content/rigging/tutorials/weight_mapping_a_figure/start
    you will likely need more, but this should start you off on the journey.

    Hmmm... Maybe I can convert the armor pieces into props and then use the Transfer Utility to handle the straps and leathers. Would you happen to know if Hexagon has a way to select connected polygons in an object? I'm trying to figure out something I used to do without thinking with 3D Studio Max, so bear with me. In the Heracles Chest gear described above, if the shoulder armor was a separate object unconnected to the straps and leathers, I could select the shoulder armor and manipulate it separately. I'm not as familiar with Hexagon even though it's been sitting on my hard drive for years...

    Thank you for your help again.

  • Sphinx MagooSphinx Magoo Posts: 586
    timmins.william said:

    What I've had good luck with is keeping a breastplate as a rigid prop, maybe also shoulders, and then have a chain or scale 'underarmor,' which doesn't look so bad with mild distortion.

    Example:

    http://willbear.deviantart.com/art/Fight-like-a-girl-556779099

    (Hmm, I should adjust the tone mapping on that)

    The breastplate is not 'fitted,' and I think many of the other pieces are fitted to a Genesis Supersuit, with the underlying mail... I think it might actually be a texture on the figure, I'll have to peer at it.

    The 'skirt' was adjusted for the pose, and I used some collision on various pieces to keep pokethrough problems at bay.

    Edit:
    Same image with better post work: http://willbear.deviantart.com/art/Fight-Like-A-GirlD2-563631208

     

    Which armor set is that?

  • larsmidnattlarsmidnatt Posts: 4,511
    Sphinx Magoo said:
    larsmidnatt said:

    yeah rigidity is a pain, and why I mentioned it earlier because I KNEW it was going to come up when you said armor. I can't help there, there are some threads on it but I think a lot of people basically give up. I've had very minor success in that area and agree with Timmins, when possible use armor props instead.

    There is a way to fix the rigging of the neck/shoulder guard. You will want to look up weight mapping tutorials. You can change the weight mapping of the piece so the neck has no influence over the shoulder. THis is not too bad to figure out how to do and will be useful going forward. It's not super duper easy but much more doable than fixing metal. Though for some metal pieces, weight mapping could at least help the metal issues, though might not be a complete cure.

    Yes you can look at the weight maps of the original piece. When you find a tutorial on weight mapping, you can look at the original pice and try to mimic that on the cloned piece.

    I would start here.

    http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/userguide/creating_content/rigging/tutorials/weight_mapping_a_figure/start
    you will likely need more, but this should start you off on the journey.

    Would you happen to know if Hexagon has a way to select connected polygons in an object? 

    Hexagon is a modeling package. Of course it can select polygons! Depending on how the item is set up selecting what you need may be easy, or require a bit of work. Sometimes the meshes are split up by material groups, so it could be a 2 click thing. Or you could have to select the more deliberately. But yes, you can use Hexagon for that.

  • Sphinx MagooSphinx Magoo Posts: 586
    larsmidnatt said:
    Sphinx Magoo said:
    larsmidnatt said:

    yeah rigidity is a pain, and why I mentioned it earlier because I KNEW it was going to come up when you said armor. I can't help there, there are some threads on it but I think a lot of people basically give up. I've had very minor success in that area and agree with Timmins, when possible use armor props instead.

    There is a way to fix the rigging of the neck/shoulder guard. You will want to look up weight mapping tutorials. You can change the weight mapping of the piece so the neck has no influence over the shoulder. THis is not too bad to figure out how to do and will be useful going forward. It's not super duper easy but much more doable than fixing metal. Though for some metal pieces, weight mapping could at least help the metal issues, though might not be a complete cure.

    Yes you can look at the weight maps of the original piece. When you find a tutorial on weight mapping, you can look at the original pice and try to mimic that on the cloned piece.

    I would start here.

    http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dazstudio/4/userguide/creating_content/rigging/tutorials/weight_mapping_a_figure/start
    you will likely need more, but this should start you off on the journey.

    Would you happen to know if Hexagon has a way to select connected polygons in an object? 

    Hexagon is a modeling package. Of course it can select polygons! Depending on how the item is set up selecting what you need may be easy, or require a bit of work. Sometimes the meshes are split up by material groups, so it could be a 2 click thing. Or you could have to select the more deliberately. But yes, you can use Hexagon for that.

    Sorry I wasn't clear. I just meant that I'm more familiar with the selection tools in a package like 3D Studio than I am with Hexagon. I was just hoping not to have to select the armor pieces polygon by polygon.

  • ScavengerScavenger Posts: 2,674

    I've been experimenting with trying to combine props with clothes for the exact reasons mentioned..to keep metal parts from warping...

    Getting the props to move right have been problematic.

     

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,085

    Sphinx: Sorry about slow response, was tied up in renders last night and doing other stuff today.

    Most of her armor is : http://www.daz3d.com/order-of-the-wolf , which I'm pretty sure I got from the Michael 6 pro bundle.

    Nice armor, but the breastplate looks absolutely f'in rediculous if you autofit to a woman.

     

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