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I always buy the things that offer items for both sex if i can ,Though I will admit i would love to see more g2m stuff made. Sorry Daz please don;t get mad at me. But I am not been buying anything genesis 3. i have no interest in stuff that is not compatible with older generation content. so I guess that means my figure& character buying days here at Daz are done seeming that is all the venders are catering to is genesis 3 . But the environment stuff is still good and the shaders and lights content is always a must have. And besides i can still buy genesis 2 stuff where the venders are still making stuff for them at other stores
Anyways these are 2 good outfits I have picked up that are offered for both g2m & g2f
http://www.daz3d.com/diana-and-jones-outfit-for-genesis-2-male-s-and-female-s
http://www.daz3d.com/urban-survivors-hd-for-genesis-2-female-s-and-male-s
I never really knew how lucky i am with content till I read this, since the majority of what I render is the female form, usually with little on. I honestly never/never will render any figure that looks under 21, but I can see what a pain it must be to find content for you and I applaud your efforts to make your own content. I tried to imagine how it would be for me if it was reversed and DAZ only sold mostly kids clothes and male items, man that would be a nightmare. I can model anything, but rigging is a pain in the.......
As for male items, when I do need a male figure in a render, I still rely on genesis 1 and I have most clothes options covered. several jeans, 2 suits, couple of polos, a couple of long sleeve shirts, one nice short sleeve button up and a couple pair of shoes, similar to my own wardrobe, or so my GF says, LOL. And then there is the fantasy armor sets, LOL.
And the problem with that would be ... what, exactly?
Yes. Yes, we DO!
Hey, from what I can tell from what vendors have said, male skimpwear sells, when it appears. It just seldom appears, except as barbarian loincloths and occasional underwear.
And judging from the fact that both Magic Mike movies did quite well at the box office, half-naked stripper is EXACTLY the look lots of people seem to go for. (According to Box Office Mojo, Magic Mike XXL did $65 million domestic on a $12 million production budget, which is very good, although not nearly as good as the first one, which did $112 million domestic on a $7 million production budget. And that doesn't count overseas or other secondary markets, which is where those movies will make real bank.)
The problem is, it's not actually that simple. One of the reasons that the amount of content for Genesis 2 Female exploded, compared to all that was produced for Genesis, is the Breast issue. Rigging and texturing an outfit to work well on both a flat chest and on breasts seems to be very difficult. It's hard to make look good. If you make the male outfit first and then retrofit into the female outfit, you get texture stretching in the chest and hips. If you make the female outfit and retrofit into the male, frequently, you get boobsacks ... and weird texture issues because there's too much there.
And, on top of that, with Cross-Figure and various clones, a lot of times, it's just as easy for the user to do the retrofitting themselves. There have been a few things -- mostly boots, but a few other things as well -- that I've bought purely because I'd be able to take them from G2F to G2M with no real issue. So if a vendor is going to try to make that sort of cross-gender outfit, they have to do it from the start and sell maybe as a bundle, because if they wait any amount of time at all, unless it has insane rigging, there's just no point.
Many of the things mentioned here are the reasons I just dont spend as much money at Daz3d as I used to. I have more then enough female clothing and a great percentage of what is being made IS skimpwear. I dont need 12 different lingerie sets. If you consider everything I have for V4, G1,G2, and now G3, I am pretty well situated for female clothing . Especially the skimpwear variety. Given that I have purchased utilities that allow me to fit most of it on any female character I own. Then when you consider all the various shaders that are available, I have a lot of versatility there. Honestly, when it comes to female items right now, about the only things I am particulary interested in are shoes for G3, new and interesting hair styles, and non skimpwear clothing that is something I dont already have. I have noticed some good trends in footwear for the ladies recently. Footwear that does not have extreme heels but rather something that a real woman would wear in a variety of situations from the office, to a social event, to shopping. I have also seen footwear suitable for women to go out adventuring in. Flat boots and boots and shoes with low heels suitable for riding, butt kicking, saving the world etc. A big huge THANK YOU SO MUCH to all the PA's that read these forums and listened to the requests that people made. I have supported these creators with my wallet and will continue to do so.
Now that said, I am always going to be interested in new scenes, props, vehicles, items, clutter and such. Unfortunately, there are rather fewer creators of those things than there are of female skimpwear. So, when a good prop, scene, item, etc.. comes out, thats when my wallet comes out and my credit card starts whimpering.
Now, if you really want to see/hear my credit card cry in earnest, some good male clothing will do that. Yes its probably true that it sells less. Yes its probably true that there is not as much of a creative range in male clothing. Yes, men are rather simple creatures when it comes to what they like to wear. BUT I will tell you this truth: Men have more than one or two pair of jeans in their dresser drawers. They generally have enough t-shirts to outfit a small army and they have multiples of sweaters, sweatshirts, sweatpants, shorts, swimtrunks etc. All ot these things are similar but not the same. T-shirts have various collar styles and sleeve lengths. Then you get into suits and tuxedos, blazers, coats and jackets. Thats just normal everyday clothing. After that it expands out into various genres (fantasy, sci-fi, etc) and there are military uniforms , and period clothing ( regency is rather well represented for both males and females btw). Oh, and lets not forget shoes and boots. While the typical male closet does not include the sheer amount of footwear that a woman's closet may, there can generally be found more than one single pair of athletic shoes, various types of boots including but not limited to combat, western hikers, wellingtons, and various types of workboots. There are so many things that can be created. I have -and will continue to do so- made efforts to learn how to make the things I want for myself but my skill level is just not there and since I cant spend hours a day on it, its going to be a while before it is.
So, now, you have this long -ish rambling outpouring that basically says why I am not spending as much as i used to. It totally comes down to the fact of there being fewer items I see and have a "wow! I can use that for my picture of xyz" or a " I just have to have that now" reaction to.
Funny thing is, I WANT to continue to spend my discretionary hobby budget with DAZ. Its just currently there is not as much impetus to do so. I am holding out hope for some really great scnerey, item and prop releases in the upcoming "Big" sales as well as some really good male content when we get G3M/M7.
I didn't say a cross-gendered or unisex outfit, I said a male version - two different things.
,
Who are these people who only own Tshirts and Blue Jeans. Sorry, that just not true. The vast majority of adult me own more than that. Hell even if it was that, there is some variety in that set. Secondarily, when it comes to shoes, take a look at athletic shoes. You go into any athletic shoe store and there are 900 pairs of shoes for men. Expensive shoes. Sorry, that is a poor excuse. Even if it was just blue jeans and tshirts, what about real life uniforms? Are you going to tell me that cops wear just Blue Jeans and Tshirts. How abotu SWAT Gear. Fire Fighters. Soldiers. Delivery men. Truckers. Construction workers. The fact that you cannot find a freaking hard hat in Daz is a crying shame. To say that men just only own two things is patently untrue and just lazy. Hell, give some skimpy items to men as well. Who cares, give some variety. It's the same excuse for some rarely making skins of color. 2/3rds of the worlds population are people of color yet, Daz doesn't seem to recognize this either. If this is Daz's intent then they should write it down as part of their business model.
DAZ should advertise more for the male market. It has a niche right now selling adult female skimpwear and clothing where it is quite comfortable, but if they want to attract male content buyers, they need to improve their marketing.
Hmm.. my husband has a lot of t-shirts (we share those), one pair of jeans, a couple pairs of shorts, a few button down shirts he doesn't wear anymore 'cause he's not working, a couple of suits he wears ever couple of years when he has to, invariably he will wear a tshirt, birkenstocks, and his Utilikilt until it gets way too cold for his Swedish blood to handle with bare legs. (so like november in new york)
You know, a kilt could be fun... Let me grab G2M here in a bit and see what I can come up with.
https://www.daz3d.com/highland-lad
http://www.daz3d.com/scottish-kilts-prince-charlie-outfit
http://www.daz3d.com/modern-kilt
http://www.daz3d.com/wicked-kilt
Sorry, I just had a bunch of these wishlisted...
I knew what you meant; I just phrased it that way to talk about a certain type of workflow. However, to simply take it absolutely the way in which you stated it, you're asking content creators to do twice as much work for considerably less than twice the income, because the market is what it is.
Are there things DAZ could be doing to expand the market and users? ... eh? Maybe? I have done PR (and am doing PR, more's the pity), but not for that type of thing. And I have no sense of how difficult it is to expand the tastes of a market that is Extremely Focused on the stuff they like, to the tune of buying 765 different versions of the same type of thing. I don't know where you'd advertise to get people who want men's clothing to shop here who don't already shop here. After all, there's no other brokerage that does that much better. I think RDNA, as a proportion of stuff they sell, has more males and male stuff, but RDNA is comparatively teeny. Renderosity certainly doesn't -- weeks can go by where it seems like Renderosity forgets that male characters even exist.
I have to admit, one thing I found odd was that Genesis got four different male kilts, and G2M got none. Not one. It can't simply be that they don't sell; Genesis did get four of them, after all. And yes, you can do autofit and transfer utliity, but it usually wound up with the crotch divot or flyaway polygons. I wonder what happened there.
Ah. So just venting, then. OK.
Why no men's clothes? Cause... skimp wear sells, and user base is probably mostly straight men. I mean LOOK at the first 5 tabs on the shop page. ALL female content so far. Did I mention the gallery too? So many female renders!
Oh I dunno I kind of like to see some more animals to render they are a lot of fun :)
...totally the truth, go into any second hand/vintage store, and the women's clothing section is always far greater than for men. As one of the big Goodwill stores here in town, I would say nearly 60% of the clothing are womens' wear. That leaves about 40% divided between men and kids.
Hmmm, must be a cultural thing... All the guys in my family, including family friends, they all seem to have wardrobes that rival the ladies. By large many wouldnt be caught dead in just any outfit, they have styles of their own, and its rubbish to think otherwise. Also there are many female clothing dedicated stores yep... in my area theres just as many for the men, and the larger stores... the kids range rivals the mens and the mens rivals the womens department. hardly much difference between them
Moreover, when you go digging through the kids section, you'll find anywhere from 60-80% of that will be for girls. Most stores will make you travel through the women's section to get to the cubby where the menswear is.
Why? Because women shop, and men buy. Men walk in, find what they want, and leave. A woman will usually linger. If she's shopping, then she lingers in women's section either before or after she deals with the menswear, whereas a man will ignore the women's section unless he's looking for women's clothing.
If a man and woman are shopping together, then a man will walk through, get his shite, and then wait for her to finish getting herself out of the quagmire.
Men's clothers tend to be simpler, without things like lace and ruffles, no skirts, and so on. You don't find menswear with plunging necklines with a lace fringe beyond the end of the eighteenth century. By the advent of the 20th century, it was just gone. Women's clothes are shaped in ways that men's are not as well. Most men I've ever met have a single style of underpants they wear, and the only thing that really varies is the color. Some men don't even vary that.
Women's unmentionables come in a staggering variety of flavors.
The largest majority of men have one or two suits for special occasions, an array of workwear, and three to five days work of casualwear unless workwear overlaps their streetwear. Two pullovers, an outfit or three for warm weather, and a couple of jackets for the cold/rainy season.
In shoes, you're usually going to see up to three pair for work, and usually just two, a pair for around the flat, another for whatever training they like, and a pair of some sort of boots if they like the outdoors. I work from home, so I keep a pair of flip-flops, a pair of jump boots, two pair of cheap sneakers, and one set of dress shoes. I have a half-dozen t-shirts, an equal number of polos, three button-up shirts, four pair of jeans, one suit jacket and slacks, three pair of khakis, and a week's worth of underwear, all either black, white, or somewhere in between. I have three jackets, which are worn depending on the time of year.
If I buy new clothing, I generally expect it to last from five to seven years. If my wife buys clothing for me (as is often the case), she expects no more than six months. My current pair of jump boots I've had for three or four years, and I replace sneakers about every six to nine months or when I walk the soles off them, whichever comes first. She likes to pick up new clothing for herself every three to six months, and with a few exceptions waits two years before shipping it off to the local thrift store (our favorite is the one for the animal shelter here in town).
As described above, part of the reason you don't see a lot of menswear in the store here, is because there are only so many types even available-- it's easier to make one T-shirt and texture/morph it within a centimeter of it's little life than make 30 different ones and pray they sell. Same thing pretty much across the board.
Do we need uniforms? Absolutely. I plan to make a couple, even. But the chances wer'e going to see a lot of modern/scifi menswear is pretty thin. Going backwards in time, we'll see a pile of fantasy armor and such, but very little for the here and now.
Because frankly, the market for clothing in general is geared towards women. The best thing you can do is when you see a bit of menswear that gets you attention is to buy it, and openly encourage the person that made it to do more.
Allow me to add my own frustration with this issue. I've started making comics with DAZ (so far none are for sale, I'm still trying to perfect my style), but honestly unless you make porn (not that I wouldn't) it is really difficult to get clothing props, especially for men. The worst is trying to make scenes where men and women as part of the same military unit. Eventually some US army uniforms were made for both genders, but try and have some sci-fi space force, or even the "Future Cop" readily available for the females but God forbid they are supposed to have a male colleague!
You are the guys who drove the market not DAZ or the vendors, so buy more male stuff !!!
I guess the question is how do you get more customer to buy the male stuff they just aren't popular as the female.
I have a G3F sci fi suit that will come out with a G2M conversion so it will be a good test to which will sell more,
and ultimately will help me decide which I should put more into, so in the end sale dictate. Yes this is a shameless plug for drumming up busness Lol
I'd love to have a fire fighter outfit for G2M. I'd also love to have a vicar/priest outfit for him, because vicars are around for many of the 'big' moments in real life. I realise G2F is probably too busy slinking around battlegrounds in high heels and revealing 'armour' to be thinking much about getting married, but she's a funeral opportunity waiting to happen. What's the point in giving a vicar such a wealth of potential work if you're not going to dress him up for it? :)
Like a previous poster, I had no interest in G3F and items that were not backwards-compatible, but knew I'd probably get sucked in anyway by all the goodies that were bound to be on offer with the new wave. They weren't, and I haven't. There probably is a large section of the population that would be drawn to Daz on seeing pages full of scantily dressed females with big butts and 'seductive' stares reminiscent of dead cod, but I've been bored out of my brains by most of what's shown up in the store lately. I ended up trying to get to grips with Bryce instead, finding I loved working with it and buying a ton of lo-rez content to feed it. About the only use I get out of Daz Studio now is the 'Send To Bryce' button, and I was amazed to realise that it's been two weeks since I last spent any money here.
I can't be the only one feeling jaded by the total lack of dynamism on the front page of the store these days. I've just scrolled all the way down it and there is one tiny image of a man sitting on a tricycle - every other image depicts a woman. I'm not saying women can't be dynamic, but I want beefcake. I want testosterone. I want a firefighter :) In the meantime, I'm going back to Bryce :)
Didnt it get to that point as soon as it started around15 years ago? Its been like that ^ ever since I can remember anyway.
Dariofish and Xurge 3D have male/female versions of their stuff. I don't believe I have ever seen them mention anything about the male stuff not selling. I actually have the female/male version of the stuff I purchase from them. It could be that at DAZ 3D you have more of the skimp-type customer vs the non-skimp type.
You are skipping the 1970s? Probably wise.
I remember the 1970s, and clothing designers during that period were deranged squirrels infested by a flea circus, and trained by a pack of psychotic howler monkeys. It was a horroshow for a child under the age of ten. Walking into parts of some towns was scarier than Alien.
Very traumatic.
we need Garanimals for Daz Kids
Sorry Midnight, but your products generally are only usable if you're into sci-fi rendering and often I find that the suits have pretty big limitations, which is a reason for me not to buy them. These days I am looking for practicality and if the product doesn't do what I am looking for, then it's a no-sale.
The argument that the PAs would make more male stuff if we bought more male stuff is kind of baffling when there's just one solitary male on the front page, who is only there to showcase a tricycle. We can't buy what's not available.