I think I am over the Dforce clothing but not Dforce
WendyLuvsCatz
Posts: 40,101
I like Dforce don’t get me wrong and love using it on clothing
but
lately stuff I bought not only cannot be used unDforced but it explodes if you do more than one pose so only useable for a single image each time.
I know most people do images not animations but I am not talking about some crazy complex animation
just a single walk cycle or someone sitting down in a chair and talking etc.
I would prefer conforming clothing fully useable as such with an option to deforce parts to be honest.
Hems, edges of sleeves etc, I do this already but I get pretty mad when I buy something that looks great in promos but is virtually unusable except for the few poses shown with it.
I would love to name specific items but dare not in case PA’s get upset or others jump to their defence but there is a few very glaring examples I regret buying even one in fastgrab it’s that unusable
Daz 3D is part of 
Connect
DAZ Productions, Inc.
7533 S Center View Ct #4664
West Jordan, UT 84084
Licensing Agreement | Terms of Service | Privacy Policy | EULA
© 2025 Daz Productions Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Comments
Yes, it sure does seem like certain things are QA tested for stills only, doesn't it?
The Blender Foundation is going to have to start paying me soon, but I've been in a similar boat. I could not for the life of me get dForce to work with the Misery Skirt. It would not flap around the character's legs as she walked, but always bunch up between her thighs and later explode. This is actually the main reason why I decided to bite the bullet and to start learning Blender because that's not how technology is supposed to work; I refused to align my creative vision with the limits of the technology when it's the technology that is supposed to enable my creative vision. I wanted a fricking skirt that flaps around. Period. That should not have been too much to ask for.
I'm not going to lie and say it was a few clicks to set up in Blender, but the difference is that everything is out in the open and explained, and the presets are for EVERYONE to know about, not just a prefered audience. Googling around, it eventually turned out actually BETTER than I expected.
Contrast that with dForce, where I hit a wall and couldn't even figure out how to BEGIN to fix my problem.
And that is why I've pretty much paused all my other efforts to figure out how to convert dForce Curly Hair to a hair particle system in Blender; the less I am dependent on things that people say I don't have the right to truly understand, the better off I will be.
I am OK with Dforce itself and can add it to most clothing
but
I am weary of buying stuff that needs it to look good and is limited in use
I would rather buy well rigged stuff that conforms and add my own Dforce but we are seeing less of that now
Lol,I've re written this comment many times now and it always comes out wrong. Let's just say I don't like the way it's implemented, makes it very complicated to use especially for animation. It's nice to have options, various tools etc. And I've had some success using it both for draping stuff and blowing things up. But it's far from practical. And that's that...
...in the same boat here as just about all the new clothing being released is dForce, which I have not only have to convert from G8 to G3, but I have I older hardware which is taxed heavily by it, so I have to learn how to model clothing myself. Wish I could afford the new version of MD, but at least Blender 2.8 has a UI that I can finally work with.
I think that the days of doing everything in DAZ Studio are over, even for the non-technical hobbyist like me. OK, so modelling was never possible in DAZ Studio but I think more people are getting into Blender (or ZBrush or Hexagon). Then there's clothing - I have purchased a permanent licence for Marvelous Designer 8 but have been tardy (and a little afraid) of diving into clothing creation. As soon as my present project is done I am going to devote all my hobby time to learning both MD and Blender and to experimenting with exporting and importing to and from DAZ Studio.
I have many years of playing with posing and setting up scenes and lights in DAZ Studio and that is not going to stop. However, in the past I've just given up on things that have not worked well for me - such as dForce. I'm also tinkering with animation and, as has been stressed above, exploding garments just don't encourage further experimentation so I'll have to find an alternative workflow.
In that case it's really nice to have these new PA- script to convert older, non-dForce clothing to Gen8, bones and such included.
I have bought a lot more older clothing items instead of the new ones lately.
I've had a fair bit of success with dForce and Poser dynamic clothing*.
As long as there are no intersections with the start pose, the posing figure doesn't collide with anything while simulation is in progress and the garment isn't of a design to bunch up and obstruct itself, I rarely see explosions
*Not anything with fiddly strappy bits on the arms like butterflywings dresses. But a lot of the Poser Dynamic items lean toward an elegant simplicity of design (not that we don't have dForce items of that calibre)
All I lack is reliable setting cloth 'thickness' - tends to be too easy to end up with silky fluttery.
I've not been doing animation, but I have been doing a series of poses with the same garment in the one session.
I've not had a lot of explosions since I habitually take bend stiffness down from .50 to .39
Frankly, I find dForce such a pain to learn and use that when I purchase items "dForce" is a negative sale point. Not fair to the PA's, but DAZs' absolute refusal to document their program sets up the problems... Of course there are lots of other "features" that take far more effort to learn than I feel they should...
Obviously I am not in a very good mood right now... I have stopped using DS completely for a while until I calm down and get my frustrations under control. so take all this with an unhealthy load of salt.
I'm not seeing this
There's no way rigged conforming clothing can compete - and in a few years, the hardware will easily do dynamic simulations.
I've never had any luck with the rigged poses some clothes come with - morphs titled pose 01-XX are no help when you've no idea what pose set they're for and 'sit' morphs are pretty useless as peopl don't often sit in formal 'Egyptian God' seated pose, they tuck a foot in, extend a leg out, twist left/right lean forward. The amount of times I've discovered a sit morph on a skirt only to be disappointed its a floor sit when I need a chairsit.
No way I could have gotten good looking seated robed figures with rigged clothes (these are free poser dynamic items dForced).
Well the Poser stuff has generally worked better for me than the stuff being sold here I must say
Yep, I agree ... those sheet-metal dresses! That's why I was so thrilled when dForce was announced. Unfortunately it just doesn't meet expectations: it is slow, it s oversensitive and it is difficult to configure - all reasons why I splashed out for MD.
As I said I use Dforce
but
on Conforming clothing and Poser prop clothing as you did
the stuff being sold half rigged that relies on Dforce just to be useable is what irks me, maybe if it were just props and priced accordingly it would actually work better, I know stuff I model does if I don’t rig it,
It is like the clothing that relies on smoothing or worse hiding parts to be useable without poke through.
Well, MD will always be useful - but dForce has only been in since 4.10, I assume it'll get improved, and indeed has been - it's a lot less explosion prone than it was.
I use a lot of older figures because despite the logical arguements that the modern figures are more efficient then the old, the old figures tax my system less, and in lieu of new items being done for old figures (which certainly won't happen) or a script to replace old crappy rigging with a modern flexible standard (I haven't gotten into the rigging transfer toolset yet) dForce is the best option.
I use a lot of V4 clothing, it nearly always needs smoothing added - but isn't everything from Genesis up loaded with smoothing applied? I only ever have to manually add it with pre-genesis content. Coming in to Daz in 2016 - it took me ages to learn how to fit clothes manually to Generation-3 and Generation-4 with smoothing and push modifiers.
I've often thought Daz could have done with a nuanced approach to dForce categorisation - just 'dForce' mentioned in the store page doesn't really tell the buyer anything about how much dForce is needed to properly use the item in question - you can glean that from the morph list in the details portion of the page - but it's not very shopper friendly. Could have categories along the lines of 'dForce compatible' 'dforce dependant' and 'dForce enhanced'
I had to do that before the 4.11 Beta when, due to a lack of Cuda support on my daz install I had no dForce ability - if there were no listed movement morphs then the item relied on dForce for functionality rather than extra detail so i avoided buying.
no not everything post Genesis has smoothing, some things are worse with it,
the point is before smoothing was implimented people had to model stuff to precisely fit and add morphs for movements
a lot of later stuff is very lazy and useless FBX exported to software without smoothing collisions as I frequently do
for those hiding undelying mesh is my only option
the same thing is happening with Dforce now, lazy modeling and rigging IMO
I have a love/hate relationship with deforce. the clothing i been buying deforce in the 3d stores like Sven said do not animate very well out of the box it take a lot of re working the simulation settings to use them in animation.. . But i have been using deforce modifiers on conforming hair props and for soft body physics with pretty good success.
I found the biggest secret to using out of the box deforce clothing and hair is you need to remodify how it reacts with the characters bones & rigging by turn off or on simulation settings for each body part its interacting with .. in most case over reacting is a term it fits best. . I found long dress almost always require that the characters hands are turned off in simulations settings to keep the hands from pulling the dress apart, deforce long hair like UD3 Dayton hair looks great in still renders . . but using it in animation longer than 60 keyframes , the hair tends to start falling out like its got mange, The deforce clothing that blows up during simulations longer that 60 keyframes, usually require having the gravity settings so low the deforce is negligible at best in order to keep the deforce item from blowing apart. It be great to have more refined settings to control things from blowing up
Plus this is a big issue for animators . you always have to start your scenes with simulating character with deforce clothing & hair first . then build the scene around them after your done simulating the animation . other wise you have to shut the simulation off for every single item in the scene. Because if you try to build the scene first and then add your characters& run a simulation with deforce in them. then the deforce item tends to want to stick to everything in the scene but the characters yes I have a love hate relationship with deforce . deforce has been a heck of a learning experience for sure .
so now I don't have a Nvidia card I cannot use it at all?
well that sucks
Current OpenGL Version:
4.3.0 - Build 10.18.14.4264
OpenGL Provider:
Intel
Hardware:
Intel(R) HD Graphics 4600
Features:
MultiTexturing
Supported
Shadow Map
Supported
Hardware Antialiasing
Supported
OpenGL Shading Language
Supported
Pixel Buffer
Supported
Pixel Buffer Size
Not Enabled
Maximum Number of Lights
8
Number of Texture Units
8
Maximum Texture Size
16384 x 16384
I can but Windows update broke the intel driver
needs openCL and rolling back I got it
honestly, 4 frames into a 30 frame animation and all she does is bend over
yet I took a V4 dress and did a complex 300 frame animation
as I said Dforce itself cool but the clothes being sold as dforce and only dforce not so much
Looks painful
I think dForce is over me...
If things hold to the established pattern, about the time all the problems are worked out, dForce will be gone. I do miss Opti-plex, bought the control panel plugin and all, though I have been able to do a few simple animations with dForce clothing and animate blocks. Not sure why some have issues and I'm on a 9 year old Mac.
I don’t care for dforce clothing. I render men primarily, and to me, They look worse to me than confirming outfits and they often don’t have a lot of detail or complexity
The technical requirements/limitations of dForce do affect what is possible with the mesh. There's only limited ways to make parts retain their shape but move with the simulation and, if not approached carefully, things like sculpted seams will stretch out and collapse. That said, I'm surprised at how often the methods that do work to add detail to clothing simply aren't used.
Still, while it does have its limits, dForce is potentially a very powerful tool when used well. When I make clothing, I try to make it as dForce compatible as practicable without actually sacrificing the result; even if it will primarily be used as a conforming outfit, there are still times it's useful to have the simulation available as a tool.
Well if something is useable without Dforce just has it as an option it becomes less of a problem
that I don't mind and not what I am whining about
Now
if stuff is sold as Dforce optional
I would be quite enthusiastic
dForce clothing does often look like ultra thin fabric of some unknown wet fabric cloth type unless you really know what values you should be using for denim, silk, canvas, cotton like in t-shirts, ribbed knits, knits, ribbed cotton, tweed, and so many others. And those values have to be adjusted according to the number of polygons and distribution of those polygons on the modeled clothing. Forgive me if I don't think anyone selling dforce presets in the DAZ Store for clothing has a handle on all that but I don't. Users are basically forced to make multiple guesses and run multiple simulations until something 'looks right' which can be often difficult to tell unless you do iRay Preview in the viewport as the normal/bump/displacement maps that determine whether a drape 'looks right' won't show until rendered in iRay.
All in favor of dForce optional clothing. Totally not of dForce-exclusives. Both have their advantages, but, both also have their limitations. An outfit offering both methods is practically offering the best of both worlds.
Doesn't work in dForce? Well, try that again using conformed.
Impossible draping requirements or glaring clippings when conformed? Try again using dForce.
Maybe one of the cleverer creators can come up with a script sometime to
1) pose and simulate dForce clothing on a figure in its standard T or A pose.
2) apply some "standardized" rigging weight values to the clothing article
3) save the result as a "conformation mapping" for the clothing item.
Seeing the work and research Riversoft and Sickleyield did on their clothing converter, they're high on my list of developers that might be able to make such a de-dForcifier script. I know, it wouldn't be perfect, manual weightpainting would obviously be better and more ideal, but it'd still be a somewhat useful tool I bet. Whether they'd be interested in making something like that, or whether DAZ would even want such a tool to be available, is a different matter..
https://www.daz3d.com/gate-guardian-for-genesis-8-males
I know it's PC+ but couldn't they have at least made it fit over the pants in the default pose?
a left and right handle would have been nice too, the left side and right side morphs only move below the massive poke through
I cannot say I was impressed even Dforcing it
I'm not a fan of dforce at all, but I know there's a lot of people that love it. I do wish PAs would make more rigged and dforce versions, but I also understant that would greatly increase production time. I don't think there's a really good answer, all I can say is I stopped buying dforce only clothing months ago out of frustration with the implementation.
yeah it is the not working without Dforce that is my main dislike
understandable for very flouncy stuff but something like this a few handles would not go amiss