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"some products I see so many renders, that I think, why buy this, there are so many renders already."
For me, the truth in that is that really popular products can be distracting and take you out of the narrative. Rather than getting lost in the story, I say, "Gosh, but everybody uses that dress!" This is especially true of sets, especially sets with very distictive texturing. I don't think I'll ever be able to look at renders of the new UF6 without instantly recognizing it, mostly because of all the murals. But yeah, you can always do as Etrigan suggests, and sometimes, you absolutely gotta do that.
I buy because I want to see what I can do with it. I create art for myself not for anyone else. If people end up liking it what I did with it, then it's a bonus for me.
Why breathe? Everybody's breathing.
I grew up drawing, and mostly human figures and faces. Pencil and colored pencils were cheap! But having DAZ (not so cheap), it's just so hard for me to go back to making art without it. It's like, once you start writing with word processors, it becomes really hard to write a novel by hand.
I do use a Wacom tablet to get that sketching feeling, but sometimes I don't even bother. It's kind of funny how I can actually be better at drawing in Photoshop with a regular mouse than a tablet, simply because that's what I used for so long before I got the tablet.
There are so many renders so you can see all and everything that is in what your buying,and for my recent environments what you see in the promos is literally what you get(if you get the lights and cameras too)
I don't know if it's been brought up (I sadly don't have time to read the whole thread right now), but even the same product can look vastly different in different renders. Things like lighting, angles, and the render's composition can vastly change the look of the product. I've been coming here for a little over two years but in that time I've seen SO MANY posts of people asking about what a certain product is in a promo image or a gallery image only for them to find out it's a product that they already have and in some cases a product that they have used. This has happened over and over again with different people and posts over the past couple of years and really shows how a product can look vastly different in different renders. There is no reason to think "oh others have used this product in their renders, what's the point of me rendering it" when the same products can look so different in different renders with different artists. :)
The same could be said for any art form including novels and music There are 130 million plus unique books yet only seven basic plots. There are 4 basic music chords in an I-V-vi-IV progression, and these basic 4 chords have been twisted with an original spin by artists such as, Katy Perry, Green Day, Taylor Swift, One Republic, Areosmith, Demi Lavato, Linkin Park, Kelly Clarkson , Lady Gaga, Imagine Dragons, Pink and some unknowns like me. The difference is the degree of imagination. Oftentimes we see what can be . . . not what it is.
i know with some of your early stuff for
Poser, I used to do scenes right in front of doors or by a barrel or something ... there was one with a blue door that i loved a lot ... there are so many possibilities when environemnts are done so well. not much blank uninteresting areas in them.
The best way of getting better is to never focus too much on how your end result compares to others, it's the journey getting there!
In other words; doodle/sketch whenever something comes to mind, never ever stop doodling/sketching; as it doesn't have to be a finished piece, just moments of expression in which you can refer to for later inspiration!
But why do I want to copy your work? Thats so boring!
just looked at your fb very cool make good book covers or graphic novels
well I've drawn and sculpted always fantasy and pinup art and monsters, during early days before we had what we have now something I wanted to do was photography involving models dressed up in costumes along with my creatures in life size or minatures and photo manipulation, then was via photo manipulation via paintshop pro editing photos and friends into scenes or movie posters even swapping body parts if wanting different pose stilldo this sometimes then found daz which let me do it all and when I lost my sight one of the things I missed most was daz so holds special place for me and again it is a lot cheaper than buying making costumes and paying models as well as sculpting
I normally don't care what other people did with something as 9 times out of 10 I'll have completely altered the human figures to the point where they're unrecognizable except as a skin donor, and rearranged/retextured most of the sets as well. Just about everything else... clothes, props, vehicles... are things that occur in multiples in the real world, so something as simple as changing colors or shaders is usually enough.
For me, the purpose of using DAZ/Poser/VUE, etc., is that it's a quick way of getting ideas down visually while retaining the option to go back and reframe/relight/repose at any point during the production process, even to the point of being able to go back and revisit the concept months later if a new idea occurs down the line. The fact that the DAZ figures can often be nearly photorealistic and create their own alphas for photoshop is an added bonus. That said, if my intended end product is something that's supposed to appear completely "real" to the naked eye, I still have the option of hiring live models or mixing the mediums.
indeed,but so many have said they struggle to recreate my promos that having the same settings available seems to help
Sometimes you can't do better than a Mona Lisa. But Mona Lisa would look swell on one of those walls.
I can draw paint and airbrush. I majored in art and my favorite topic was figure drawing.
I do 3d because I injured my drawing arm on the job lifting boxes at work and drawing and holding a paintbrush causes me pain.
I actually love the galleries and go there regularly. I also enjoy deviantart.
I am not snobby about art and think is all great. I don’t have preconceived notions about what is art and I tend to avoid those who believe their chosen medium is the one true method.I tend to pick up ideas from seeing what others do so the gallery, you tube, deviant and so it’s useful to view the art created by others.
I understand the OP's point a bit. Some items that are so specific to the art of the PA like Stonemason's wonderful graffiti or some PA's amazing artistic tattoos or Victoria 7 are so specific that I'm afraid to use them in commercial renders. I'm afraid people will say "That character looks really familiar" or "I feel like I've seen that set before". That's why I always try to change materials/shaders, kit bash, change characters' morphs or create my own and avoid products with too much of the artist's artistry. I don't like to use clothes textures with drawn designs on them either. I feel like I'm stealing someone else's work. But the whole fun for me really is changing things to fit my own aesthetics, putting in my own textures and morphs. Not trying to copy the promos but doing something completely different.
I don't know, I keep seeing the same Disney 'facial expressions' and 'body language' in their shows for over a decade know & it doesn't matter if it's live action or computer animation Disney is insistant on everybody in the show, especially young & teenage girls, using the same facial expressions again and again. Regardless, I'm still going to buy The Incredibles 2 when it comes out on BlueRay.
...I remember this from my old literary group discussions.
Rather than getting lost in the story, I say, "Gosh, but everybody uses that dress!" This is especially true of sets
Just so I'm keeping score correctly, you're put off by seeing art in the DAZ GALLERY because you recognize (popular) products from the DAZ STORE?
Read that back several times.
On the balancing end, you are probably more likely to be drawn in by art that uses the assets you have, have used or want to buy/use.
And I would say SETS are the least asset to worry about. People and Hair are probably the most recognizable and a complete outfit follows after.
Sets have so many factors, like lighting and they are HUGE. So many angles.....you'd have to KNOW the set well, which means YOU have also used it a lot or studied the promo art.
yes. one thing I think about a lot , then, is why buy all the various character ... it is possible to make your own character from just the basic form, and if you are willing, you can morph it away to whatever. It is whatever an artist wants it to be.
I check the galleries and also beloing to several FaceBook groups that feature Poser and DS art.
It is telling the many that are basically the same. It is also why I used to ask for more modern clothing, grunge, torn, etc etc ... away from big breasted, bare midriff, everything sex based, fantasy, etc etc ..but that is extremely popular within these art forms.
My son is an artist. very creative. I had an image I did in Poser. He took that, changed it up with postwork, to the point of my work being unrecognizable in my use of a stock character. His ability to manipulate the character was just amazing.
So the deal being ... creativity and skill does come into play in order to move beyond the box given us.
On the issue of clothing I beleive it is well known by now that I no longer buy clothing from DAZ as I model my own custom one offs.
On the matter of sets & environments, As a filmmaker, I find nearly all of the prefabbed sets unusable in the their Default Daz product configuration.
I export my stonemason sets
to C4D and import them with the "split by group option"
Because Stephan is so bloody meticulous about his grouping
I get a grouped hierarchy of separated doors ,walls ceilings floors etc.
in C4D
which enables me to animate doors opening/closing where they normally would be static in the official Daz version of the product and many other "kitbashing" options as well.
I also replace many of the native textures with C4D procedurals for faster rendering as well as adding my own glowing LED elementsand I Mix prefabbed set peices with my own modeled elements
to build entire new environments not so easily recognized as the exact ones everyone else is using.
I also replace most of the static Computer /display screens with my own
animated interfaces ,Most harvested from free youtube sources. as well as some custom developed by me in After Affects.
In this movie clip you can see examples of the utopia Deck with animated Bulkheads closing as panicked Station personel rush to avoid the incoming collision debris
as well as the Door closing to the generator room
(AKA The Ark) behind "Big george "the engineer.
I like this thread. I'm going have to come back to it later after work.
I started doing pencil drawings back when I was 7. I still have a manilla folder with a bunch of my drawings from age 8 to age 12. I still sometimes reference back to them, to remind myself of how far I've come with my skills.
Being able to draw, to paint, to sculpt, to photograph, or to use a 3D app to create a peice of art is something you have to learn. The most creative person in the world will still produce crappy artwork with tools they have no familiarity with. It takes a LOT of time and practice to develop those skills. That's the technical side to art. You have to learn the tools, their strengths and weaknesses, the techniques and tricks for them, etc. My pencil drawing skill is much better than it was when I was 12. But I STILL do not consider it sufficient to produce quality 'art'. Of course, I've shown some of my work to others and they rave. It's often true, that we are our own worst critics.
But be PATIENT. Keep working with the tools. Keep doing exercises with them. Keep using them to put what's in your head onto paper/canvas/clay/photos/images/etc., and the improvement WILL happen. DAZ Studio is no exception. Take the time to learn about some of the parts. Like cameras and lighting, image composition, color theory, and such. These apply to a LOT of different artistic endeavors.
Do it because you get to chat and share with a LOT of nice people who appreciate your efforts, whether they're masterpieces or doodles.
"Rather than getting lost in the story, I say, "Gosh, but everybody uses that dress!" This is especially true of sets
Just so I'm keeping score correctly, you're put off by seeing art in the DAZ GALLERY because you recognize (popular) products from the DAZ STORE?"
You're not keeping score correctly. There are few, if any, stories in the gallery. I am saying that using very distinctive products take me out of the narrative when reading longer length stuff. Ameliorating this problem requires kit-bashing and re-texturing. I'd never dream of using the new Urban Future without totally erasing (the very well done) murals if I wanted to employ it in a story.
As for the Daz Gallery: I check it out once in a while; there is some great stuff on there.
There's a difference between being recognizable and something that stands out due to it's design. Unless you can afford to buy designer originals, the fact is that most of the clothes you're wearing are also being worn by thousands of other people at the same time. Mix and match elements and swap around the colors/textures, and avoid the more ridiculously extreme items of skimpwear and there's usually more than enough variety to avoid obvious repetiton unless you're venturing into specific types of period wear or professional working gear..
Hairstyles are even more likely to be duplicated in the real world, as most people don't change their hairstyle every day and most hairstylists are working out of a basic list of currently popular styles. Granted, there are more than a few DAZ hairstyles that are so out there that they're unlikely to be seen in real life... thngs like https://www.daz3d.com/elements-hair-for-genesis ... but if you stick with your basic bobs, pony tails, updos, etc., and make free use of the available adjustment morphs, the variety is generally fine as long as you don't use the same hairdo on multiple characters in the same shot. Whiuch is why I have multiple versions of each type and a wide arsenal of hair shaiders on hand.
Actually, the thing that I find most problematical is vehicles. A large percentage of the ones sold at DAZ don't resemble anything in the real world, and while I've build up a decent collection of luxury cars, vans and SUVs from other sites, I still don't have things like a decent Prius clone, despite that being one of the most common cars on the market, and cars from any era other than the modern one or the 50s are few and far between.
Thank you very much!
And right there, you just answered your own opening post.
Some products actually need MORE renders. The PAs only posted close ups so I'm trying to figure out how it looks as a whole. I like to see how the overall set looks even if it's just a clay render.
Personally, I also like product promos that also include artistic postwork images like those of IgnisSerpentus. It shows what is possible. It's also inspiring and gives me a chance to study art techniques.