Getting priced out of this hobby
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Griffin: Yes, basic economic theory. You can only lower prices so far before you lose money, because you don't have an infinite pool of customers. So the goal is to find where the 'sweet spot' is where you charge enough to get most of the available customers reliably. There are many many examples of this and a lot of books and websites on the matter.
Also, it has been very very often observed that open feedback like a forum doesn't necessarily translate to actual customer behavior. People will often report that they want one thing, but buying patterns then contradict things.
Like, a lot of vocal people on the forum complain that there should be more male content. _I_ would like more male content. The problem? Customers, as a whole, don't buy male content nearly as well as female content. It doesn't matter how many times the threads come up, until actual customer behavior changes, Daz and PAs have to consider what will actually sell.
Thanks for the heads-up on the Flash sale Griffin, I hadn't checked the front page. I just spent $25 on it as well, but got $75 worth of stuff - I feel a little bad because I don't like to shortchange who I consider maybe the best vendor around, but I honestly couldn't afford to buy those products at full or even 30% off. I hope the vendors can make enough from those sorts of sales to recoup any potential losses.
I like being a pc+ member cause it really does save me money as is on average any pro bundle I buy for example it costs me an additional 30-$40 on top of the advertised price when converted to Australian $ so full price non pc member prices be out for me. And if it went subscription yeah that'd end it for me too. One other good thing they got rid of is you had a limited number of times to download install content you bought after think it was five times you had to rebuy the content
But then we're going around in speculative 'good business practices' circles.
If there's smaller demand for male content, BUT among the fewer choices you have an excellent product, then you get most of the sales from there being less competition.
So does it make sense to make what everyone else is making and just hope to do it better?
Among any product there's things you feel like you need, really want, could use, sorta like, is curious about, might use someday but doubt it.
Flash Sales pick up the middles and sometimes the bottom. There's no lost sales, unless you think someone would have bought it at full price, while it wasn't on sale or picked it up for 40% as a featured vendor item.
And 60% off, yes that 20% difference is a breaker to get it today or possibly wait to sell it for 20% more during your next release, assuming that among those 7 or 8 vendors featured, your wishlist items get grabbed.
Versus today's flash sale, there's only 2 other vendors to compete with/against. And they are all different in slant so you get a nice mix to choose from and even the pricing is varied.
Dammit!!!
I new it was going to be a flash sale day today! I already bought some stuff over at rendo to.
Whats worse, im a sucker for some Aeon Soul!
Griffin: You are putting forth speculation, I'm pointing out the consensus and theory on that speculation.
Yes, if the market is much bigger. Which it is. And there's a lot of room to make stuff that stands out as distinct from others (like Thorne figures or Aeon Soul clothing)
Now there's a combination of less competition and folks just wanting to do stuff that's not necessarily the most profitable, but there's only so far you can push it.
Thankfully it's not even more tilted; we DO see a lot of male content, and monsters, and animals. If those markets were much weaker, we wouldn't. I'm very happy the market is stronger.
(I mean, look at me. My one figure morph so far is 'dragons that look like snakes')
...I'm much the same.
I have spent a lot of time dial spinning custom characters of my own since the Gen4 days to he point I really don't need pre-made character morphs (I also don't use HD because of limited system resources). I do get a base figure now and then if I feel it will add to the "gene pool". Most of my content purchases outside of props, environments, and hair are merchant resource content which I use to create characters with (far more valuable to me). Along with skin resources like Beautiful Skins and Skin BuIlder Pro I have pretty much all I need (just picked up Slosh'e G3 M/F UV conversion tool on a flash sale so I can now use SBP base skins on male characters).
...your stuff is great. I particularly love the vehicles as many fit well with my cyber future settings.
For me spending $25-$30 on an item is out of the question. While they are very nice they are too expensive.
Yep, me too. That's the plan. Gonna hit it then quit it.
Unfortunately, 'expensive' has two common usage:
'I cannot afford/justify this expense'
and
'This price is unfair and out of proportion for what it is'
I hope most people actually mean the first.
Oh! Thanks for reminding me....the one thing I wanted from the flash sale that I forgot to put in my cart ;).
Laurie
This price is unfair and out of proportion for what it is'
Well, I don't want to be THAT GUY, but the Daz-Store powered method of approaching this 3D renders thing is truly for people who are...comfortable.
By the time you amass the tools and assets to render a full scene (yep, even one where they just loaded a bunch of stuff and hit render) we're talking a nice penny here.
Free stuff is kinda wack. I've scoured and searched out every Share-this and FREE3D site imaginable. Even the "forbidden ones". The quality level takes a serious dip.
When I buy a Daz product, I have the luxury of high expectations, that A) it's going to work as advertised and B) There's some kind of tech support when it doesn't.
Even this forum is HUGE for support. Lots of great peoples all connected through the passion for this 3D art(s). If this was about FREE stuff or discount bin level assets, you'd see the quality of the forum members tank.
And this forum is also super-policed so it remains a safe place to talk-shop, share and learn.
Even people who were a little mean one day are helpful the next. Daz-a-nites don't hold grudges. lol
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That said, if I don't got it, I don't got it. No amount of 'how long a vendor spent making an item' can suddenly add pennies to a bank account.
There's some things in life you just can't afford.
I don't think a huge chunk of the Daz offerings should slide into that category.
$24 bucks goes far in the Flash Sale. Doesn't go far in the daily sale anymore.
It wasn't like that till recently. Either it's the items or the sale.
See Will, now you got me rambling and I forgot what my point was.
...the nice thing here it is done over a span of time, you don't have to plunk down 500$, 1,000$, 2,000$, or more at one time. Yeah I probably have invested enough in this to purchase a 3DS Max perpetual licence (though they no longer offer those), but I didn't have to take out a loan or "sell the farm" to do so.
Your products are well worth the money, IMO! If they were on one of the sites that cater to the Maya folks, they would probably be 10x what they are here.
Trying to stay within my budget, I prioritize for the more unique, higher quality products. Vehicles and mechs are always welcome, as are historical sets.
Even though I would agree that products purchased are "generally" very good, I will also say that there are a LOT of nice freebies out there too. I don't mean my stuff (though I kinda like it....lol), but there is some super nice stuff for free if you take the time to go look. Sure, ya have to dig a little for it maybe, but it's out there. Uzilite has a really nice free dforce dress, Wilmap makes ALL her clothes for free (thanks Wendy :)), Fisty has given away some really nice things, as well as Fabi and a lot of the vendors that you know and love ;). Lully gave away some awesome free dynamic clothes that I still use today. What about those two FANTASTIC hair props by Kayleyss for G3F? Long and short LAMH hair for the HW Housecat by Saiyaness? I could go on and on...hehe. Scripts, clothing, characters, textures, accessories......nearly everything can be had in some form for free. Freebie creators are the unsung heroes of 3D content (and some of them are vendors)....just wanted to give a shout out for them too :P. Not all freebies are junk. Maybe one can't get away with ALL freebies, but they sure can take the edge off.
Laurie
+1
so now they know how to get rid of me
crying over the new releases i can only wishlist
the intro price on David8 was reasonable, imo
Yah. The more I think about a subscription model, the less I see it as a bad idea... I just dont think that my mind is wired for that sort of thing. I like owning.
I really dig your models. I dont have enough of them though. You fall into the same camp as Stonemason in regards to my purchases, really high quality, super looking goods but the prices can be somewhat high. I always look for sales on your stuff though. Tragically, I often seem to burn out my budget before daz puts your store on sale.
I cant believe you work from a cubicle. In my imagination I always see you all working in buildings like airplane hangers that have been turned into super tech playgrounds.
@dzfire You would have to look hard to find something you could do any better than you do now!
@serenenight Don't give DzFire and ideas! (What a hoot!)
What??????? David8 is out? I have David for M3 from March 2003. Guess I never bought him after that. Wow.
Uh. no. It's a PA character who just happens to be called David.
Compared to TurboSquid this place is dirt cheap and excellent quality .the meshes are all ready rigged n textured,That helps a lot :)
You can always get Blender n Gimp for "FREE" n make your own stuff .Even sell it here n make some change to buy other stuff you want.
DAZ is a money making engine ,Why not make your money too ? There's nothing stopping you ,It's all here for the taking.
Whew. I thought it was the real thing. I was curious to see what he looks like after all these years. I mean I've had him 15 years. Wonder if he's gone gray?
I don't buy much from Daz anymore not because of the prices but beause I've been modelling my own stuff.
Having siad that, I feel the prices at Daz is more than reasonable. Try to model/rig/texture what you see on the market and it will cost you more probably.
That's exactly the issue with the DIY approach. Such an investment of time, both learning and becoming proficient at all of those things. On the other hand, if I can buy what I like in a 60% discount sale, I can concentrate on making pictures which is why I started this hobby. There's an element of techie snobbery with some of the criticisms of those who don't go the DIY route but there are also degrees of involvement in the creation process. Adapting (morphing, shading, shape-shifting, ageing, posing) commercially produced models can be rewarding in itself and get the desired results a lot of the time. Depends on what those desires are, of course.
With the increased prices I’m a bit more picky about keeping buggy items or items that have details I’m less enthusiastic about. These issues I might overlook for a item that cost me less but if I have a usability issue and the item costs more im not going to spend time waiting for support to address it. I will return it and buy something which will be easier or less problematic to use.
I confess if I were a pa I’d lobby to cap Daz stores percentage they charge for support. 50 percent seems high to me.
The more you do DIY, the more library of assets you build. At first, everything was taking days, if not weeks, but once a library of my own assets were built, making things became easier and faster once my mind was set on what to make.
Well, in my case, I had to go DIY route because I am into modelling spaceships and space stations. Only few does that and those that do never fit my setting.