sy-victoria-4-and-michael-4-clones-for-genesis-8
daveso
Posts: 7,789
in The Commons
https://www.daz3d.com/sy-victoria-4-and-michael-4-clones-for-genesis-8
this allows v4 and m4 clothing to fit G8?
can these clothes by saved back out after conversion?
If so, would they then all fit G3 ... or do they fit G3 anyway?
G2?
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They allow for V4 and M4 clothing to fit G8, but do a terrible job of it from my experience (had to return it). You are better off autofitting to G3 and then saving to autofit to G8,
You will need these to autofit V4 and M4 to G3
https://www.daz3d.com/wear-them-all-autofitting-clones-and-clothing-smoothers-for-genesis-3-female-s
https://www.daz3d.com/wear-them-all-autofitting-clones-and-clothing-smoothers-for-genesis-3-male-s
thanks ..is it possible to go to G1 first ..then work forward ..without using those tools?
i'm in the middle of a thousand day render or i would give it a twirl ... well, i guess i could try later ... i was mainly interested in the above ... which is on sale right now...
i did try some v4 clothes on g3 ..without any tools..and that was an exercise in futility ...plus i dont know all the ins and outs of doing it .. yet.
You can autofit from generation to generation without any additional tools, as far as I know. Just save it as a "Wearable Preset" and then transfer it to the next generation, then save it as a Wearable Preset again, until you get it to the generation you want it on. Save it as a Wearable Preset the final time once it's on the generation you want to use it on (that way you don't have to go through the "leapfrog" process of transferring it to different generations again).
For instance, if you want an outfit that is made for V4 to be used on Genesis 3 the steps should be:
You can then save it as a Wearable Preset for the third time that way you can load it straight onto Genesis 3 in the future.
awesome..some work, but i will give it a go ... Thank you much.
LOL
FSMC doesn't like it because they only wanted to use it on skimpy clothing, and it was made for heavier coverage clothes. If you want to use it on bikinis, no, it's not going to work great, but it's great on long sleeves, pants and skirts (i.e. the things that are shown in the promos).
Mind you, Valzheimer does a great product, I'm not arguing with that.
Yeah, it is some work to do it the long way. :) I think that's why the "clones" are probably good sellers, people want the convenience of one step application - and the clones probably work better and make the outfits look better than the "leapfrog" autofit way. I'll have to test it out to see. ;)
I "don't like it" because it doesn't work as advertised. Maybe a change to the name of the product is in order since it only says "SY Victoria 4 and Michael 4 Clones for Genesis 8" which implies it works on all clothing, not just the types shown in the promos or specialized clothing items.
That is exactly why I purchased this product, because autofitting to G3 first and then saving became pretty tedious. Unfortunately I had to stick to this method.
if you add dforce to the clothes, does that pretty much solve all the fit problems and make fit-packs like this unnecessary? I did buy it but I haven't had a chance to play with it yet. I've always been curious, as soon as dforce came out.
I just did a quick test with Genesis 3 Female - of Wear Them All clone vs the "Leap-Frog" saving as Wearable Presets.
The figure on the Left has the Victoria 4 cocktail dress added to G3F via Wear Them All clone.
The figure on the Right has the Victoria 4 cocktail dress added to G3F via the Wearable Presets (first loaded to G1 and saved as a wearable preset, loaded to G2 then saved as a wearable preset, then loaded onto G3).
I didn't see any difference in the way the dress looks. However, there is a pretty big difference in the Parameters Tab. The Wear Them All fit seems to have lost all of the dress's movement morphs. Whereas the "Leap-Frog" method of saving as a Wearable Preset preserved the dresses movement morphs.
I don't know if that is an anomaly that the movement morphs disappear with the clones -or if that's normal. I'll have to do some more tests to find out. If anyone knows, let me know. :)
That is odd, normally autofit retains all the morphs, it is the custom bones that are lost.
I actually love that product. Its always worked very well for me. Of course, not everything works on everything, but I use all of her clones, all the time. I've never been disappointed in any of her products. And I've done it both way. its a huge timesaver for me, I LOVE a lot of the v4 clothes and use them often.
I own many sy products. The men’s swimweat was useful and well decrackifier.....I mean yes.... would love a waistband descalloper. All those abs on men look great but dang the way the waistbands look...
Well I just autofit the same dress as divamakeup (cocktail dress 2 for V4), onto G8F using https://www.daz3d.com/sy-victoria-4-and-michael-4-clones-for-genesis-8 (ie the clones mentioned by the OP) and it autofits very well and all morphs are retained.
Diva, did you check the top level of the item for the morphs? Autofit of poser items often places the morphs at the top level, ie directly under then item itself, rather than in the morphs tab. That is what I am seeing for G8F.
To add to this, the reason these clones do not fit the clothing well is because the shapes do not actually match V4 and M4. They are extremely distorted. This means they will only work for clothing where you don't care if it remains the same distance from the body in the fit as it was in the original. It also means they cannot be used to transfer morphs. This may work for some people. For the vast majority, a "clone" shape is understood to actually line up with the original figure.
i tried the preset challenge .. g1 through g3 .. it is a bit of work, but the result I thought was good. I didn't check for all the morphs and stuff ... but i did a pose using the G2 version and it worked very well .. no splits in the mesh, weird folds or anything.
v4 evening dress by Hongyu
It appears this dress is ideal candidate for dforce ...
g3-g ..left to right
I tried it again and these morphs are not with the Wear Them All fit dress but are with the "Leap Frog" Wearable Preset method:
That's with the Wear them all clones onto G3F. I don't have SickleYield's V4 clone for G8F (though I do have quite a few of her other products and I love them all!).
What's the best way of fixing that triangulation problem that happens in the left picture? Most of the old V4 stuff I use on G3 and G8 figures have that issue. I also use the G1-G2-G3-G8 wearable preset method.
I said it in a previous thread, and I'll say it again: the purpose of the distortions is to achieve specific movements of the cloth. Moving verts one way in a clone moves them the opposite in the garment. Pushing the inner thighs out reduces triangulation in skirts; yanking the toes up and forward reduces hemline chunking in longer garments; making a ridge in the underbust helps de-rigdify looser shirts and coats in that area. Having a clone that looks just like the figure it's for is not the way to achieve the best fit.
I honestly don't understand the level of acrimony with this one. The Ultra Templates have a power of ten more returns (8% for UT vs. .08% for the V4 and M4 clones for G8) and not one single angry forum complaint.
Well they work fine for me, so we are not all unhappy!
Thanks for the info about the somewhat distorted look of the clone, but if that creates better fits than that is the most important thing, particularly with the triangulation issue, which kills the look for so many dresses/tunics. When I used your clone the dress looked fine.
I have my own V4 morph for morph purposes which is without the distortions. Whilst mine looks better for morphing, yours is definitely better for fitting.
my technical expertise eludes any understanding of what you all talking about.
Basically:
Bascially clones allow clothing made for one figure to fit another. In this case it's V4 clothing to fit on GF8. In the past the clones were close to the original V4 shape which gave you a normal snug fit on the newer figure, but special clothing like dresses and tunics usually had issues, usually in the crotch area. SY has usually come out with some great templates that helped fix these types of issues.
With the product mentioned in this thread, she did the same thing adding special helpers, but in doing so, it fubared the basic shape you had in the past with the other, original clones. You can see it clearly if you dial up just the V4 clone on GF8, it is highly warped and distorted. As she has mentioned, this was done to help with the fitting of special clothing items such as dresses and tunics, but some people, myself included bought this product expecting just normal V4 and M4 clones as advertised and since I don't use dresses and tunics much, it is basically of no use to me since there is no normal fit option. I have to rely on autofitting to GF3, which gives a perfect fit, then saving and using the clone that came with GF8 to autofit the saved GF3 version, a great work around, but a huge pain..
thanks to 2 above ... there is a lot to learn
Yeah, that's...what I said. Because the clone shape is distorted, parts of the clothing that would originally have been close to the body will NOT be close to the body on the fit. The clones push out parts of the clothing. This looks "okay" on clothing where you can't see how it lines up with the body, especially loose clothing. On tight clothing and low coverage clothing it does not look okay.
Does it help when fitting V4 clothing to have a V4 morph dialed in to a newer Genesis base?t