Question: How many of you have switched from Iray to 3Delight recently (say since G8 dropped)?
tj_1ca9500b
Posts: 2,057
Title says it all...
Just curious about if there are a significant amount of people that have 'swapped out' Iray for 3Delight recently, what your reasoning was, and how the experience has been...
Iray and 3Delight each have their pros and cons of course, but I'm just wondering about recent experiences from those that have chosen to switch to 3Delight...
3Delight isn't Cuda core card dependent, hence my curiousity.
Post edited by tj_1ca9500b on
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Comments
I tend to use Iray more than 3Delight, but it has nothing to do with G8 in which I choose. Which render engine I use is more down to what I am trying to do.
I was just picking Genesis 8's introduction as a timeframe start (June 2017), since a lot of people would be able to use that introduction as a frame of reference. I suppose I could have just said June 2017...
It's a decent frame of reference, but carries, to me, connotations as G8 was (again, to me) teh real start of figures being Iray by default. Thus your questions seemed to suggest that the uptake in DAZ providing Iray-based stuff made people use 3Delight more ;)
I use whichever one fits the situation. If I need photorealistic, I choose IRAY. If I'm using a lot of older props, I use 3Delight. I'd say my usage is about 50/50 overall. Toon stuff still usually does better in 3Delight, at least in rendering time.
I have never used 3Delight and never intend to. I used Luxrender before Iray and Poser/Vray/Maxwell/Arnold before that
Stopped using 3DL when Iray became available, and not going back.
Also keep going back and from depending on what I do.
Best with 3DL:
* Fast
* Volumetric cameras
* You can turn off items from reflect or cast shadows or other items from recieving shadows
* You don't get that darn floor shadow when you render standalone figures without bg
* No graininess
Best with Iray:
* Fotorealism
* Versatile shades
* Shades that emit light
* Skins and water and other similar items are soo much better in iray
The question isn't directed to you guys, as you aren't using 3Delight.
My question is directed to current users/ recent 3Delight adopters that choose it over Iray (and why).
We already know that a large majority of Daz users are using Iray (myself included) and I'm not looking for a head count of Iray users... let's keep this thread on topic please, i.e. I'd like to hear from recent 3Delight adopters.
My curiosity on this was piqued based on some external rendering engine comments/comparisons I read elsewhere (those that aren't GPU based), hence my interest in this subject.
----
The comment which diogenese19348 made about 3Delight being a better option for 'toon' style renders (r.e. lower rendering times) is an interesting one.
And "I switch between them based on what I'm looking for in the render' comments are also intriguing...
well. I switched one time to 3Delight for rendering a background for a fight scene, the environment was on interiors and no need to be realistical, but Im 99.9% iRaynian.
in my case scenario, at this time, I think is more complicated now fix 3DL materials than iRay shaders, my perspective.
I'm going to be really surprised if anyone switched from actively using Iray to 3Delight recently, because there haven't been any improvements in 3Delight recently to trigger that sort of thing.
Iray is still mostly uncharted territory for me. Especially since there's nothing that can compete with 3DL Toon renders, in terms of ease of use and functionality on the Iray side of things.
I have yet to even try to render anything in Iray. 3DL was enough of a hassle to get a handle on.
Am getting a fair amount of use from my library of 3DL shaders, and a couple of converter scripts. But some things don't really go to 3DL very gracefully.
I’ve been thinking of switching back. I really like the color and vibrancy and the lack of grain in 3dl renders I tend to heavily postwork so it really doesn’t matter excessively how it looks originally.
i need to figure out how to convert Iray textures to 3dl then I may try it.
...I switched back to 3DL not because of G8 but due to the ridiculously stupid prices being charged for GPU cards thanks to the cryptomining craze, as well as long render times in CPU mode (which is the only option I have) to achieve the optimal "photo realistic" quality which is the Iray's main "selling point".
While there have been no recent updates to 3DL on Daz's end, there are improvements that have been made and/or are in the pipeline by individuals .like Parris, Kettu, and Wowie.
This!
Upon returning to DAZ this past September after a 6 year hiatus, I chose 3Delight over Iray. I’m using DAZ as one component in a design process and 3Delight is much more efficient in terms of workflow and productivity. A raw render is only just the beginning for most of the designs in my projects. For most of my needs, Iray doesn’t provide significant benefits to offset its liabilities. 3Delight is also more accommodating when it comes to large scenes with a lot of content.
I've gone back to using 3DL more recently. It renders so much faster. I'd forgotten why I enjoyed doing 3D art since it took so long to even view a small sample render. Now I can play around again without waiting 2-3 hours to see what the results kinda/sorta look like. Also, I have not been able to get a decent looking drow skin in Iray, so I find myself using 3DL anytime I am working with actual black skin.
I'm using it more often and may be transitioning into using it totally. I overpaint so much that I'm not sure iray is worth the time it takes to render.
I have dabbled in Iray, but with the work that I do I find 3DL is all I need since I postwork my images, the need for photorealism is not required..
I switched to IRAY when it was released; I was a Cycles user at the time. Plus my 3Delight renders sucked - not because it was a poor renderer, but because I couldn't get my head around it. I occasionally retry stuff and I have done better with 3Delight.
I think the biggest issue for folks wanting to try 3Delight, isn't the shortage of information (there is quite simply, too much), but simple examples of getting something working in Studio with 3Delight.
People and objects, indoor and outdoor.
Edit:
I never found the included Studio help, well helpful.
I have used both for a long time but slowly I’m putting 3dl behind me.
Part of that is learning how to make Iray produce a wider range of renders, including fast renders useful for artistic styles.
Part of that is being reminded that 3dl’s time savings go out the window whenever I try to do something moderately realistic with the lighting; even in cpu mode it’s faster and easier to use Iray.
So I’ve had the opposite experience; G8 has helped nail the 3dl coffin shut.
Just an observation based on my experience with the forums here and interactions with other graphic designers, I feel that many 3Delight users are more project/design focused, using postwork extensively and frequently working with professional deadlines. Iray users seem to be more about the render and the mechanics of the process and in turn many want to use those skills to become PAs.
The ongoing Iray/3Delight debate is frustrating as it often hijacks otherwise interesting and constructive threads. Why can’t there be an accepted coexistence? I personally prefer 3Delight for most of my work, but I’m not adverse to using Iray if it will suit my needs and not negatively impact my productivity.
Iray is crazy slow on my older machine (I can't use dForce either) and most of my projects are styilzed, postworked, etc. Overall, 3DL works better for me than iray. I do like iray for "still life" type of renders, especially anything with water and glass surfaces, which is something more miss than hit for me in 3DL.
Bascially, if what I want is best achieved through the iray render engine, I'll use it even if it takes hours. If what I want is best achieved through 3DL, I'll use that one, even if it takes hours. If I keep going back to 3DL it's becuase it's a better fiit for my projects. It's not complicated or agenda-driven, it's a choice. Glad I have that choice.
The reason I keep commenting on comparisons is because I think a lot of analyses are just... wrong, and it makes me sad imagining users not having a good Iray experience because they have been told Iray isn’t good at what they want.
I LOVE Iray for postwork/art style stuff. It can make big images really fast.
It might be grainy or less nuanced or whatever, but if I’m doing a brush postwork, it doesn’t matter. I can get a decent quick pass in a minute or two (even in CPU).
But when people are told ‘Iray is only good for photorealistic images and only if you have really good NVIDIA cards’, they are possibly missing out on a workflow that really works well for them.
Agreed Anyone how owns properly specced hardware for IRay,and does not render animations,
would have no reason to go back to 3DL .. not exclusively.
My opinions of Iray are not based on "what I've been told," but on my own personal experience using the engine on my current hardware configuration. I'm using 3Delight because it is the right fit for me right now. This is not about a right or wrong anaylsis. As the OP noted, he wanted insight from 3Delight users, not counterarguements from Iray supporters.
It's all about choice. And it's just really tiresome to be constantly told that you've made the wrong choice by individuals with absolutely no knowledge of your own personal creative dynamic.
I’m more concerned by less experienced users reading these threads and being mislead.
There is no intention here to 'mislead." People are just sharing their own personal experiences as per the request of the OP. I am confident that these "inexperienced users" you speak of are intelligent enough to disseminate the opinions presented here and elsewhere and create work strategies that are best suited to their own personal needs, whether they involve Iray, 3Delight or both.
Thanks for staying mostly on topic guys. It is most appreciated.
For the record I have nothing against Iray, use it regularly, and have only dabbled a bit with 3Delight as I'm still learning things. There are other threads that compare the merits of Iray vs 3Delight (not looking to rehash those arguments here, those threads do that nicely), and they are quite simply different tools in the toolbox, with different approaches to the same problem (generating 3d images).
The insights that a few of you have provided r.e. 3Delight have been quite valuable so far, and I look forward to hearing from more people that are making good use of 3Delight. I feel like I have a pretty good handle on Iray (although I have a LOT to learn still), but I want to broaden my skills and dabble a bit more with 3Delight now that I'm fairly comfortable with Daz. It sounds like some of the art that I like to do might be well suited for 3Delight, if I can get the hang of it...
It's always good to have options!