Daz Continual Incorrect Sale Prices - Why Does Mgmt Allow?
ItsCeo
Posts: 471
Time and again there are sales, time and again the sale prices are incorrect. This is a systemic problem for Daz so much so that in the forums people joke about 'Daz math'. I think overcharging customers over and over again is not a joke.
Doesn't anyone at DAZ test the sales software? As a buyer of their products, I have very low confidence much of the time that the price I am paying is the correct price. Daz does not seem to care that this is a systemic problem as it happens over and over again.
In fact, this post will probably be deleted from the forums because it complains about Daz.
Please don't suggest to me that customer service will 'make it right'. I have only had 2 instances where I appealed to customer service about flagrant price errors where I was overcharged. In one case I ended up having to file a Paypal dispute, and the other I had to threaten to drive from Vegas to Salt Lake and file a small claims case. I am sure your experience is different.
So, what is the solution? Less convoluted sales? More testing of the software? What? As customers we should demand correct pricing. Obviously, Daz does not prioritize correct pricing since these problems happen over and over again. Don't you think if CEO James Thornton told the IT staff to 'get the prices right', they would? He is most likely unaware that this is a systemic problem and that error in pricing has become the 'normal'.
Daz 3D is part of 
Connect
DAZ Productions, Inc.
7533 S Center View Ct #4664
West Jordan, UT 84084
Licensing Agreement | Terms of Service | Privacy Policy | EULA
© 2025 Daz Productions Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Comments
Good question, but they have a different sale theme (usually of moderate complexity) every single day (except for Sundays).
I imagine the small sales team spends much of their time designing future sales, with little choice but to accept Facebook's 'move fast and break things' motto.
It's not ideal for the consumer, just as it's not ideal for airlines to overbook flights, but as a company, they have to remain competitive.
And as customers, it's nice to see a different major sale each day (just as it's nice to have cheaper flights due to airline competition...which overbooking partly enables).
I honestly don't think they intend the glitches to be present (who likes getting constant calls on the weekend to fix stuff?), but the alternative (more testing leading to less frequent new sales) has likely been tried. I haven't been a customer for long, but I read Daz used to have less frequent sale/promo changes (at least, non-daily) -- my guess is that this strategy didn't result in sales numbers as high as the current strategy.
I will say your experience with customer service sounds unique. They've always 'made it right' for me. I'm surprised you had to dispute anything since their return policy lets you return anything within 30 days, for any reason (so far as I'm aware).
Please refrain from using "WE" as your rant doesn't pertain to me and my experiences. that being said, I have been here a long time and have a ton of products. i spend a little extra time going over what I am being charged and have never felt the need to file a support ticket for a price issue. Sure there have been a few price glitches, but more in my favor than not, so it washes. Then again, I am far from being cheap enough to put in a support ticket for a $2.00 or under price difference, even if I purchased it earlier for a couple of dollars more, that is just crazy IMO.
I remember this thread and the way they were responding to him was the funniest stuff I've ever seen (in a bad way).
"Caveat emptor" applies anywhere you spend money.
The final responsibility for what I buy rests with me. If I don't like how someone does business, then I go elsewhere.
Hi @itceo
First, I noticed you joined in June. That's not even a year, but I do think it's enough time for you to know Daz indeed does have glitches. And so many work in our favor! That's the first thing to note. But second, I recommend you surf the sales thread daily, as we are very active in pointing out the glitches, and the mods are wonderful at reporting them and telling when they are fixed. Yes, Magento is a crappy shopping cart-I spent thousands of dollars testing carts for my small business back in 2008, and I wouldn't even CONSIDER Magento with it's funky modules after reading reviews and getting input from other small business owners. But Daz uses it, so we're stuck with it.
I haven't had any issues with the folks in Customer Support. They have always bent over backwards to help, but that's just my experience. Jamie in particular. (Edit- taken out, as doesn't apply.)
While you're waiting on that, simply ask in the forums if you are having a problem with materials, lighting, whatever. We're here to help and want you to have an enjoyable experience. I've done this five years now and the forum members for the most part are very helpful.
@dragonfly_2004 I can agree with that philosophy, I've done that with fast food places that keep messing up orders. But there were other fast food places selling the exact same thing. (Say, a McDonalds.) IMO I don't think that works so well in this case,since we're dealing with limited suppliers, the others of which have varying degrees of quality (which agree, we have that here too) and worse store structures/customer service. Some other sites have really nice people/customer service, but lack the gigantic scope of products. Every site has its strengths and weaknesses. And not everyone has the same experience with customer service, apparently.
Daz has one of the best customer service pipelines, in that we don't have to deal with individual vendors, and the store is the best organized IMO. I bet if there were bigger contenders that had more organization for store structure, equitable sales, and the variety and number of products- Daz would have to get it's act together or feel the pinch. Right now, where's the competition that has all those things, that is equitable in size to offer the scope of products? Going elsewhere completely isn't a great option IMO
no worries ... it's really simple these dsys ... complex stacking sales are history it seems ... many products have gotten 25 percent more expense, but if you buy two -- a big if -- you get 50 percent off, for a savings of 38 percent, where it used to be 50 perent -- plus stacking for up to about 65-68 percent off in the past ... those were the days ... that was march madness in the past ... not so crazy now ... unless you like getting free v4 stuff for going along with the 38 percent thing, or other markdowns on old , really old stuff
I try to avoid using credit cards when purchasing an item. I buy a giftcard with credit card, and use store credits when buying items. That way even if there is an error, it won't result in my card being overcharged.
When there's a sale on giftcards (and I have the money), I buy more than I immediately need. If there isn't a sale on giftcards, and I'm out of store credit, then I put the stuff I want in my cart, see how much it costs, and buy a giftcard for that exact amount. I turn that into store credit, and buy the items. The possibility of being overcharged is eliminated.
I think most people most days don't experience pricing errors. It sucks that you ended up in the minority that do, though.
I'm having trouble with my eyes today so sorry for the big font. This is an interesting idea Ati. Thanks.
As someone who has been overcharged by a lot twice, I know how upsetting it can be. Customer service always fixes me right up though. However, I've never had it happen on a very large order. If that happened, I honestly don't know what I'd do. I feel your pain though.
Laurie
Hello,
I have a support ticket that asked how prices are calculated. After all, math is a science and the same formula should produce the same number. After three weeks of back and forth, the support team STILL has yet to provide a formula that works.
In fact, during the life of the ticket, the advice changed several times as to why the costs are what they are.
All I want to know is how to calculate my cart price without having to actually put stuff in my cart and wonder how the price was calculated. This is not a high priority question for them and apparently it's too hard to ask someone who might actually know the answer before speculating. Check please, I'm done with the bullshit.
@Ati, you are brilliant.
For every 1 customer who has voiced a negative view of a situation, there are a minimum of 10 others who simply did not say anything.
Certainly true, but there's also many who have no problems. But there are certain fields where even a 99% accuracy rate isn't good enough because the volume of hits is just so high. I feel like that's what's going on here. Likewise I don't have problems understanding the pricing mechanics, but that doesn't mean you aren't having a problem, and a problem you'd much prefer to have solved on the customer service end. It's tricky.
This is how it works.
Percent means "out of 100," so, to express them as a ratio, you divide by 100. So 10% is 0.1, 50% is 0.5, etcetera.
Take all your percents off and subtract each one of them from 1 to find the actual percent cost, not percent off. So 10% off is 1-0.1=0.9, which is the same thing as saying an item with a 10% discount costs 90% of what it used to.
Then, multiply the base price by all those percent costs.
So, you have an item that costs $20. You also have a discount of 10%, and a discount of 50%. The equation then looks like this:
$20*(1-0.1)*(1-0.5)=$9
Which is the same thing as saying: the item costs $20, but has a discount of 10%, which makes it cost $18, and another discount of 50% off that, which makes it cost $9.
While i am sure there might be others with issues, I would love to know wher you got those numbers from.
There's actually marketing research on this. http://www.intotheminds.com/blog/en/complaint-handling-in-numbers-are-customers-really-satisfied/
Edit - nevermind, I shouldn't get into this
Is there a group out there that wants to be overcharged? Can they possibly be larger than the group that doesn't? A completely irrational, completely silent majority?
Greetings,
That's a misunderstanding of what they're saying. Simplifying the sales would likely result in significantly fewer good discounts. That would be dissatisfying to me, for example.
The math is NOT hard, and the numbers are consistent. Some items end up in the wrong bucket, but that's usually fiixed. Discount rules are complex, and the folks putting them in are human. Politely point out a pricing error, and it's more likely to be fixed..
The only real trouble comes during pricing changeovers (typically midnight DAZ time) when it's not entirely safe to check out. The reason is that price changes are not atomic; they eliminate one set of rules, and apply another, and that can result in a momentary spike in the price, that goes away when the new rule takes effect. I don't believe that's something that can be fixed with the software they're using, and it's vastly not worth it to change to a different package at this point. Instead they've invested in a stellar customer support department.
I had exactly one of those happen recently; my price was something like $32 over what I'd expected it to be. I contacted customer support, provided documentation of what the prices should have been, gave them the order number, and how much (exactly) it was overcharged by, and politely asked them to fix it. Even with March Madness insanity going on, they fixed it in two days. (Normally they're closer to 24 hours, but March Madness absolutely slams the customer service folks.)
I will note that when rounding is involved, especially with stacking percentage discounts, you should presume that the final number will be about a penny more than what you might think it'll be, so if you're using the 'exact store credit/gift card' approach, take that into account.
-- Morgan
Daz has almost always bent over backwards to correct any issues I've had with the cart price, even the one time I did not notice the overcharge for a while. Jamie is absolutly wonderful representative of the company and good ethics. That said, I often find the wording on the sales adverts confusing, and have to read it more than once. I have had a lot of stuff go through for a different price than what it says it is in the cart and although they always make it right for me it would be really nice not to need to be so vigiliant in checking my bank after a purchase.
No people do not joke about "daz maths" as something that is wrong. Its correct mathematically.
For example if you have a product with an original price of $100, that is 30% off, and you then apply another unrelated 10% discount to it, daz maths is correct that the final price is NOT 60% of the original price !
30% off $100 = $70 (because 30% of 100 is 30, and 100 minus 30 is 70)
10% off $70 = $63 (because 10% of 70 is 7, and 70 minus 7 is 63)
This means the correct awnser is $63 not $60.
The trick to doing it on a calculator is you must apply discounts one at a time.
It is mathematically incorrect to simply add up discount percentages together, and that is the mistake people keep on making.
It is important to check the maths before you buy to ensure a discount isnt missing, as many of these discounts have complex trigger conditions and you dont want to accidently miss a discount due to either your mistake or their mistake.
I agree that please dont include me as part of 'we'.
Customer service at Daz is some of the best I've seen anywhere, and the best online.
I don't like Sales that are broke, but no Sales at all as they would have less time to create due to more creation would be bad; it may even result in more price increases, over those we are seeing.
As others have said; we are responsible for what we buy.
@Cortex.
Maths is correct, the wording around it can be ambiguous and so causes confussion too.
For example, what is the difference between additional and extra discount; they should mean something different (at least in my opinion and possibly others) but result in the same formulae being applied.
Marketing in general has a reputation for being relaxed with accuracy and truth in the name of sales. Inconsistent wording from Daz, can give that impression even when not intended.
Edit
It is well known, I feel, that many people's maths isn't great; yet there is no attempt (beyond these forums, which is frequented - we are told - by a relatively low percentage of customers) to clarify the situation to potential customers; this has the effect (regardless of intent) of perpetuating the belief that folks are getting more discount than they really are.
An explanation page could exists; it could contain the meaning of words as they pertain to sales - and an explanation of how the discounts are applied; it doesn't matter if customers can't be bothered clicking on it, or reading it - as long as it is there.
That's actually a pretty good idea.
Thank you.
... I had one once before; it was many years ago so I forget exactly when, and what it was about. :)
Its just something that people with low mathematical ability
The trick to doing it
It is mathematically incorrect to simply add up
Like to "add up" these statements- that there's a trick and the first truth is not that the math is hard to figure, it's figuring out WHAT system they use.
------------------------------
And after you're done making your arguments, we drop back to the number 1 rule of EVERY STORE on earth. If your customers have ANY confusion over pricing, you're doing it WRONG.
Forget The English, semantics, context and math degrees.
If there's a phrase coined by your customers called "Daz Maths" - what does that tell you?
And no matter WHAT you gather from that - what do you do, as a business owner?
I know what you do as a forum member, you insult the buying public as having poor math skills as opposed to making some oft-suggested changes.
We have 2 major issues. Your frustration with them may vary.
1) What order do you put the discounts in- and the long time you spend trying to calculate what is worth buying and what is not.....how much, what banner etc....
An extra wig for another factor-of-10% discount on my cart. Put a lot of stuff in it, and it's worth doing, but then the cost is overall much higher with the extra items. Or fewer items that cost more.
I need TWO from this narrow category. Oh, everything that's worth buying in this list, I already bought. Well, okay If I buy TWO NEW items, I can get a bunch of old stuff, but those two new items already sent my cart much higher in price. Okay, what can I do without? Oh no, once I reduce the number of items, that extra 10% off isn't worth it- I mean getting rid of that second item shaves 9 bucks off, alone. Oh dear.
2) When to buy? Daz midnight is only transition-time and not a sales-opening. There's always something off. If it sounds too good to be true, it might be. And you truly don;t want to rip Daz off. - knowingly purchase something for pennies on the dollar. True it happens and it's their responsibility, but then it happened so frequently, it teetered between a Lucky Break to Taking Advantage. After you buy -- Sometimes you don't even notice that you missed something or a better deal slipped past. But then you should ideally wait for the first set of corrections, but then you should also wait till Fast Grab updates so that you don't shoot your budget too soon. But then you need to wait longer because there might be a flash sale - that WILL USE THE ITEMS YOU ALREADY PURCHASED for extra savings. And throughout the day- there will be new threads popping up with pricing errors so you can never be too sure.
------------
I would also love something that showed what I paid, aside from that initial email. I'd like that be listed and able to see at a glance.
You could also LIST ALL THE DISCOUNTS at checkout.
Right now it says something like "PC+ saved you $136.68 on this order"
Suppose it broke down the discounts.
Okay I'm dreaming now. lol
I use Paypal when I'm not using a Gift Certificate. Same thing there, they show me what I am getting charged. If it doesn't match what was in the cart, I back it out and try again. The cart unquestionably glitches, and it isn't a rare occurance.
This seems to be the base of many of the problems — I'm sure many of us were here for the Great Changeover Fiasco a few years back, when an afternoon's shutdown turned into more than a week, and the shiny new Magento-driven store was still having showstopping bugs fixed months later. But while DAZ has stuck with Magento, the sales have been getting more and more complicated (and frequently overlapping), needing manual intervention to give the store database a good hard kick and settle things down... exactly what the changeover to Magento was supposed to fix. <headdesk>
Mine too, mostly. I've only needed a dozen or so small refund tickets over my 14 years at DAZ, and they were always handled promptly — sometimes on the same day. The only problems I've had with CS are with technical glitches, where a single phrase or sentence in my ticket report has been fixated on, while the entire rest of my report is passed over.
I actually had a situation once when I authorized PayPal to charge X amount, and ended up with a charge of more than that. So I can't trust the PayPal authorization screen. Customer Support took care of the situation quickly, so all is good. But you should definitely check your receipt after each purchase.