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People that make female-only content wanted to keep making female-only content without fitting it to the male base.
Additionally, if you model for a generic base that then gets morphed out into either male or female, creature, whatever, you're basically starting out with a fairly distorted mesh. Probably a pain to work with. Modeling for a figure with boobs then correcting a morph for bigger boobs is easier than modeling for an androgynous figure, correcting the morph for a figure with boobs, and then correcting that morph for bigger boobs.
Yup. I was a die hard Poser user and hated DS but got into it for IRay. I still have my beloved Mac that just came out of the shop with a brand new hard drive but I finally caved in and got a Windows PC with NVIDIA just to do IRay during Black Friday sales. I still haven't set it up but can't wait to render an actual IRay scene instead of just a girl with no background for 24 hrs...
Thanks for the clarification, Agent Unawares, and sorry for any confusion that may arise from my having revised the quoted portion after you'd already responded (though it seems my original description of the issue was ironically closer to the truth). Still, that stuff may have been relevant in the past, but with how well Auto-Fit seems to work now as well as the reliable release of shrink-wrap-smoothing add-ons for clothes that cover the boobs, I think it might be time to try a transgender-morphing base figure again.
No worries, I compulsively edit my posts as well. It's entirely possible there were male content creators who didn't want to deal with female shapes also.
What exactly does IRay do that the latest version of Poser can't? I'm still an exclusive Poser guy, using DS only as a vehicle for auto-fitting clothes and exporting new figures via WillDial's indispensable process, Frankly, I love the fact that an enterprising Poser user figured out how to get figures into Poser that weren't actually supposed to work in Poser, and with most or all of their functionalities intact! A part of me can't help but think of it as a sort of defiant triumph after Daz's decision to stop supporting Poser-compatibility directly.
Looking forward to seeing what you're able to render now, Alicia! I know how much dForce has made playing with cloth sims so much more fun since I'm a tweaker (in large part because of how GPU support speeds up iterations). This will no doubt be the case for you and Iray now, too.
- Greg
Poser can render in Cycles, so nothing. You'll just lack preset materials.
Well I don't know about the loyalty thing but after investing heavily in G1, making custom morphs, animation presets and so on, I just can't see myself upgrading right now, why would I? Sure I can see why people move on and I have no problem with that. I just feel I have everything I need already except for environment sets clothing and props and the likes. I've collected a fair amount of M4/V4 skins and clothing, still do since G1 is not supported anymore, some are bad some are really great, when I get some great stuff dirt cheap I feel like a sweepstakes winner lol. And since I happen to love 3DL I see even less reason to invest allover again. Moreover there are some truly great morphs for M4 in addition to a number of unique skins. The mat presets can of course be terrible but a good texturemap and bump- specularmap take you a long way, right?
Yea I'm no modeller or PA so really cannot understand the whole process but I remember being disappointed when I realized where we're going:) Well basically if you split genders you double the sell. (not entirely true of course but you get what I mean)
Fascinating stuff:0
I have my doubts lol!
And to the OP: Sorry for getting slightly carried away here:-)
I think the question should be what can DS/IRay do, that Poser/Superfly can not, assuming you want renders from an unbiased renderer.
The short answer is it can nothing more, and that both should be able to produce similar results, however that is in the hands of experts. The advantage of IRay, at least in the hands of "normally" skilled users, is the fact that it has a vast array of available shaders that makes getting the wanted results easier. There are some SuperFly shader packs around, but a far smaller number. Also so much content is available now, both at this store, and elsewhere, which has been set up and optimized for IRay, an order of magnitude more than that available for Superfly.
Read where?
I dunno. I see a lot of new Genesis 8 products, even at the other site. I see a fair amount of stuff still being released for Genesis 3, or here combo G3 & G8. I like the combo stuff, I am more likely to buy it.
I don't have much experience, as I was a Poser + Octane user stuck on V4 until Genesis 3 swayed me over to Studio and Iray. Genesis 1 & 2 looked nice but the compatibility kept me at V4. I think that's what really led to V4 lasting a long time.
I have bought V8, Genesis 8 morphs and a number of other Genesis 8 things, but I haven't put effort in to using it yet. With a large Genesis 3 library now, it's just not really offering me anything to entice me to switch. I could be one clinging to Genesis 3, only time will tell. Here's what will get me to migrate to Genesis 9 - MORE POLYS!!! The number of polys is getting a bit long in the tooth for stills. With how powerful the latest generation of video cards are, seems like they are being overly Grinchy about it.
I had purchased a few G1 things, and the 2 ... but 3 caught my eye. The only deal for me was the fact I was still using Poser, so as DAZ characters could not be used in Poser, I remained with V4. THen I was seeing all those great iRay renders..and the detail in the characters, the realism, and I knew I had to learn DAZ Studio. So then, after trying DS since it was first released way back in time, and not liking it, I'm finally able to get out some renders that look decent. I have been buying G3 characters and content, and things are looking up
I even did my own dForce draping yesterday. The depth of DS is way beyond Poser for sure.
The part that bothers me is the increased release of new base figures. Things are changing up fast, and this creates the need to continually obtain new stuff ... clothes, etc etc. I don't want to invest in one particular figure if it is going the way of the Poser figures and not getting support over the long haul. The ability to use older content on the new figures is essential, or at some time, a lot of people will start falling off the wagon not being able to keep up. It is also apparent that each new figure brings a rehash of older content ... how many times do we need to buy the morphing cloak, for instance.
With all the transfer products available, I use all models from V3 to G8. Clothes, hair, skin, morphs, poses etc you name it I use it.
I like progress. I am happy to have a new figure coming out every two years, as long as improvements come with it.
That is just it for me. I spent on G1 and I spent on G2, then I went all out on G3F. By being an early adopter of G3F I ended up waiting on skin builder and morphs and things to come out and not getting many renders done. In fact my husband thinks I am 99% file collector and 1% artist (that artist part painted his bedroom and refinished his office furniture so I get one point....). I wanted a decked out character with G3f and I have that now. I won't be choosing new models in development in the future. When development closes, I can see what a character offers all at once, now and forever. I don't mind them constantly developing things but I can't buy a new car every year and I can't upgrade character models every two years in a two year long process. My budget does not allow that. Also this two years is G3F moment to shine and get used by me. Collecting isn't the same as working and I have yet to do enough of the working end. I will always be a daz customer and fan but I have to settle for the used cars so to speak. My genesis and G2 characters are not really decked out like G3F and after spending a ton, I don't actually use them anymore. I might get some older items to make them more useful but for right now it just seems redundant.
I would like to point out that I would just prefer to choose a model after its two year run when it is really finished. I can make a shopping list, load my wish list and probably set that up in 6 months or less and get rolling. I don't have a problem with change at all. I have a problem with waiting and seeing what is available after I have spent and spent and waited and waited. I never know what the costs are going to look like on items that have not been built yet. I can't assess the cost of upgrading when I am waiting to see if this or that appears even. Its a boneheaded move to do what I did with G3F and its not smart at all for me to do it again. G8 might be awesome and I might decide to do that in the future, but now is not the time for me to do that. I am frustrated with people thinking one must have the character while it is being developed and assuming it is trash the second her closet is deamed well enough stocked. To me it is more valuable after the building phase for many very logical, sound reasons.
I will be G1-2 for the foreseeable future.
I am a content developer completely emancipated from the Daz
content hamster wheel
(Not counting stonemason environmental set models)
I will always have real new clothing for G1-2
and each outfit will be a custom one off
that will never appear in any render or animation not created by me.
I have even figured out how to use the dynamic hair of Maxon C4D
on my imported genesis models
On the matter of G3 being the new V4
No not at all.
V4's unnatural longevity is like classic 1960's era cars in cuba ..
other modern options were " limited"
I dunno that any figure will out live V4(the 6 years of dominance). I'm sure the only reason V4 may seem like it has less content is because it has been vaulted. We don't need 100K products on a single site :)
It took me a long bit to get into G3. But I still use G2 as well. I occasionally pull out G1 since it has morphs I never got in later generations (because the cycles are so short now, each generation is going to lack something).
I use a small bit of G8 now. For one off bits. I like some of the shapes and textures I got. but I primarily work on larger projects these days that take several months, and I can't stop what I am doing to get a new figure working. it's pointless. I will probably use G3 primarly on my next project as well, with bits of G8 again.
That is one thing that I do love about having years of experience with the tools and content, you can mix and match stuff as needed. If you know what you are going for, no one needs to know it sa G3 figure working with G2 or G8 figure in the same scene. No one cares.
This suit is wicked.
That's not what I meant. :) Of course HD detailing should always be optional to use on a figure, because there are going to be uses for abckground filler and so on, where it just isn't needed (and for those whose systems wouldn't be able to use it). But plenty of PAs manage to sell a single character where the HD morphs are included as part of the product. When it comes to Daz's own characters, however, they separate the HD morphs into a compeltely different product. To me, that feels disingenuous, because we're well beyond the stage where HD is being retrofitted. Victoria/Michael 7, much less 8, should have come with HD morphs included in one product, not forcing us to spend extra money on another product.
Most content creators are doing it. So, the people who own the store should be able to, also.
Yes I will eventually have to start doing my own stuff, those suits look so good!!!
I have to agree, the V4 dominance was unique, it will not happen again very soon. When the next gen is presented G3 andG8 will be a thing of the past, and history repeats itself for ever and ever, amen
Thanks !!
it is inspired by the "Clavious" Suits from the Classic
"2001 a space Oddessy " from 1968.
Thanks
learning to model clothing Literally changed my creative life!!
particularly being a Scfi animator needing specifc looks.
"Feyd Harkonnan" for the G3 male.
and of course Uncle Vladimir
I decided to skip G8 upgrade, and still happily rendering my G3 characters. I already own most I need, and differences between G8 and G3 are so small, that I probably entirely skip this generation, and just wait and see what G9 brings in the table. I still hope G3 gets some support meantime, but I wouldn't hold my breath. Lately I've moved most of my purchases to that other market place, since very little new gets released for G3 here anymore. Fortunately some of my favourite PAs still release G3+G8 items every now and then, so I have something new to buy here too, but mostly I'm looking for new environments here at Daz store. To answer the topic, I don't think G3 has anywhere near the same longevity that V4 had.
Back in the days of V3 transition to V4 I held back for a while with embracing V4 because although it was objectively a much better looking model it was way more chellenging for my little laptop to deal with. I finally did move to V4 full throttle but the pattern had been set: I tend to stay back a full generation for quite a while and then jump in late and pick up stuff cheaper. I skipped Genesis altogether because by the time I was ready, G2F was out so I just went for that. I invested heavily in G3F though probably because Iray made rendering interesting and fun again. With GenX and the wear them all stuff, all the morph packs, etc I spent a good bit on her. And she does everything I need or want now.
G8F is another thing though. I don't really see what the advantage is. Essentially she's G3F with a different default pose and a less appealing (to me) base head morph. How can I justify re-buying all the morphs again, especially now that GenX is off the market for new figures. I would have to spend a lot of money just to get to the same capability I have today on G3F and it still wouldnt quite have all the flexibility I had with her because no GenX. Note to Daz: GenX was a big boost to your sales, you really ought to buy it from his estate and update it or make a G8F version from scratch.
Think I'm going to hang with G3F for a good while to come.
I still use my G3 as well as my G4 they're both pretty close but I use G3 a lot more due to the insane amount of morphs that I have for her, plus considering that v4-gen 2's entire library is fully supported with G3/4 is why none of them are truly obsolete!...Now if only Daz Studio would overhaul it's animation real-time tools to mirror that of iclone that would really shoot Daz into the stratosphere!
...not lookingto go G3 => G8 but the other way.
...that was an issue with Gen 4 and trying to create kids/young teens (before K4 came out). I and others came up with flat chested morphs and/or utilised more petite morphs (such as those from Thorne's fey characters and later, the Steph 4 NPMs ) but any blouse or shirt would distort badly in the breast region. Even using a third party conversion utility to adapt male or Mil Kids clothing didn't work all that well as it would add the standard V4 breast morphs in.
That's not what I meant. :) Of course HD detailing should always be optional to use on a figure, because there are going to be uses for abckground filler and so on, where it just isn't needed (and for those whose systems wouldn't be able to use it). But plenty of PAs manage to sell a single character where the HD morphs are included as part of the product. When it comes to Daz's own characters, however, they separate the HD morphs into a compeltely different product. To me, that feels disingenuous, because we're well beyond the stage where HD is being retrofitted. Victoria/Michael 7, much less 8, should have come with HD morphs included in one product, not forcing us to spend extra money on another product.
There is a difference here; content by Josh Crockett or RawArt isn't the basis for a whole major character release, such as Darius or Monique, so they can afford to take the time to put in the details they want. DAZ has to have the main figure ready for people like Fred Winkler and others that want to create characters using that as a base before they can start, and the details that could be put into the HD aren't really needed for that.
No, I'm fairly sure most PAs don't bother. I'd be surprised if more that maybe 20% of character making PAs actually do make a majority of the characters they do with HD features. YOu also should remember that they can only sell any characters they make with HD here, and if DAZ turns down a submission, those that have stores elsewhere may want to be able to recover the time invested by selling elsewhere.
Edit: Deleted stray period...
That's not what I meant. :) Of course HD detailing should always be optional to use on a figure, because there are going to be uses for abckground filler and so on, where it just isn't needed (and for those whose systems wouldn't be able to use it). But plenty of PAs manage to sell a single character where the HD morphs are included as part of the product. When it comes to Daz's own characters, however, they separate the HD morphs into a compeltely different product. To me, that feels disingenuous, because we're well beyond the stage where HD is being retrofitted. Victoria/Michael 7, much less 8, should have come with HD morphs included in one product, not forcing us to spend extra money on another product.
Most content creators are doing it. So, the people who own the store should be able to, also.
...as long as it remains optional instead of becoming the norm and doesn't effectively increase the base price.
...I actually have the basic G8F head/body morphs along with one character (Xanthe) just for experimentation, but really don't see that much of a difference from G3 save for the base pose. Not about to repurchase all the morph/shape/skin utilities again that I already have for G3 which dumped Tri-Ax and makes use of JCMs just like G8 does. I also have the bend and "squish" utilities that improve posing for G3 as well.
Is the HD sculpt not the sculpt the normals were baked from? I never buy the HD addons so I can't say for sure, but it would be mind-bogglingly weird to create an entirely new HD sculpt just to make details different from the one you did for the normal map (and now the new details presumably don't line up with your skin).
EDIT: Or the normals could just be converted bump maps, I suppose.
If the model is made in zBrush and you polypaint the texture on a high enough subdivision of the mesh, it will usually make pretty detailed normal maps as well as base color maps. After doing that, but before I return the mesh to base resolution and delete the higher subdivision levels (to make sure the mesh is clean so it makes a good morph) I usually make a copy of the subtool at thatsubdivision level so I can keep any details that get lost in future attempts to subdivide my working mesh.