To PNG and build a scene in a 3rd party app or stay in DAZ
TraceSL
Posts: 543
in The Commons
Was just wondering the pros and cons of scene building, normally I just build in DAZ and then I may add some postwork in PS Elements. But have been thinging about just PNG in DAZ and building the scene by layering. What are the pros and cons of doing this?
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You will hear the reasoning it doesn't matter how you make the art, just the finished product and that's true, but there is something to be said for the techniques used also. Many do postwork. If you re good at it, then you can get some great results. really depends on the types of image you do and and your skill level in your image editor IMO.
I try not to to use it if I can help it. I would rather spend my time setting up the surfaces instead and let the renderer do the work. This way there is no second guessing the shadows and such because I know they are correct based on the mathematical algorythms used by the unbiased renderer. If I was better at painting shadows and details in photoshop I would probably do more of it since I have seen some amazing artwork done this way and to me it is a style all it's own, unlike just running a render thru some filters
It does depend a lot on your abilities both in 3D and in an image editor like Photoshop for postwork.
I'm on the other end of the scale--I do renders to work out the angles lights/shadows and how they interact with different materials of construction. So I do spend some time setting up my surfaces as well as I can, but my render is not my final output, it's my reference for the beginning of a painting or illustration. I don't sweat the anatomical inconsistencies of the 3D models or poke through or add every prop in the scene (only the major ones) because I correct all that when I draw/paint the scene in one of the programs I use (Photoshop, Painter or Manga Studio). For me 3D is just a step in the production pipeline.
If you are good with image editors, you can probably get some great outputs using straight renders by adding postwork (just don't rely on filters too much--the effects are often quite cheesy). For example, if you've ever seen filters (or even shaders here) that advertise a comic effect that just toss a half-tone pattern over everything--stuff like that is what you need to avoid. Some folks who consider themselves 3D artists think postwork is cheating, while others who consider themselves traditional artists, think using 3D is cheating.
There is no cheating--only output.
I guess it depends on what your final goal is. I've seen some amazing artwork done where just the character is rendered in DS and all of the background stuff is done in a 2D graphics program. It just depends on your level of expertise with the graphics program. When I first started using DS, I did everything with just the render engine. No postwork. I've been teaching myself more and more postwork skills so a lot of what I do now is postworked. I love that my skills are growing and I don't consider it cheating, just a different skillset. I'm not up to postworking in an entire background, yet, but I want to be able to do that someday.
I don't know that there are really pros and cons other than the skills you have and how you use them. I'm a firm believer that it doesn't matter how you got there, just that you did when it comes to art. Have fun and play.
If your computer is lacking a good GPU with a lot of vram, then post work might be a better option. If your computer is powerful enough to render a whole scene in one go, then you can do it as you wish. Deleting items from a scene and rendering them apart in layers is a common tactic. Even if everything fits in vram, it can still be much faster to delete items and render them as separate image. I do this a lot because vram is a limiting factor for me.
But ultimately, it comes down to you. If you are good at using editors, then you can always use that skill to enhance any render. If you prefer not to, that's your call. There is no right or wrong.
For me personally, while the process may be appreciated, ultimately art is about the aesthetic and emotion it evokes. Again, for me, I strive to only use post in a way that is scriptable/autonomous (nothing manual), which leaves the door open for animation. This is one of the ultimate goals in my NPR work. Hopefully, it doesn't fall into the cheesy category that Fragg is talking about!
- Greg
I don't use postwork unless I absolutly have to, mainly because I'm not much good at it. I started on 3D software because I want to make pictures and I can't draw anything that looks any good.
The main advantage of keeping everything in Studio is you get consistency throughout the image. The lighing matches on all elements, everything that should cast shadows does so in the correct place. If you are using layers then objects in one layer don't cast shadows on things in another layer unless you use shadow catchers, which is something I've never looked into.
The advantage of using layers is that each render puts less load on your computer than one big combined scene and you can built complex images with more figures and props than your computer could handle in one go.
The answer is to use whatever method gives you the image that you want. The best thing is to try both ways and see which is best for you.
Greg--your output is the least cheesy thing I've ever seen (so, NO, not referring to you at all). As I said in your thread before, if you ever manage to market your process for Studio, my credit card is still waiting.
Whew!
- Greg