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...I revised my previous post (apparently after you quoted it) following a bit more research I did.
The GP104 processor for the GTX 1070/1080 will actually have around 8 billion transistors (same as the Titan-X) not 15 like I mentioned, The GP 100 processor for the Tesla unit is the one that will have 15.3 billion transistors. Really tempted to wait for the GTX HMB 2 models even though it may be another year or so as those should be similar in specs and form factor to the Tesla Compute GPU including a 4096 instead of 256 bit memory bus and 720GB/s bandwidth.
Cathy: is there a specific reason why you decided for the evga Titan X?
i plan to buy a titan x later this year and are very unsure about the differences...
what do you use for cpu water cooling?
I want to see to believe first , there are a lot of speculations around , once they say 18 billion transistors then website say 8 billion , then it is 2 times faster than Titan X next saying lower than GTX 980Ti and replacement for 970/980 so a lot of confusion at this moment , gaming and rendering are 2 different types of activity , is even iray ready to render with the new architecture ? it would be all exciting to think about but first seeing is believing , I believe that would kill Nvidia 980Ti and Titan X market what would be not bad so I could grab GTX TITAN Z for less
You have 3 types
Titan X standard the slowest card from this series can get hot
EVGA Titan X SC faster ( super clocked by the manufacturer ) you need very good air flow in your case can get very hot
EVGA Titan X SC Hybrid water cooled little faster ( super clocked by the manufacturer ) stay very cool
One year ago I got 2x EVGA Titan X SC as that all what was left on the market , but 6 months later I got the hybrid water cooling kit for manual install and can get my cards even faster but at 1270 MHz it seems the best for iray as higher does not make much difference in rendering time as I am getting the same results at 1500Mhz or 1270Mhz but once switched to 1000Mhz I see big difference in time
For CPU I choice the CORSAIR Hydro Series H90 High Performance Water/Liquid CPU Cooler. 140mm it provides better cooling with lower noise than other high-end liquid coolers plus I needed the space on top for my 2 GPU water cooling radiators , but by next upgrade I am moving them all outside the case , changing the CPU and Motherboard for 4 way SLI but not early than in the next 2 years as I just did last December .
You choice what is best for your budged and the size of your case , your mother board and CPU , Liquid cooling simply works better than air cooling and the self-contained design is safe , if I could I would make full 1 water cooling set for the full system but I don't trust myself on that yet and open water cooling systems can get wrong even by experienced professionals so it scares me . For that reason using self-contained only that are not so pretty to look at but do the job as well and easy to replace or upgrade .
Here is a little list for best performing cards for use with iray
1. EVGA GeForce Titan X Hybrid , Super Clock , Standard
12 GB of memory
Stream Processors: 3072
Best price for today for SC Hybrid water cooled :$1,061.49 Big Box Live
Best price for today for SC : $993.30·Big Box Live
Best price for today for Standard : $900.00·Bonanza
Free shipping, no tax
__________________________________________________________________
2. Zotac GeForce GTX 980Ti AMP Extreme Edition
6GB of memory
Stream Processors: 2816
Best price for today : $669.88 NextWarehouse.com
Free shipping, no tax
__________________________________________________________________
3. Palit GeForce GTX 980 Super JetStream
4GB of memory
Stream Processors: 2048
Best price for today : $509.99 Play-Asia.com
Free shipping, no tax
__________________________________________________________________
4. MSI GeForce GTX 970 Gaming Edition
4GB of memory
Stream Processors: 1664
Best price for today : $324.99·Newegg.com
Free shipping, no tax
You are wise to be cautious, Cath. But I succeeded with an open loop build, and you are brighter than I am so you should be confident that you can achieve it. It's really no more complicated than planning and assembling your own PC. It's easy to focus on what might go wrong, but that is the same issue a lot of people would have with, say, placing a CPU into a motherboard. You can do that, so a bit of plumbing is within your capability.
I would recommend to start simple, in order to build experience and confidence. There looks to be plenty of room in your big new case to have a CPU loop with a nice thick radiator and low-speed fans on push-pull.
Mine is in a portable midi tower, which was an extra planning challenge. But it keeps a hex-core 3930K running at 4.2GHz nice and cool with just a low hum.
Sound very good. the hydro is available for 1184 euros here in German. including the WC that is a reasonable price. now I have to check if i have place in the housing for the watercooling
Maybe in next 2 years , for now it working just fine on the closed build , my case was made for open loop build actually so plenty of space for that and it is tempting , I would have to change the cards plates to hydro cooper for that so little more investment , I think I wait when my warranties are over in 2 years just in case if I screw something lol I deconstructed my Titan X cards for installing the Hydro hybrids but they still covering the warranties after the installation and the main reason I did this .
The radiators are 120 mm each, I had to add fans on both sides of the radiators to reach the top as my case is huge and the pipes length is made more for mid-tower cases , right now only one set of fans is running very slowly and the GPU on idle temp is 25 C , ambient room temp 20 C , and air only it was never lower than 35C on idle , but now on full load it run between 32-37 C so 50% cooler than air only .The Hydro kit is the same as in the Hydro Titan X , it is just for manual installation and $75 for the liquid cooling kit and $25 for the backplates still in the same range if not cheaper .
I have two of those. They perform very well in Iray. And they're great for gamming too! :D
When I was looking for air cooled cards, this one came out on top. They come overclocked and the GPU core reaches 1400Mhz on mine. While they still have fewer cores then a Titian X, they are a better bang for the buck then a Titian X for gamming and rendering.
For the budged they are great of course and you can render a lot in the scene with 6GB , it is all about your budged and how much you want to spend for your tools and what you really need .
...the Titan-Z is a dual 6 GB card so only 6 GB would be available for rendering.
Yeah, I remember all the talk about a year and a half ago that the "new" Maxwell 980 was supposed have 8 GB of memory. Was somewhat a disappointment when it was released with 6, particularly considering the price, which was only about 350$ less than the 12 GB Titan-X. In comparing the two, the lower chance of a scene exceeding GPU memory and dumping to the CPU with the Titan-X makes it the better deal in the long run.
If indeed, when the Pascal 1080 does come out, it knocks the price of the Titan-X down to say where the 980 TI currently is, that would still be a major bonus, partucularly considering I am still running with an old 1 GB GTX 460.
I would think that Iray shouldn't have issues with the Pascal architecture as people are able to render with older cards that are built on the Fermi and Kepler architectures. They may not be as fast as the current generation Maxwell units but still an improvement over pure CPU rendering.
I know that Titan Z have 2 GPU it is like 2 cards in one but need less space than 2 cards , it was an idea more for the quick bost when needed but I am waiting patiently to see what the new cards are about and see it in action., I remember when Octane ver.1 did not rendered with Kepler architecture then they fixed but not for Maxwell architecture and I wasted money and could not use it anymore after I switched to Titan X and I did not bother to pay for version 2 anymore after we got iray .For that reason I mentioned it , rendering software need to be ready for new architecture or it will not render optional and it is adjusted for older version already since iray engine is for much longer around than one year in DS .
Ah I remember my old GTX 460M 1.5 GB in my old laptop it performed not that bad in Octane ,but had to reduce all textures each time to fit in scene . I eventually killed it with Octane and it melted away ... I was beta tester of the pluging for Octane in DS with my GTX 460M , on this time the best card for GPU rendering was GTX 590 if I remember good , everything change so fast .
...yeah the Mobile series GPUs tended to have a bit more memory for some reason than the standard desktop ones. I have the best of that line which has 1 GB. and 384 CUDA cores. Was a real "powerhouse" back then.
Right now I'm just looking to scrape up the funds for a 4 GB GTX 740 to put in my current system and will use the 460 to run the displays. It would help a bit with Iray view mode and I'd at least be able to render individual character studies in GPU mode (BTW, thanks for the Ambient HDRI, it gets a lot of use when I'm proof rendering character concepts).
Considering Iray belongs to Nvidia, I wouldn't think they would drag their feet updating it for Pascal considering several professional applications also use it. Who knows, they may already be doing so as a parallel development?
I know the feeling of being left behind. It happened with Reality/Lux as I have a first generation i7 that is not able to take advantage of the advertised "x10 speed boost" R 4.2/Lux 1.5 are supposed to offer. Even in CPU mode, rendering the same scene with the same tone mapping in both Iray and Reality/Lux, Iray is much faster (hours instead of days). I ended up ditching Reality due to all the instability I experienced with 4.x and render times that made geologic time look like "fast forward".
BTW did you hear about the news today > https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/05/06/geforce-gtx-1080/#prclt-xa1fuYuF
GTX 1080 8GB GPU delivers 2x the performance and 3x the efficiency of TITAN X. sales start on May.27 , I may consider getting 1 of them and see how it will perform in Iray before getting second one
damn I will have to change my mother board again to 4 way SLI ! to fit all the goodies I just have space for 3 but that after the positive review on GTX 1080 with iray as what good for games via SLI don't mean the render power is there on the same performance level . Seeing is believing
but all sounds too good
When they state 2x performance of a Titan, that will be based on Gaming where that insane clock speed will really shine. For iRay rendering, where most of the speed comes from cuda count, it wouldnt be that much of a jump. They didnt say the cuda core count of the 1080 in the article, but if the 'leaked' specs that were floating around before this reveal were accurate (which they do seem to be, as everything else revealed in the article matches those leaked specs) then the cuda core count of the 1080 is ~500 more than a Titan X. Based on that, you'd be looking at something more like a 25-30% speed increase over a Titan, but with less VRAM.
i was originally waiting for the Pascal release before upgrading my machine - but it became increasingly likely that the Titan equivalent of the first generation pascals wouldnt be around until end of this year at the earliest, more likely mid next year - so i ended up getting a couple of Titan X's.
The Titan equivalent in the pascals is rumored to be capable of 32GB of hbm2, and 6000 cuda cores. That would be amazing for us
...OK a lot of hype about improvments for gaming, but features that support better gaming performance don't always mean much when it comes to 3D scene rendering.
I would like to see reviews evaluate GPU benchmarks for 3D rendering software instead of just games.
The only major advantages I see are 2 extra GB of VRAM, lower power consumption and a slightly lower MSRP compared to the 980 TI.
On the other hand, the uprated Quadro M6000 now has 24 GB of GDDR5 that costs the same as the original 12 GB model. 24 GB of VRAM would easily handle pretty much anything I could thow at it. Yeah five grand is a lot for a single GPU, however the doubled memory makes it a little more woth the price.
Of course in another year or so we could be looking at the first Pascal Quadros with 32 GB of HBM2 mmory.
All true, I have to use it to believe , I know people that have better system than me and render much slower with 2 xTitan X so I need to spin it myself , I don't believe it will have more cudas than my Titan X but the new architecture may be the key , the price is too low for having more cudas , it may happen that Titan X drop heavy with the prices after then I just go for that but right now not feel like pay another 1K as not really needed but wanted lol from a diagram I saw that GTX 1080 was bellow Titan X 1000Mhz with Quadro M6000 on top , well 20 more days and I will know exactly what it is about I will love to haven extra power for quick testing of materials and stuff
...according to the expanded specs on the Nvidia site, the 1080 has 2560 CUDA Cores. So yes, less than the Totan-X or Quadro M6000.
The First HBM Pascal GPU is to be a Tesla compute unit with 16 GB.Which should be out later this year. According to the scuttlebutt I read from Nvidia, the 32 GB units will most likely be reserved the next generation professional (Quadro?) GPUs. Would make sense considering they doubled the memory of the Maxwell Quadro 6000.
Oh c'mon Megabucks Lotto, The Kid needs a herkin' GPU.
So it may even be slower than a Titan X for us then. Will have to wait and see i guess. but for me, so far i do not regret getting impatient for Pascal and buying my Titan X's
Then again, the 1080Ti will obviously be improvements over that as well.
From what I saw it was better than GTX 980Ti but less than Titan X , if that was really better GPU nobody will ever buyTitanX again and they will damage the market for it so not so sure, on the other hand just because it has less cudas not mean it will be slower , don''t forget they compare it to standard Titan X 1024 Mhz and not Super Clocked that run at 1270 Mhz on manufacturer boost what is big difference in speed
not to mention that standard Titan X run very hot on air only slowing down the GPU power and that is also big factor here, as the power needed for the GPU goes to the fans instead
I am very curious about but also optimistic , we have to wait to see as all we have mostly are speculations regarding to rendering speed in iray
"NVIDIA GTX 1070 as well, with the “Founders Edition,” available June 10 for $449, and custom boards from partners expected to start at $379."...
Based on 1700Mhz and running demonstration with > 2000 MHz for the 1080... we can expect that the 1070 will be the real king for 2 - 4 sli setups on a budget... if this card is also able to OC to 2000MHz then it should be easy somehwere between a 980 and a 980ti... (assuming 1792 cudas, with 2048 cudas this card would be in the titan x league)... Hopefully they will do also 8GB versions.
Nvidia are clearly marketing the GTX1080 as better than the TitanX for both cards' primary user base: gamers. Unless Nvidia artificially keep the price of the TitanX high (essentially by not supplying any), then market forces will cause the price of the TitanX to fall.
Currently £899 for the standard part. Let's see...
They may not need to choke supply - it may be that the extra RAM in the TitanX, an perhaps extra cooling needs, will keep its price high, and the fact that it's thus a niche product will push it higher. Not trying to be a pessimist (it just comes naturally).
Only the 4GB extra VRAM is a positive there (extra cooling requirement is a reason to not buy). For gamers, and probably most Iray users, that's not essential. If I was looking to buy new now, for gaming or rendering, there's no way I'd buy a TitanX. They can sell some to those not following the news, but otherwise they've just undercut their highest price consumer card. They won't like heavy discounting being seen, so I expect to see the supply mysteriously dry up. They can't control the second hand market, though, so folks should keep their eyes peeled for bargains. This also applies to many of the 9 series cards.
Just to note....
The 1080 and 1070 are specced to run STOCK at 1600MHz core clock. That's 1.6 TIMES the core clock of a Titan-X (1000MHz). So, at stock speeds, the 1080 (with 2560 cores) will actually out-perform the Titan-X (with 3072 cores) by roughly 25%. (4096 GClocks/core for the 1080 vs 3072 GClocks/core for the Titan-X)
Now, consider that the 1080 can overclock by 30% (demonstrated) on stock cooling stably. So at 2100MHz core clock on the 1080, you get 5376 GCores/clock......that's about 1.75 TIMES the performance of a stock Titan-X. Not quite DOUBLE.
The 1070, if it runs the same stock speed, with 2048 cores (this is what it is supposed to have), will run about 8% faster than a Titan-X. (3277 GCores/clock) With OCing, this could easily jump to 125%.
And all while consuming LESS power. Stock 1080 is rated at a TDP of 180W. Stock 1070 is rated at TDP of 150W. OCing will jump those up a bit though....
The performance boosts are pretty straightforward. The OCing potential of the 10x0 line is nothing short of astounding at the moment, though. 30% OC on stock cooling stable at 65C? That's just crazy......
And all for roughly the same price as a 980Ti or 970?
I'm sold. May 27th can get here fast enough.
As for whether to go with multiple 1070s for SLI.....tricky. Depends on the full specs and OCing ability. The memory bandwidth difference for GDDR5X (the 1080) and GDDR5 (the 1070) is pretty significant. The 25% boost in cores is less so, given the cost difference. Two 1070s will run MSRP of about $760 USD, versus the $600 of a single 1080. But it would be a LOT more cores (4096 against 2560.)
The real benefit though, is the power efficiency boost pascal brings. 1080 and 1070 running TDPs of 180W and 150W.....that's almost HALF of the 980Ti/970. The power curves are tighter, and the ripple is lower. That means a lot more stable, cleaner power. Which means spiking during heavy usage is reduced. So your Power Supply can be a LOT lower and still get all that performance. You could run a triple 1070 rig and only have to have around a 1000W supply (assuming you aren't OCing them.)
Just for a point of reference on clock speed and power - I'm running an MSI GTX 980 TI, factory tweaked; core clock runs at 1227.7 MHz and memory clock is at 3304.8 Mhz. I have yet to exceed 71% power consumption despite running at 95% GPU load for over an hour at a time. I've diddled the fan speed to keep the temperature under 65 C, and it hasn't hit more than 68%. So I'm running about 180 W currently on the existing card. I'm looking forward to trying a 1080 in the same system :-) I'm apparently not getting that last little bit of performance because I haven't played with the voltage setting and I'm voltage-limited per GPU-Z.
(All values as reported by GPU-Z after matching it to the MSI afterburner measurements)
Remember that with iray rendering you don't get twice the performance with two cards compared to just one card and only +/- 45% more performance than just one card , if I add one more Titan X SC for total 3 I will get 20% extra speed only , so the best performance for the money is to have 2 x Titan X ( or any other card ) as any additional card will increase the speed just by 20% so 4 x Titan X will increase the speed by 85% more than only 1 card on 4 cores CPU , as more CPU cores will not make big difference when rendering with iray and multiple cards, faster CPU can help with things like scene load times to your card but not in GPU rendering, the more GPU power you have the smaller the impact the number of CPU cores has, so having 4 cores CPU or 10 cores CPU make no difference in GPU rendering with iray and if you select CPU + GPU for rendering it will only slow down everything .
More cuda cores don''t mean double faster rendering with iray when rendering with multiple GPU cards ( not talking about real time movements in iray viewport but actually rendering ) so I guess having 2 x GTX 1080 will be slower in the viewport but render slightly faster than 2 x stockTitan X but not 2 times faster maybe 2 % faster as games and iray rendering are 2 different scenarios it is the iray software and how it utilizes the CPU and GPU , another factor here is the temperatures of your GPU and the fan speed , how hotter it get how slower the performance , the water cooling on my Titan X improved total performance plus second fans that cool the radiators use external power and not from the card connector so more power for the GPU and faster performance .
When I run my cards before just on air cooling with new case the temperature was not higher than 67 C on full load at 1277Mhz , water cooling and additional radiator fans cooled it down to 35C-37C on full load no matter 1 or 2 hours of constant rendering time and right now on idle it is at 22C , overclocking to 1400Mhz or max 1500Mhz will set the temperatures to around 60C-70C + , depends of the ambient temperatures what was not possible on air cooling only but it does not improved speed in iray rendering at all when running at more than 1277Mhz in my case
The best speed for the money with multiple cards and GPU unbiased rendering software you get when using
So until someone test the new upcoming cards with iray , all we have is guessing as all the info and data we got so far regarding the new cards has nothing to do with rendering with iray unless you are a gamer
especially if you are going to use it with multiple cards in your system and not just replacement for your old card
I know that I am not going to bother with Quadro cards as they perform the slowest with iray rendering compared to Geforce according to iray rendering benchmarks
I am going to test the gtx 1080 from pure curiosity hoping for EVGA SC version
Now at £869 - a smallish drop and not yet a trend. But no surprise.
There will be liquid cooled GTX 1080s from EVGA that should be able to reach the 2.5 Ghz mark what is insane ! of course the power usage will reach at 250W
Also the last benchmarks with OpenCL at 1750Mhz boost speed indicated that GTX 1080 was only max 10% faster than GTX 980Ti and fall much below Titan X in OpenCL performance
I may waiting for the water cooled version as well
@Peter I don't think Titan X is going to drop in the prices , Nvidia see it more like in line of workstation card than gaming , but after release of the GTX 1080 who knows what is going to happen
But right now I would prefer to get additional 2 x GTX1080 than 1 x Titan X SC for the budget it will give me 40% more rendering power in combination with my 2x Titan X SC