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Which reminds me, what's the cheapest/easiest package to do decent 'anime eyes' morph/style for Genesis or Genesis 2?
Anime itself is trending more and more towards 3D production these days; though a lot of it has been clumsy and has been for a long time when used, they're slowly getting better at it.
Here are two show previews from this year that I've been told are made in full 3D:
With studios moving in this direction (because it's faster and cheaper than drawing it all by hand) I don't really see why this sort of thing can't eventually trickle down to us if people are clever enough to copy it (I'm not.)
RWBY was all 3D. The couple of episodes I watched (too many Anime Cliches in too quick a succession for me), I even recognized a few DAZ assets that were used as background. Admittedly, RWBY was a web show, rather than television.
I remember reading somewhere that RWBY was created entirely in Poser (and for the first season at least, all by one guy.)
I think you can get pretty close to those looks by using PWToon (and possibly ToonyCam, though I haven't played with it).
Just a matter of getting the actual figure right.
My own Animeyes set in the store here is probably the cheapest when it's on sale. It was made for Aiko and Hiro 4, but most of the textures should still work on the Genesis 1 and 2 series.
That...is actually hard to believe. The only 3D anime thing I've seen come close to looking like 2D are the recent Guilty Gear video games, and even they still have pokethough and such.
There's actually a lot of difficulties in making 2D-looking renders that don't come to mind at first. I spent years attempting to find a solution, but the only real way is to do hand-drawn postwork over a render. Shading is probably the biggest hurdle because rendering engines will not create cel-shaded shadows like a human would. A renderer's is based entirely on physical accuracy, and will have rough edges and shade where a human would not for aethestic reasons. Other things like the mouth and teeth, hair, and expression range just make it so difficult with a figure that was originally designed to be realistic. I think we would need a custom figure, specifically designed to be one character and one character only in order to get anything close to the results in those screenshots.
Still very fond of Hiro 4. I've never seriously tried to recreate an anime style, but I have played around with the various morphs and created a few characters I liked.The last one was a mix of M4 and H4.
Also, I love Hiro 5 and Hitomi. I refer to them as my OTP of toons.
So probably the legacy shapes thing?
(And yeah, added animeyes to my wishlist, because getting eyes just right is... finicky)
Was that question directed at me?
SnowSultan's anime eye set for H4/A4 is excellent. I use it all the time for toonish projects, along with Hiro 4 Toon's toon teeth.
"Freedom Project" (OVA only but highly recommended) was one of the first anime to use cell-shaded CG throughout and that was 10 years ago. It's interesting that it has taken so long for the use of these techniques to "come out" again with anime like Ajin—the second clip you linked (I mean that these techniques are being used but heavily disguised, whereas in Ajin it's much more obvious). Even then, it seems clear that the producers do not want to stray to far from the traditional look. One of the directors of Sunrise Inc. who produced Freedom stated that "our challenge was to present things that do not appear 3D", In anime 3D is a means to an end rather than a desired look.
By the way, you mentioned violence in Ajin as being nothing too extreme, but in fact there is some very disturbing violence and torture in that anime, so I would avoid it if that sort of thing disturbs you.
Getting the linework to actually look drawn is probably the hardest thing - that's what makes most 3D anime look wrong to me at least. Two other examples that come to mind that I found were Street Fighter 5 and Naruto whatever it's called 4 as recent "want to look cel shaded" games. But yes, there's also the problem that even if you get the colour depth right, the shaders (at least the toon ones I have) still tend to do the shadows differently to the way a human would.
Is there much difference between PWToon from the DS toon shaders? Or does it just use the same shaders with its own settings?
p.s. For Ajin, I meant the violence wasn't too extreme in the trailer; watch the actual show at own descretion.
There are dozens and dozens of different styles of anime, and some of those styles are specific to a specific story genre, but it's not their 'everyday' toon look. It's more what people over HERE prefer - and on an off note I find your "needs Japanese to make them" statement ironic considering Betty Boop is at the base of the whole movement.
As for what people consider "authenetic" - being as I use these styles every day sometimes for commercial purposes, I find it's not where the model comes from so much as if the user can do what they're aiming for convincingly. The feedback I've heard has nothing to do with the model's origin but more on how people perceive them as "real art". People have this idea that anime is 100% all hand-drawn, which is hasn't been since the 90's. Throw in a 3D model and peopel don't respect the image.
There are a *lot* of animes that have more realistic styles, styles that happen to match the look of the original Aiko and Hiro models. And going beyond that, speaking of styles, we can't forget to mention the models Deco, Decoco and Maybe. BelBel is modelled in the style normally associated with some magical girl stories (Sailor Moon is but ONE style). NearMe, considering Futepen's style is like that, has yet another distinct style. Etc.
We don't need more "Japanese" creating the models. We just need modellers whose style is of those genres. Go to Hive3D and other places and you'll see some fantastic modelling in the anime styles. Some are from France, Germany, here, etc. My own style is a blend so don't look at me.... and the truth is it depends on the story. I have a webcomic that started out very bishie but has become a more realistic style like what you find in Tokyo Godfathers over the years. But I'm planning this OTHER project in which I want the look to be more Americana.
Also I remember once, when I was looking into things at the start of getting my large anime model collection, finding a discussion on modeling the eyes. Genesis et al apparently have this thing with modeling their eyes, it's difficult for some reason to imitate some of the round styles. (I find that hard to believe because I've modelled some round eyes on Genesis even recently.) Which would probably be why Kururu, Himeko, et al have eye material zones instead of actual eyes, as does AnimeDoll.
Off the top of my head I can think of the following toon models (not all a specific anime style and leaving out Genesis):
The development of Japanese-styled CG animation is actually not too slow. Here are a few extra things to watch besides the aforementioned ones if you are interested:
楽園追放 -Expelled from Paradise-
蒼き鋼のアルペジオ/ARPEGGIO OF BLUE STEEL （the TV versio and Movie version).
Dragon Age: Dawn of the Seeker
Appleseed Series (I think the latest one is Alpha? Although this one is a bit more leaning toward Hollywood style)
Aside from these animation versions, there are also things like Mikumiku Dance (MMD) and Live2D (which is not really 3D but more of a hybrid). Given the fact that there's a HUGE pool of resouces for MMD I find it interesting that the support for 3D toon/anime/manga characters is so limited/underdeveloped in the West for Daz (or to some extent, even Poser). Seriously, do a google (image) search of MMD and you will know what I mean.
Here are three Anime movies done completely in 3D
Appleseed Ex Machina
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=appleseed+ex+machina&qpvt=appleseed+ex+machina&view=detail&mid=207AC094FC038116F44E207AC094FC038116F44E&FORM=VRDGAR
Appleseed Alpha
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=appleseed+alpha&view=detail&mid=2EC070C6FA1EBCD9E6942EC070C6FA1EBCD9E694&FORM=VIRE0&mmscn=tpvh&ru=%2fsearch%3fq%3dappleseed%2balpha%26qs%3dn%26form%3dQBRE%26pq%3dappleseed%2balpha%26sc%3d9-15%26sp%3d-1%26sk%3d%26ghc%3d1%26cvid%3d825EFBB5B5C648EDAF0E12B3F496F3F5
Heavenly Sword
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=appleseed+alpha&ru=%2fsearch%3fq%3dappleseed%2balpha%26qs%3dn%26form%3dQBRE%26pq%3dappleseed%2balpha%26sc%3d9-15%26sp%3d-1%26sk%3d%26ghc%3d1%26cvid%3d825EFBB5B5C648EDAF0E12B3F496F3F5&view=detail&mmscn=tpvh&mid=D8A56657800B55389E5CD8A56657800B55389E5C&rvsmid=2EC070C6FA1EBCD9E6942EC070C6FA1EBCD9E694&fsscr=0&FORM=VDQVAP
the MMD thing reminded me: while I know nothing about using it, I know that there's quite a bit of hobbyist anime stuff being made using the Source engine too:
http://orig05.deviantart.net/23f3/f/2012/195/c/2/miku_in_source_engine_by_stblackst-d576ssx.png
I don't know any of those figures spearcarrier mentioned, but I do really like Star's face and expressions. Oh, and technically there's also Nana, available here, if you want to do chibi figures.
What I really want is a modern (I guess you could call it KyoAni style) figure for male and females.
No, there is no 'one' style of anime, but the general look of anime - it being different from the Western "toony" or comic style - IS their 'normal' and it is a style that we (the non-Japanese artists) have not been very successful at reproducing in 3D thus far. As I said, my intention isn't to put down anyone's work, but I stand by what I said about needing a Japanese artist to really get the job done right. Now maybe that will motivate others to try hard to prove that untrue, and that's a good thing too. :)
I had a friend who worked on the 3D Appleseed movie as a background artist and she told me she hated how it looked. She described that same 'uncanny valley' and how it didn't feel like the characters could express the same emotions as drawn ones. Those are problems we may face even if we get a good figure.
Sigh.
I Love MallenLanes Hiro 3, he's awesome. Still my favourite figure despite being ancient. I haven't found a figure to replace him yet, be nice to have a new figure to love, although I don't get much time for 3D anymore.
i liked and bought Animated for Genesis 2 Male - http://www.daz3d.com/animated-for-genesis-2-male-s-bundle and the expansion - http://www.daz3d.com/animated-expansion-01 .
sadly I didn't like the way Genesis 2 Male or it's many male ad on characters looked so didn't really get into him.
I prefer the aesthetics of Genesis 3 Male but I'm more comfortable using Poser so again haven't bought a huge amount for him.
Would I buy a Genesis 3 Hiro, not sure, he'd have to outshine Hiro 3 and have more than one style of head
I got curious and did a quick search for 3D anime movies. Seems like someone is maintaining a wiki page on it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Japanese_3D_films
And it's interesting to learn that Princess Mononoke uses 3D
I also found an anime that comes out of the Middle East. Looks pretty cool. LOL
That is interesting, considering Miyazaki's vocal stance on hand drawing everything (then again Anno was with him saying that and look at the Evangelion Rebuilds.)
I had an idea based on the talk of uncanny valley and realistic shaders etc and thought "what if you used realistic shaders but to make the anime figure look like a physical figurine rather than alive, kinda like Toy Story did rather than starring humans" and I thought I was being clever until I looked at spearcarrier's avatar ._.
Links to the figures Spearcarrier listed:
Free:
Nyacky: http://nucky.eek.jp/Nyacky.html
Kururu: http://render360.seesaa.net/ https://poserdazfreebies.miraheze.org/wiki/Kururu
Sera https://onedrive.live.com/?cid=E8E10A699F938C66&id=E8E10A699F938C66!105 https://poserdazfreebies.miraheze.org/wiki/Sera
Deco, Maybe, Decoco http://members3.jcom.home.ne.jp/mowais/freestuff/freestuff.html https://poserdazfreebies.miraheze.org/wiki/Deco,_Decoco,_and_Maybe
Not free:
Aiko and Hiro, Star - here at Daz3d
NearMe at Contentparadise
Anime Doll at studiomaya3d
In blender at least I can do good toon outlines when I feel the need, I've still yet to beable to do good looking cell shading though, in any program. In paritcular the lines of the shadows always seem to end up on the jagged side
Thank you for these!
Also worth noting: Kururu comes in a Triax mapped version:
http://amyaimei.deviantart.com/art/mato-s-Kururu-for-DAZ-Studio-4-6-487268753
And also for Genesis 2 Female (although she does have her own head so I assume mixing heads won't work.)
http://amyaimei.deviantart.com/art/Kururu-for-Genesis-2-Female-DAZ-Studio-4-6-488369507
Also:
http://amyaimei.deviantart.com/art/Deco-for-Genesis-2-Female-575104328
http://amyaimei.deviantart.com/art/Kururu-for-Genesis-3-Female-DAZ-Studio-4-8-568754728
Even the Hiro thread turned into a thread about anime girls because there are so few males ._.
Well the what's missing for G3F thread turned into a what's missing for G3M thead, so I guess it works both ways
Back to males ... https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/olly-base-for-genesis-2-male-s-/109682
In both cases what we really lack are companion males ... there's only so much you can do when there's only really content around designed for one gender in a specified area.
Olly and Dolly confuse me. Sometimes I look at the promos and think they look ideal for anime use, and then others they look more like their faces are oddly proportioned dolls. I really like the characters and hair oot makes (and the dolly dress) but it's clear from the rosity top sellers page what people are actually buying from the store.
If you looked at their top page (ie What's Hot) now, you would think people only buy V4 characters from one vendor, but then that vendor did just have a 70% off sale, and does have some very high quality skins, so a lot of people jumped on those offers (including me). Normally the top selling items are G3F characters and clothing, but a few items have surprised me how well they sell, like character presets, and also the DS Dynamic script (I thought only a minority of users did dynamics).
Well oot's page right now (on the other site) is showing mostly skimpy outfits, with the iray hair shaders clinging on in there amongst them (an insanely useful product, that one.) Obviously it's speculation but that's a common enough pattern seen that you could expect that's the normal area sales lie (though who is buying millions of skimpy outfits I have no idea.)
silly forum don't doublepost