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Iray Environment Settings - What does "only" mean?

GranvilleGranville Posts: 697
in The Commons

I'm not sure what this documentation means.

It says that Sun-Sky Only does not render any 'lights that exist as nodes'. But my experience is that emmissive shaders render. Also photometric spots. What am I mssing?

Comments

  • deleted userdeleted user Posts: 1,204
    edited February 2016

    Basicly It Sun only, it's mainly for outdoor scenes. If you put it on that setting I believe all the emmision settings on things like lamps will not work, Only the Sun will work. At least, that's my understanding of it.

    Post edited by deleted user on
  • RuphussRuphuss Posts: 2,631

    no hdri option

  • RafmerRafmer Posts: 564
    Emissives surfaces will work, but spot, point or distant lights won't.
  • ToborTobor Posts: 2,300
    Granville said:

    It says that Sun-Sky Only does not render any 'lights that exist as nodes'. But my experience is that emmissive shaders render. Also photometric spots. What am I mssing?

    The documentation isn't clear in discussing what a "light" is. They are referring to the primitive light types: distant, spot, and point, along with the light produced by an HDRi.

    But it's also misleading in that other light sources, including emitting ojects, can take the place of the sun node. This is a feature that shows when you have S/S selected. Selecting another object for the sun replaces the virtual sun that Iray provides, and puts the light object in its place.

    If you're seeing the light from a photometric spot that is not selected as the sun node, that's not the way it should work. You can test this theory by adding a spot, making sure it's not selected as the sun node, and positioning it so its shadow falls on the opposite side of a figure in your scene. Dial up the light output to maybe 50,000 or so, and make sure ground shadowing is turned on. You should still see only the light and shadow from the sun.

  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 5,249
    edited February 2016

    First of all the Sun-Sky Only means build in outdoor enviorment no other light source in the scene will be used excluding emittive shader that have more of a glow funtion the same as ambient light in 3Delight, also HDRI light maps can't be used with this selection . 

    This mean Direct Light that represent the Sun light in 3Delight can't be used at  the same time with the Iray Sun , there can be just one sun at the time :)

    Tobor said:
    Granville said:

    It says that Sun-Sky Only does not render any 'lights that exist as nodes'. But my experience is that emmissive shaders render. Also photometric spots. What am I mssing?​

    Post edited by MEC4D on
  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 5,249

     It does not replaces the SUN, it allow you to control the SUN with the sun  node so you can easy pose it for your needs and it become also animated  , the "replaced" light will not produce any light  other than the Iray Virtual Sun in Sun-Sky-Enviorment  other way it would be phisically not accurate , in other words you just conforming the Iray sun  to the light node 

    Tobor said:

    It says that Sun-Sky Only does not render any 'lights that exist as nodes'. But my experience is that emmissive shaders render. Also photometric spots. What am I mssing?

    The documentation isn't clear in discussing what a "light" is. They are referring to the primitive light types: distant, spot, and point, along with the light produced by an HDRi.

    But it's also misleading in that other light sources, including emitting ojects, can take the place of the sun node. This is a feature that shows when you have S/S selected. Selecting another object for the sun replaces the virtual sun that Iray provides, and puts the light object in its place.

    If you're seeing the light from a photometric spot that is not selected as the sun node, that's not the way it should work. You can test this theory by adding a spot, making sure it's not selected as the sun node, and positioning it so its shadow falls on the opposite side of a figure in your scene. Dial up the light output to maybe 50,000 or so, and make sure ground shadowing is turned on. You should still see only the light and shadow from the sun.

  • ToborTobor Posts: 2,300
    edited February 2016
    MEC4D said:

     It does not replaces the SUN, it allow you to control the SUN with the sun  node so you can easy pose it for your needs and it become also animated  , the "replaced" light will not produce any light  other than the Iray Virtual Sun in Sun-Sky-Enviorment  other way it would be phisically not accurate , in other words you just conforming the Iray sun  to the light node 

    This is true, but I think you misunderstood my point, but I also see I might not have explained it fully. The object (a scene node) becomes the sun (a virtual node), for positioning. Correct that the produced light is still that generated by Iray's "sun." In any case, I suspect this might be what's happening in the OPs case. He's added a spotlight, made it the sun node during some experimentation, and because positioning this light fixture changes the direction of the sun, it looks like the spotlight is actually working in the scene. 

    Post edited by Tobor on
  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 5,249
    edited February 2016

    I did not Tobor, just the way you saying it before give the wrong idea , your point was correct as I know what you mean but new user will get the wrong idea , and just because it looks like don''t mean it is , we don't want later question like [ why I can't put the sun inside a room after creating sun node using spot light .. ]  you know what I mean .. the sun stays in the sky where it belong no matter what sun node we use with as the name of the sun node does not matter if it is direct light or spot light anymore as it lose own original function as original light source  the moment it is used as sun node . 

    so let it say the object or spot light used as sun node become the controller of the sun (as you said in your last post bellow ).. and not vice verse and that is a big difference . it may not matter for some but there is a big differences between Direct light, spot light and the sun light especially  in physically based rendering , it would be much easy for them to learn and progress when they know the basic functions , not for nothing it is called Sun-Sky Only but then you get another person idea saying Direct sun  light is working when used as sun node ..  no...it is not that way around even if it looks like :)

    Tobor said:
    MEC4D said:

     It does not replaces the SUN, it allow you to control the SUN with the sun  node so you can easy pose it for your needs and it become also animated  , the "replaced" light will not produce any light  other than the Iray Virtual Sun in Sun-Sky-Enviorment  other way it would be phisically not accurate , in other words you just conforming the Iray sun  to the light node 

    This is true, but I think you misunderstood my point, but I also see I might not have explained it fully. The object (a scene node) becomes the sun (a virtual node), for positioning. Correct that the produced light is still that generated by Iray's "sun." In any case, I suspect this might be what's happening in the OPs case. He's added a spotlight, made it the sun node during some experimentation, and because positioning this light fixture changes the direction of the sun, it looks like the spotlight is actually working in the scene. 

     

    Post edited by MEC4D on
  • GranvilleGranville Posts: 697

    Thanks for the clarification. I helped me when I could understand how the lights were not working. To check my understanding:

    • There is no way to render sun and sky with scene lights - just mesh emmitters
  • ToborTobor Posts: 2,300

    You should get both if you choose Dome and Scene, and remove any Environment Map (click on the Map icon, and choose None). When you do that, the sun controls become visible, like they are in Sun/Sky Only.

  • RafmerRafmer Posts: 564
    Tobor said:

    You should get both if you choose Dome and Scene, and remove any Environment Map (click on the Map icon, and choose None). When you do that, the sun controls become visible, like they are in Sun/Sky Only.

    Wow! I didn't know that. So... strange... that it could be possible. Why not putting the option in the first place?

  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 5,249

    Yeah that make no sense  , when you want to use Sun-Sky with light for the street lamps like for evening you need use Dome-Scene without the HDR map for the outdoor effect and there is not difference Sun-Sky only or Dome-Scene without HDR map  the only difference is that you can use spotlights together with the Iray environment 

    originally in Iray there was only emissive shaders and photometric light so DAZ need to do something  to allow people use DS spot light etc.. so I guess that what they did 

    the function would make it not less good 

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