Out of the two toon rendering options people leaving 3DL behind are going to find themselves choosing between, I heartily recommend Filatoon for Filament over Sketchytoon for Iray. It's free, a lot more user friendly and it's not a resource hog. You can do populated scenes with it, without your computer sounding like it's about to self-destruct. This is coming from some who has used them both extensively.

I'm using Cecelia Updo for Genesis 9 and trying to preview the hairs in a Filament viewport. However, unlike every other strand-based hair product that I own, there are no parameters for Viewport Line Tessellation Sides or Render Line Tessellation Sides, nor are there parameters for Generate PS Hairs, Generate PR Hairs, or Preview PR Hairs.

The product is advertised as a strand-based product and uses the Omni Hair Shader but the expected properties are completely missing from the Parameters tab.

Anyone have any ideas on how to fix this, or do I just need to delete the product from my library and move on?

hjake said:

Now would be an excellent opportunity for DAZ to offer an awesome promotion of conversion tools for example:

RSSY 3Delight and Iray to Filament ( https://www.daz3d.com/rssy-3delight-and-iray-to-filament )

RSSY 3Delight to Iray Converter ( https://www.daz3d.com/rssy-3delight-to-iray-converter )

OR maybe DAZ could purchase them from RSSY and offer them as a freebie and give a nice coupon to previous buyers (like me).

...for those who prefer to stay or work with 3DL, I'd also add:

RSSY Iray to 3Delight Converter And Merchant Resource [https://www.daz3d.com/rssy-iray-to-3delight-converter-and-merchant-resource]

Advanced DAZ Studio Light Bundle [https://www.daz3d.com/advanced-daz-studio-light-bundle]

IBL Master for Daz Studio [https://www.daz3d.com/ibl-master-for-daz-studio]

Reflective Radiance for 3Delight [https://www.daz3d.com/reflective-radiance-for-3delight]

I also will mention Wowie's Awe Shading Kit which brings Physically plausible shading to 3delight (It used to be sold here and is now available at the "other store").  To see how far it takes Daz 3DL check out the works of Sven Dullah In this thread:

https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/130611/show-us-your-3delight-renders/

...and the follow up

https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/514336/show-us-more-of-your-3delight-renders

 

 

 

Now would be an excellent opportunity for DAZ to offer an awesome promotion of conversion tools for example:

RSSY 3Delight and Iray to Filament ( https://www.daz3d.com/rssy-3delight-and-iray-to-filament )

RSSY 3Delight to Iray Converter ( https://www.daz3d.com/rssy-3delight-to-iray-converter )

OR maybe DAZ could purchase them from RSSY and offer them as a freebie and give a nice coupon to previous buyers (like me).

jeronimocollares said:

Use Filament, its better if you need fast renders. Adobe Lirghtroom Classic to 'fake things'...and... it works, belive me. And have some IAs now to help you to improve renders.

Filament isn't ready for production use. It still crashes on a routine basis with many scenes. And even if it were ready for production use, it can't provide the lighting effects that 3Delight can.

I'm hoping this incentivises Daz3D to fine tune Iray, as it's the only actual render engine left(Filament is technically just a draw style preview).

Daz3D needs to step up and do what they can to make Iray a better experience for the people who suddenly find themselves relying on it.

jeronimocollares said:

Masterstroke said:

Filament is great for previews, for final renders, no thanks.€

That will depend on what you want – the purpose. I can help you organize that. ...

Thanks for posting this information - it is helpful. Your workflow would be a great thread or tutorial (free or commercial), as it seems you've figured out how the puzzle pieces go together in an effective way.

This edge of the industry is moving so fast, I've already got a couple of obsolete pipelines that I set up and never got to using before something better came along.

Back On Topic - If any of our 3DL are/were using it to its full capacity - from toon to photo-real, filament probably isn't going to suffice, but if basic renders were being generated for story-boarding and/or AI reference sorts of uses, then filament is a pretty decent tool to fill that new void.

2c and cheers,

--ms

Masterstroke said:

Filament is great for previews, for final renders, no thanks.€

That will depend on what you want – the purpose. I can help you organize that. If the idea is character consistency, not even AI surpasses photorealism (I mentioned photorealism, and that's limited by current technology – but the trend is for that to change in the coming years). This is different when it comes to 'less realistic' styles, such as 'concept art/digital art' (which is my specialty). In other words, you'll be able to maintain the consistency of your character using some specific techniques with AI and digital painting (use Krita – it's absolutely free, and you won't have licensing problems because you're probably using a product legally acquired from the DAZ Store for a specific purpose – renders). But as I said, if the idea is 'approximation' and not rigid photorealism, there's a way to use 'filamenting', working, of course, within parameters in DAZ and post-production in Lightroom (or something similar). I think that even for photorealism, perhaps image manipulation specialists can produce things that are surprising, but since I'm not one of those in Photoshop, etc... I can't say anything for sure. Krita's AI is very helpful, there's the 'flux kontext' (exclusive for image editing), lighter models like NOOB-IA-XL for 'concept art', various Loras in different styles, etc. Nothing compares to Iray - I use it a lot precisely for that reason, including when talking about external renderers, because the work you'll have to do to assemble something outside of DAZ is equivalent to several renders in DAZ.

I really hope for more advancements in 'filament' and things involving textures/shaders (like hair), global illumination or something similar without depending on lights (and their limitations, 8 spotlights in a scene with shadows), etc.

NB: This is a happy thread, not an argument between boffins thread.

Anyway, as I was saying, this new mini-computer is rendering everything much much faster than ever before and is able to do filament and filatoon and also fast renders of iray and animation frames. My previous machine had an integrated graphics card and I was told by somebody at Daz that there had been issues with integrated cards. Anyway, the new machine is brilliant.

I'm certainly not "stuck" with cpu or "stuck" with gpu or "stuck" in any way at all. There is no sense of being "stuck" or "dead" as you put it. I'm overjoyed that I can now use the filament renderer instead of Iray! Although, as I said before, Iray is now speeded up as well. Happy happy joy joy!!

It doesn't matter how it's processing the data as long as it is processing that data faster than ever before I'm happy and certainly not "stuck".

The new machine is far superior to the old one. It doesn't matter how it achieves the result, the important thing is that it does so. From an end user perspective it could be doing it by magic. The "radeon" or "nvidia" thing is only a label attached to the outer casing of the computer but what goes on "under the hood" is, as always, an infinite universe of deep dark mysterious gubbins beyond all comprehension.

At the end of the day it does what it does no matter how it manages to do it. I'm happy with that. 

The joyous wonderment of the thing is being, at last, able to use the filament renderer in Daz Studio. The improvement in Iray renders is very probably an example of the shortcomings of my previous machine. 

Also Bryce is now able to handle bigger animation files from the Daz-Bryce bridge which previously would've crashed it. 

 

Filament is great for previews, for final renders, no thanks.€

I know I'm slightly off topic talking about hardware but I just wanted to say that I've been worrying for the last few years about being left behind in a digital underclass because Daz was zooming ahead into new tech which my old computer couldn't handle and then, at last, I was able to afford a new mini-computer in a black Friday sale and it is superb! It's a Ryzen AMD 7 .

I was astonished at the little box which is so much more powerful than my old PC. The new one has Windows 11 and Radeon graphics and is able to do Filament and Filatoon renderings without crashing and Iray renderings very much faster than the old one could. Well worth looking at if you're looking for lower price with faster renders. 

I used to have to go to Superfly and Firefly and other, older renderers to get any results done quickly, especially when I was trying to do animations. I had to use lower resolution figures and props and different software choices. Now everything is faster. Even Bryce and Carrara now run better and with less crashes. 

Also the mini-computer takes up less space, is almost silent running and is using less electricity. Cheaper and better for the environment. 

I'll say this: Getting good lighting and render quality in a 3DL render is somewhat laborious. Uber lights help a lot. Even with my modest 3060 card, I usually get faster results in Iray than with 3DL. And I do love Filament for previewing and setting up scenes. I should probably make it a point to buy some of the Filament lighting and shadow add-ons. That said, I like 3DL and I'm a little sad to see it go. It allows for unrealistic lighting and a different render aesthetic. And though I'll have ongoing access to it through my saved old versions, I'm still going to have to be careful about my installations.And eventually, I'm going to have to get a newer GC. Not sure what that will do. By then, maybe I won't care?

It's the march of time. Technology is a fast-running treadmill. We all get thrown off in the end. 

Use Filament, its better if you need fast renders. Adobe Lirghtroom Classic to 'fake things'...and... it works, belive me. And have some IAs now to help you to improve renders.

kenmo said:

miladyderyni_173d399f47 said:

IceDragonArt said:

Silent Winter said:

IceDragonArt said:

Interesting.  Thank you!  So it needs its on textures?  Iray textures won't work?  

Not different textures, but the surface properties need tweaking as it's a different shader. Some stuff looks okay off the bat, other stuff looks too bright.

This can help: https://www.daz3d.com/rssy-3delight-and-iray-to-filament ;

Thank you!

https://www.daz3d.com/easy-filatoon is another good set of scripts if you like doing toon/anime style art. 

Thanks for sharing this link. I really liked the example renders, But I would prefer to be able to  tone done the Anime look a bit to be more like Marvel or DC comics. Can it?

Cheers

 

Check out this post:

 https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/9127721/#Comment_9127721 

3Diva, the Easy Filatoon PA, posted some renders in comic book styles, done with Easy Filatoon outline styles and other presets.

WendyLuvsCatz said:

if it's any consolation it's now too late if you didn't back up 4.25 

so goodbye to 3Delight, learn to love iray, Filament or exporting to other applications 

(or converting for Carrara 8.5, can still load duf there but needs some work)

 

Vue works for me. I wish there as a magic script that converted Iray materials to the standard PBR.   Vue aheres to both PBR Metallic/Roughness and PBR Specular/Glossiness. 

if it's any consolation it's now too late if you didn't back up 4.25 

so goodbye to 3Delight, learn to love iray, Filament or exporting to other applications 

(or converting for Carrara 8.5, can still load duf there but needs some work)

 

Charlie Judge said:

Richard Haseltine said:

Havos said:

namffuak said:

Bejaymac said:

I take it this will also mean DS 2 and 3 will no longer be available.

Been using DS since 1.3, sad to say but 4.24.0.3 will be my last version of Studio, no use for Filament, and Iray is crap imho, can't even handle an Alpha channel without having to jump through hoops.

DS versions 1, 2 and 3 (final release versions) are still showing in my product library - I suspect that they will go away before the end of the month as they are all 3DL.

I have copies of all downloaded quite a while ago but never used; TBH I wouldn't be surprized to find the installers won't work on current systems. 

I doubt you will be unable to download previous purchases due to DAZ no longer having the licence. I believe it means they can not distribute it to new users, but can still give old copies to existing customers. As such I expect 1-3 to remain available to download for all of us that own them.

No, they cannot distribute it to anyone as I understand  it - hence everyone losing 3delight in DS 4.

Does this mean that I will no longer be able to dowload DS 3 from my library? 

It would be prudent to back it up, but I don't have any concrete information.

Charlie Judge said:

Richard Haseltine said:

Havos said:

namffuak said:

Bejaymac said:

I take it this will also mean DS 2 and 3 will no longer be available.

Been using DS since 1.3, sad to say but 4.24.0.3 will be my last version of Studio, no use for Filament, and Iray is crap imho, can't even handle an Alpha channel without having to jump through hoops.

DS versions 1, 2 and 3 (final release versions) are still showing in my product library - I suspect that they will go away before the end of the month as they are all 3DL.

I have copies of all downloaded quite a while ago but never used; TBH I wouldn't be surprized to find the installers won't work on current systems. 

I doubt you will be unable to download previous purchases due to DAZ no longer having the licence. I believe it means they can not distribute it to new users, but can still give old copies to existing customers. As such I expect 1-3 to remain available to download for all of us that own them.

No, they cannot distribute it to anyone as I understand  it - hence everyone losing 3delight in DS 4.

Does this mean that I will no longer be able to dowload DS 3 from my library? 

Given that  DS3 is just 3DL - that has been my assumption. With luck Daz will leave it until the 31st. 

Richard Haseltine said:

Havos said:

namffuak said:

Bejaymac said:

I take it this will also mean DS 2 and 3 will no longer be available.

Been using DS since 1.3, sad to say but 4.24.0.3 will be my last version of Studio, no use for Filament, and Iray is crap imho, can't even handle an Alpha channel without having to jump through hoops.

DS versions 1, 2 and 3 (final release versions) are still showing in my product library - I suspect that they will go away before the end of the month as they are all 3DL.

I have copies of all downloaded quite a while ago but never used; TBH I wouldn't be surprized to find the installers won't work on current systems. 

I doubt you will be unable to download previous purchases due to DAZ no longer having the licence. I believe it means they can not distribute it to new users, but can still give old copies to existing customers. As such I expect 1-3 to remain available to download for all of us that own them.

No, they cannot distribute it to anyone as I understand  it - hence everyone losing 3delight in DS 4.

Does this mean that I will no longer be able to dowload DS 3 from my library? 

Padone said:

My personal opinion is that iray is capable enough to convert 3delight shaders, indeed this is how we import 3dl in blender converting it first to iray.

Iray dosn't do anything in that context, Daz wrote code to convert 3Delight materials to Iray materials.

There may be some bump map to adjust as iray can't convert the bump height correctly, or some complex materials may need some adjustement too, but in general the conversion is good. As for the speed iray used with the cpu is far superior to 3dl with full ray tracing, while for 3dl without raytracing you can use filament instead, though in this case the shader conversion is not that good unfortunately as filament can't do most iray features, particularly transmapped hairs don't come good with filament.

The real advantage of 3dl is memory, as iray requires a vast amount of ram to render the scene while 3dl is tiled thus a small ram is enough. But ram alone doesn't cost much and most PCs can be upgraded for that.