A while back, I did an alteration of Cayman's geografts to give them full support for the standard G9 UVs meaning you could have any combination of textures or geoshells as long as they were on the standard UVs. (Additionally, a further modification can then be done to make it possible to use Map Transfer to permanently bake over textures far more conveniently than via Blender).

Unfortunately though, I've not yet worked out a way to make that modification redistributable, and I've only been able to share it with anyone else by walking them tediously through the process of doing the alteration themselves.

I would like to remind you of the cons of using Material Suit... If you need HD morph on the G9 character you use, Material Suit won't show any of HD detail when rendering 'cause it's a conformer using the technique of Auto-Hide Faces of underlying G9's geometry...

Besides, the prerequisites of using all of these "suit" and "geo-graft" products (Material Suit, Legacy series from Cayman Studios, etc.) is that you have to apply G8's skin texture on them... If you want to use G9's skin texture + G8's shell textures at the same time, it's not achievable. You still have to go for the "real conversion of texture maps".

I started playing around in Unreal, and because I am a lunatic, I started with the entire city block scene I posted earlier. I built the scene in C4D with Arnold materials, which didn't transfer over, and there were various other frustrations from not exercising enough hygiene on the scene; anyway I started the arduous process of rebuilding the shaders, which involved the arduous process of figuring out how Goddamn ANYTHING works in Unreal editor. It literally took me over half an hour to figure out how to add an image texture to a material. Since Houdini also uses MaterialX shaders, I thought I'd set it up in Houdini first and export USD from there, because as tedious as I find it to texture things in Houdini, it's a cakewalk compared to my brief dalliance with Unreal's material system. That said, I've still been dealing with many of the same frustrations as in Unreal.

I first started with USD, and I'm not sure why I moved on from that, because looking at it again it seems fine.

After that, I tried GLTF, which for no reason I can figure out imported all the buildings rotated 180° on the X axis, but in such a way that the tops of the buildings were lined up with the ground and the bottoms were staggered, so I couldn't even rotate the whole block upside down at once. Zooming in, all the objects in each individual room were also upside-down.

After that, the obvious choice was OBJ, and again, I've lost sight of why I didn't pursue that further. It's possible that I wanted to focus on FBX so that I could hopefully retain the rigging on individual components. Throughout the process I've had to re-export multiple times to correct some surfaces being incorrect because a material on an object was assigned to a polygon selection that no longer existed, so it overwrote all surfaces after it, and it's possible that doing so would have fixed the issues that steered me away from USD.

Anyway, here's as far as I've got with the scene so far. I haven't textured the sidewalk and street yet because, as previously mentioned, procedural materials are not Houdini's forte. I also need to remember how atmospheric rendering works in Karma. I've got a Karma Fog Box in the scene, but it might be in the wrong position in the hierarchy.

Venomisbeauty said:

If we are talking about dialing morphs, you can also achieve your "muscular", "curvy", "slim" figure as you want. But they are still producing and selling them...."young adult" and "elder" morphs look like discontinued by Daz. Maybe someone, like me, would like an original shape made by creator for his purposes and not another dial :) Plus, I own the Growing up set for G9 and the results are not top notch, in my opinion.

 I have the GU for G9 morphs, anything past 20% if I'm dailing in the main morph starts to look a bit odd imho. But even that little bit helps to add a bit of variation so not everyone is the same exact age.

I think the LowPi corrective morphs are misorganized, and at least one corrective morph is missing entirely. Most LowPi corrective morphs are in "data\Lyrra Madril\LM LowPi\LM LowPi\Morphs\Lyrra Madril\LM LowPi", but two of them are in "data\Lyrra Madril\LM LowPi\LM LowPi\Morphs\Lyrra Madril\Base". This probably causes no harm other than confusion. They still seem to get activated when bones are rotated.
However there is no LowPi corrective for left thigh side-side. There is a corresponding corrective morph for the right thigh. The missing corrective morph makes LowPi look lopsided with a notch in his hip when his hips are rotated side to side. See screenshot. Can this be updated, please?

I've seen quite a few folks ever complained about this product or reported issues from time to time... It seems that you have to fix a few things after running the conversion...

However, no pose is there, so it should not be an issue related to adjust rigging to shape. Since you said DS crahsed when the process was nearly completed, I assume the script failed to completely and correctly write geometry data to the morph file(s). Better re-run the conversion... if the crash as well this issue persists, try it with the latest DS Public Build. And send a ticket if they both fail you... for requesting support or refund as you wish...

Actually you may not need such a product... Jay's "fit suit method" can convert these figures across the generations... - https://youtu.be/jROlY34tNNU?si=diIa3nr850Q8y1Y8

Another trick for dforce is that the morphs on the clothing don't have to match the ones on the figure. If your clothing item has a morph for a large, heavyset figure, try dialing it up and draping. In combination with this, you can also undial the pregnant morph.

SilverGirl said:

crosswind said:

Actually, as long as the clothing product are not poorly-made, they all could well fit on a pregnant figure with proper settings / simulations. The trick is always "tweaking".

Like the Olivine dress you mentioned, if go for static simulation with its default settings on a pregnant figure, you won't get good result. But if we use a timeline to make the pregnant morph(s) change from 0 to 100, make better settings on the dynamic surface of the dress, as well as adjust the weight on the dForce modifier weight node that the vendor originally made. We may get much better draping result, as the attached ss.

So try these tricks... you can make every garment well fit on a pregnant character...

Thank you for pointing me in a helpful direction. Looks like I have some learning to do. :) 

No problem ~ Just take it easy.

Richard Haseltine said:

Summoner said:

Richard Haseltine said:

Summoner said:

Richard Haseltine said:

DS 4 has always used a single skin with modifiers, that is how all of the Genesis figues work, and Genssi 3+ use a single weight map for each joint (Genssi 1 and 2 used the TriAz system, with separate maps for each axis). Although FBX import of rigged figures has been limited until now (though it did support FBX files that matched the Motion Builder spec) the latest beta version has seen it greatly improved.

Verry Interesting, I was aware that DS is using single weight looking at the tecnical specs. Note I only run a DS that is totally empty, just loading building folders until now to test if Poser models load, that just use mechanical functions, now there is an additional folder for creation of individual DS assets. So no Genessis installed ! 

May I ask, Has Genesis 3+ been fully rigged in external applications or manually WM painted in Daz Studio ?

Would be interesting to know as I barely see standalone creatures, humans, animals released by 3rd party. There are a few but it might be a case of 1:1000 the rest is rather based on Genesis Morphs. I tried FBX import but in most cases the model will blow up, secondarly is that it is causing the model to be in compatible mode controlled through only the bones like in 3D apps and not by selecting body Parts. This might all be due my inexperience with DS and I missed something specific to activate the bodypart selection after Import.

Even that these Models are now Imported fully compatible into DS with all specs Incl all morphs, single skinned in Blender. I could not find any way importing these models in FBX into Daz studio that sure would be a great advantage for other options.

I might have to try installing Genessis and make a reversed setup like I use to load my models into DS if they are also single skinned , reversing the process I use would generate a fully working Genessis for poser ( In Theory ) this If Genessis is using the common single skinning.

As far as I know the figures were rigged in DS, though I suppose it is possible Motion Builder was used. The improved FBX import iss till only in the beta branch, the General Release has not yet been updated to a build including that. Still, the DS rigging tools are geneally quite well regarded by those with more, and more serious, hands-on experience than me so I don't think that would have been a great hardship.

Genesis 1 and 2 use single-skinning (groupin is just for bone selection) but they use the triAx rigging system, similar to Poser's rigging, rather than the more common single bend modifiers (as found in Genesis 3+, which is why those have separate bend and twist bones).

ok Woow this is sure allot of workmanship now day's, Painting articulations all by hand " Remembering me the storry of Gepetto making the wooden doll that is getting alive " He crafted it also all by hand. Considering all the advanced technology that is already since decades on the market. So a real piece of Art I would say. 

I had a look at the rigging options in DS and yes they are quiet advanced if I compare them with Poser basic ones, not talking about the setup room, but both are not compareable with tools on Figure creation programs like Blender with optional plugins. All this is actually not relevant as DS does not grant a direct Import "Officially". Each is totally Individual and naturally a case of preferences for the end User.

For me I do not use the Poser Riging tools I Plainly use external rigging tools and now the same with DS no matter what type of model it would be . In Poser there is just the need to use these tools for slight fixes and the joint editor, In DS after a little more then 48h  there is no more need of any Paint tools it takes "my new format" as if it were part of the Programm with all built in options, I just need to encode it into DS format with the standart DS import tools  and the model is ready to go. 

Important to know is that my Poser models are totally incompatible with DS, when loading a CR2 into Daz studio they break and Joints are cut, because they are rigged in simple weights and not in the traditional poser triax or unimesh way. The main reason why I searched over 5 years for a solution and the right format.

you made me really curious, so as soon as I get a little time and finished my whole setup I will have to Install these Genessis, allot of renders and options that come with them sure look amazing and advanced, I am not really the one who is playing with these dolls but I love to look at the technical specs, giving me a good opportunity to learn a little more. 

They break because DS does not attempt to import Poser weight maps. Daz did try to suport Poser's external morph system, with limited success as the format of the load command seemed to chnage with every sevice release; quite possibly that was at least part of the reason for not trying to read Poser weight maps (DS can write them when exporting CR2s, however).

Well this is certanly understandable, just what I thought. Poser basically still is using Triax Weight Paint with a mix of capsules, really confusing, the simple skinning was an attempt of Smith Micro giving the artist the posibility to evolve, but they never did. None of the creators ever used the features, they are stuck on the Triax even with La Femme. The key solution for DS would of been using the CR2 import option with Simple skinned CR2 models but a difficult task if none of the creators ever crafted these models. So for Daz there sure is no need to add a support for models formats that are not generally generated especially not if just one makes them :)

However bringing crafted models like complex creatures into DS fully articualted and ready to go from Blender or other 3D apps is only possible through Poser as far as I figured out. There seems not to be any alternative shortcut, unless one is willing to WM paint all the bendings and setup the bone structure manually with the DS tools from a static Import, witch would be the alternative but for a creator not very productive and quiet timeconsuming.

Summoner said:

Richard Haseltine said:

Summoner said:

Richard Haseltine said:

DS 4 has always used a single skin with modifiers, that is how all of the Genesis figues work, and Genssi 3+ use a single weight map for each joint (Genssi 1 and 2 used the TriAz system, with separate maps for each axis). Although FBX import of rigged figures has been limited until now (though it did support FBX files that matched the Motion Builder spec) the latest beta version has seen it greatly improved.

Verry Interesting, I was aware that DS is using single weight looking at the tecnical specs. Note I only run a DS that is totally empty, just loading building folders until now to test if Poser models load, that just use mechanical functions, now there is an additional folder for creation of individual DS assets. So no Genessis installed ! 

May I ask, Has Genesis 3+ been fully rigged in external applications or manually WM painted in Daz Studio ?

Would be interesting to know as I barely see standalone creatures, humans, animals released by 3rd party. There are a few but it might be a case of 1:1000 the rest is rather based on Genesis Morphs. I tried FBX import but in most cases the model will blow up, secondarly is that it is causing the model to be in compatible mode controlled through only the bones like in 3D apps and not by selecting body Parts. This might all be due my inexperience with DS and I missed something specific to activate the bodypart selection after Import.

Even that these Models are now Imported fully compatible into DS with all specs Incl all morphs, single skinned in Blender. I could not find any way importing these models in FBX into Daz studio that sure would be a great advantage for other options.

I might have to try installing Genessis and make a reversed setup like I use to load my models into DS if they are also single skinned , reversing the process I use would generate a fully working Genessis for poser ( In Theory ) this If Genessis is using the common single skinning.

As far as I know the figures were rigged in DS, though I suppose it is possible Motion Builder was used. The improved FBX import iss till only in the beta branch, the General Release has not yet been updated to a build including that. Still, the DS rigging tools are geneally quite well regarded by those with more, and more serious, hands-on experience than me so I don't think that would have been a great hardship.

Genesis 1 and 2 use single-skinning (groupin is just for bone selection) but they use the triAx rigging system, similar to Poser's rigging, rather than the more common single bend modifiers (as found in Genesis 3+, which is why those have separate bend and twist bones).

ok Woow this is sure allot of workmanship now day's, Painting articulations all by hand " Remembering me the storry of Gepetto making the wooden doll that is getting alive " He crafted it also all by hand. Considering all the advanced technology that is already since decades on the market. So a real piece of Art I would say. 

I had a look at the rigging options in DS and yes they are quiet advanced if I compare them with Poser basic ones, not talking about the setup room, but both are not compareable with tools on Figure creation programs like Blender with optional plugins. All this is actually not relevant as DS does not grant a direct Import "Officially". Each is totally Individual and naturally a case of preferences for the end User.

For me I do not use the Poser Riging tools I Plainly use external rigging tools and now the same with DS no matter what type of model it would be . In Poser there is just the need to use these tools for slight fixes and the joint editor, In DS after a little more then 48h  there is no more need of any Paint tools it takes "my new format" as if it were part of the Programm with all built in options, I just need to encode it into DS format with the standart DS import tools  and the model is ready to go. 

Important to know is that my Poser models are totally incompatible with DS, when loading a CR2 into Daz studio they break and Joints are cut, because they are rigged in simple weights and not in the traditional poser triax or unimesh way. The main reason why I searched over 5 years for a solution and the right format.

you made me really curious, so as soon as I get a little time and finished my whole setup I will have to Install these Genessis, allot of renders and options that come with them sure look amazing and advanced, I am not really the one who is playing with these dolls but I love to look at the technical specs, giving me a good opportunity to learn a little more. 

They break because DS does not attempt to import Poser weight maps. Daz did try to suport Poser's external morph system, with limited success as the format of the load command seemed to chnage with every sevice release; quite possibly that was at least part of the reason for not trying to read Poser weight maps (DS can write them when exporting CR2s, however).

wolf359 said:

Would be interesting to know as I barely see standalone creatures, humans, animals released by 3rd party. There are a few but it might be a case of 1:1000 the rest is rather based on Genesis Morphs.

 

 

There have been a few” standalone” humans but they all have been withdrawn from the markets both here and Renderosity
except for non human Mechs & Robots.
 

Each iteration of Genesis is a figure platform built to a uniform standard that makes it far easier for third party content developers to support it with genesis based products.

This strategy has been very successful for Daz inc compared to the  literal Crowd sourcing approach by
the various owners of poser. 
Resulting an  eclectic hodge podge of various figures over the years with alot of Nerdy Mcnerd techno babble about exotic rigging schemes and supposed “Vicky killers” but nothing in the way of standardization that could unite third party vendors.
 

Resulting in factional figures that were only used by the respective “fans” of the various figures creators
 before taking their place in the forgotten ash bin of poser history..

 

 

 

Yes the strategy trying to replace a flag ship doll with a new one is totally the wrong way, "Killing Vicky" was sure the wrong descision unless bringing out something top notch ! in every instace a total marketing fail just for a few to get some attention " do not want to start ranting about these as I am quiet pissed off " But reality shows that Vicky still is the flagship for Poser for the few remaining users. La Femme is just a desperate scream of a hand full with big attention disorders. ( Just my personal opinion )

Intentions mentioned are soley to  bring standalones into DS that can not be made out of base Morphing humanoid figure, that already have there place as flagships with all the needs, not in good interests replacing a Morph doll with a new one, this would be just a waste of time and efforts.

crosswind said:

Actually, as long as the clothing product are not poorly-made, they all could well fit on a pregnant figure with proper settings / simulations. The trick is always "tweaking".

Like the Olivine dress you mentioned, if go for static simulation with its default settings on a pregnant figure, you won't get good result. But if we use a timeline to make the pregnant morph(s) change from 0 to 100, make better settings on the dynamic surface of the dress, as well as adjust the weight on the dForce modifier weight node that the vendor originally made. We may get much better draping result, as the attached ss.

So try these tricks... you can make every garment well fit on a pregnant character...

Thank you for pointing me in a helpful direction. Looks like I have some learning to do. :) 

They belong to a specified morph Path under "Actor", as shown in the attached ss. Use a regular expression to filter Easy Teeth properties starting with 0.

I can't locate the morph sliders for Easy Teeth for G8F. I'm only getting the presets;

I just bought the Vanity dress for V4, and there's an important information box that says "Please inject the corset morph into V4 before loading the clothes." But they don't tell you how to do that. It's not in the Read Me. You can't get at morphs from the Poser Formats menu in DAZ Studio. So how does this work?

Thanks for your help.

vangelrise said:

No no, immaginavo che potessero coesistere in scena, ma non pensavo che gli si adattassero abiti e capelli di G8!
Questa è una buona notizia. Ma vale anche per le pose, i props, ecc.?

Le pose funzionano parzialmente, i Geograft si "adattano" ma non funzionano al 100% e i materiali non vanno a meno di non avere delle UV speciali.

In genere tutti gli abiti, i capelli e gli altri prop per G8 funzionano immediatemente su G9.

Oppure fai come me che uso G1 e gli applico i vestiti, i capelli e i prop di TUTTI dalla generazione 1 alla generazione 9. Perfino i morph.

richardandtracy said:

One way may be to set the "Horizontal Tiles" in the cover material to -1 and then adjust the "Horizontal Offset' to line it up properly.

I didn't know it was possible and doing solve the problem nicely: I played a bit with the offset to get a sligthly better look on the spine of each book, but the geometry is not compatible with the front cover being visible with this trick.

But your suggestion made me 'remember' the -100% scale trick and it solve the problem at the price of reversing everything on the desk. I said 'remember' because when I loaded the desk preset I created (just two days ago… ) after extracting all props from the "Desk item" I saw that I did use the -100% X Scale trick on the two books but didn't think of using it on the "Desk item" itself.

crosswind said:

I even didn't notice this issue before...

Did you see that the lamp is a second away from falling on the floor, with its third feet not placed on the table ?

Less visible, the leg of the photo stand is something like a couple of millimeters (to be fair, I only saw this when I was moving the lamp in Hexagon to create a morph fixing its position, so I created a morph for the photo stand in the process but I don't know if I'm allowed to share them).

And on the wall with the painting, for a reason I don't understand, there is a layer of glass a couple of centimers away from the wall (maybe it's supposed to be the glass over the painting ? but from what I can see, the whole wall is covered).

I like the product, but some decisions during its creation are a bit strange: why are the desk and the props on it merged when the shelf and the props on it are not ?

As Richard said, you just set -1 to Horizontal Tiles on the surface of "desk_Book_B" of the Desk prop, but the book is still "flipped". To flip it... if you own Mesh Grabber, firstly select the "desk_Book_B" surface with Geometry Editor, swith to Mesh Grabber, with Normal orientation, zero Falloff Radius, then rotate and translate the book to the right position.

I have Mesh Grabber, but didn't think of using it like you suggested.

If you don't have Mesh Grabber, you also can "cut" the book surface from Desk with Geometry Editor, export / import it as a single book Prop...then rotate and translate it. However, making it with the prop "FE Book_D" will be much easier.

I spent an hour listening to a podcast to extract every prop from the desk to create a preset for each of them Well, almost every prop to be honest: I didn't get as far as getting the pen in the three glass holders as independant props but I modified the magnifier to get a lens made of glass, added surfaces here and there. I also did the same with the wall and windows item, to get an independant ceiling and backdrop from the former and an independant painting and window from the latter.

Regarding this process, do you know if there is a (hopefully easy) way to remove the baked rotations and translations and get these props at world center in a more neutral position ?

crosswind said:

As for the "photo issue", it results from its UV layout. If you check the UV layout, you'll find where the photo should be (in ss1). Then you use that layout to place your photo in the right place with an Image Editor (ss2). Save it as a PNG file with transparent background. Then add it to the Base Color slot with Layered Image editor. (ss3)... Finally set Horizontal Tiles and Vertical Tiles to 1.

Or directly use another photo stand Prop...

I don't think I have another photo stand prop like that, but after creating a surface for the photo in Daz Studio, I fumbled my way through Hexagon and I was able to change the UV map of that surface in Hexagon to at least remove the rotation (as best as I can)

I still had to play with the tilling and the ofsets to get the whole photo centered on the surface but I suppose it's fixable somewhere in the UV map (and one day I'll learn how to do it), but it does look good enough right now:

...I've been creating younger characters since the Gen4 days (before K4). 

When Genesis came out with the first young adults (Young Teens 5 and later Josie) it made the workflow a little easier but to this day I still tend to favour creating custom characters and have a vast library of character shapes and morph utilities which make turning a full adult into a younger one far easier than with ol' VIcky 4.

Actually, as long as the clothing product are not poorly-made, they all could well fit on a pregnant figure with proper settings / simulations. The trick is always "tweaking".

Like the Olivine dress you mentioned, if go for static simulation with its default settings on a pregnant figure, you won't get good result. But if we use a timeline to make the pregnant morph(s) change from 0 to 100, make better settings on the dynamic surface of the dress, as well as adjust the weight on the dForce modifier weight node that the vendor originally made. We may get much better draping result, as the attached ss.

So try these tricks... you can make every garment well fit on a pregnant character...

Great, will give me time to get the creature morphs so I can use the morph, which by the way I really like.