Tobias said:

AllenArt said:

Tobias said:

So this reminds me of the time when Scott 6 came out after Victoria 7.  Does this mean that Michael 9 won't be out until spring or summer?

The armor looks a bit impractical for stealth, not to mention the danger of impaling yourself on one of those spikes.  I wonder what the outfit looks like without the armor.

I do like the character and the hair.

I am tempted to get the Stealth bundle.  First time I've considered purchasing a bundle in a while.

Maybe. Cause, who gives a crap about males, right? Daz doesn't much ;)

 

 

Very true.  Someday, I half expect an announcement that Daz will no longer be making any male base characters at all. 

And, unfortunately, the majority of the user base doesn't give a crap about males either.

If that ever happens then I can definitely start saving my money. ;).

Is the following correct based on what I am reading above?

One could 

1) Model clothing mesh for targeted gender (base male 9 or female 9).

2) Adjust the mesh and save separately for (a) the default unigender 9, and for (b) the other gender (base male 9 or base female 9)

3) Rig clothing mesh once for the targeted gender in transfer utility, and use 'reverse deformation' or similar to get to default uni-gender rigging based on targeted gender mesh.

4) Substitute your adjusted uni-gender 9 mesh obj from (step 2) for the mesh attached to transfer utility rigging of uni-gender 9 outcomes in (step 3), just like it was a character full body morph.

5) Treat the non-target-gender 9 base (male or female) like it was a supported character full body morph and substitute its adjusted obj from step 2.

6) Adjust weightmaps for all 3 base versions (female 9, male 9, and unigender 9).

7) Repeat obj substitutions and rigging adjustments for other full body morph supported characters like Victoria 9, Michael 9, Aiko 9, Brute 9,...

Seems like a lot of extra work for the PAs, but cross-gender use should be a lot easier.  Or maybe I am wrong and it could be even easier than that?  Or maybe I am wrong and it could be a lot harder than that?  Still a little confused, but I think I see a work flow. 

I hope that more information is forthcoming and would appreciate thoughts on a workflow.

AllenArt said:

Tobias said:

So this reminds me of the time when Scott 6 came out after Victoria 7.  Does this mean that Michael 9 won't be out until spring or summer?

The armor looks a bit impractical for stealth, not to mention the danger of impaling yourself on one of those spikes.  I wonder what the outfit looks like without the armor.

I do like the character and the hair.

I am tempted to get the Stealth bundle.  First time I've considered purchasing a bundle in a while.

Maybe. Cause, who gives a crap about males, right? Daz doesn't much ;)

 

Very true.  Someday, I half expect an announcement that Daz will no longer be making any male base characters at all. 

And, unfortunately, the majority of the user base doesn't give a crap about males either.

I don't understand why people instantly think G9 is going to crush their PC. And I equally don't understand why people would want to hold back progress for everybody else because they have a potato PC. Especially after it has been mentioned numerous times how easy it is to make this stuff work on a potato PC just in case it doesn't.

If you played video games, a 10 year PC would be even more screwed than it is for Daz. Modern games especially will not even start on a 2GB GPU from 2012. Meanwhile, you can use a CPU to render Iray if you run out of VRAM.

Technology moves forward. But that said, I don't think Genesis 9 is that radical of a leap to be so scared about. Are we really going to cry about a high quality texture? Are we really going to be terrified of a texture which can be reduced in size in less than 2 minutes? It will take less than 2 minutes to resize every Victoria 9 texture. And I am being extremely generous. Most of that time is you locating the folder. You then highlight all the textures. You then right click on your mouse. I am sure most of you know how to right click, right? Then in that menu you select the image resizer. You then select 'custom' and select the exact size you desire. The custom setting also lets you select the quality. You can lower the quality to reduce the image data size even more. You can click on the resizer settings to select whether you want to save new textures or replace the old ones completely. Once this is set, you can click accept. Then in about 10 seconds (and I say 10 only because I assume your PC must be slow), you will have replaced every single texture you had highlighted in Victoria 9's folder.

Does that sound impossible? Is that really so hard? I did this for several years myself when I started with Daz Studio. It was part of my routine. And this is not the only option. Again, it has been pointed out numerous times.

Today I find myself trying to upscale textures more than anything else. Especially environments. I am finding that many Daz environments seem to have very compressed textures. The texture might be 4K, but it is compressed to a ridiculous extreme. It really is getting on my nerves. I try to use AI image upscalers to enhance these poor quality textures. Sometimes it works. Sometimes the AI upscaling looks terrible. The point here is that is WAY WAY easier to downsize textures and compress them than it is to increase their quality. You cannot magically enhance a texture to save it. That is why it is so important to have good quality textures from the start. A good quality texture gives you options, and you can downsize easily if needed. A low quality texture doesn't give you many options.

You can reach a point of diminishing returns. That is true. But I see plenty of room for improvement in a lot of stuff I see. A good example are the ethnic textures that Daz gave us for 8.1 a while back. While this was a nice gesture, the textures themselves have been reduced in quality. As many of you probably know the textures come from past Genesis characters. The African skin is just Monique 7. I compared the original Monique textures to the 8.1 textures Daz gave us and the originals are better. I don't know if the conversion process caused this loss of detail, since Monique was a unique UV all of her textures needed to be converted, not just the "head" torso texture. But more than that, I can see a lot more compression in the new textures. So it appears to me they used a lower quality setting on the JPG when they made them. I really hope the Genesis 9 ethnic textures they are including are not as compressed. I am quite worried they will be.

Tobias said:

So this reminds me of the time when Scott 6 came out after Victoria 7.  Does this mean that Michael 9 won't be out until spring or summer?

The armor looks a bit impractical for stealth, not to mention the danger of impaling yourself on one of those spikes.  I wonder what the outfit looks like without the armor.

I do like the character and the hair.

I am tempted to get the Stealth bundle.  First time I've considered purchasing a bundle in a while.

Maybe. Cause, who gives a crap about males, right? Daz doesn't much ;)

So this reminds me of the time when Scott 6 came out after Victoria 7.  Does this mean that Michael 9 won't be out until spring or summer?

The armor looks a bit impractical for stealth, not to mention the danger of impaling yourself on one of those spikes.  I wonder what the outfit looks like without the armor.

I do like the character and the hair.

I am tempted to get the Stealth bundle.  First time I've considered purchasing a bundle in a while.

Just one thought here. Most Daz Official shapes like Victoria, etc, are priced generally above the average PA's character. And the HD add on is generally the price of a new character. (A lot of PAs btw include the HD in their character along with a ton more options, which puts a lot of value there, IMHO). At any rate, the full price of general 8.1 OFFICIAL Characters is $45 and HD add on is $40 ish, tho with PC discount you'd probably get it at 30-50 off, so maybe, 20-25 for teh char, 20-18 for HD,

Vic 9 is 60 full price and that's with the HD, (full for 8.1 +HD is 85.).  Currently, the presale is a very good deal. 

Since I only started a year ago I rarely use G3 figures except for some unique skins. I have pre ordered victoria and am curious how that will perform, I have an 3060 12gb so vram wise i should be ok.
What it looked like in the presentation is that the converter was build into studio. I just wish they would auto convert instead of using an setting.

barbult said:

Richard Haseltine said:

Timbales said:

I skimmed through when I saw it was a new Victoria. Was there anything revealed about the next version of Daz Studio?

See the log file - 4.20.1.x will eventually be 4.21.x.x

DS log file? Change log?

I can't find anything about 4.20.1.X becoming 4.21.X.X in the change log.

Sorry, the chnage log - and no, it doesn't say that in the log but nevertheless we are told that when there is a final reelase of the 4.20.1.x branch it will be done as 4.21.x.x - 4.21.x.x is not a separate branch that has not yet been revealed.

VicS said:

can Victoria 8.1 skin be used on G8F? (not G8.1 F but original G8F

thanks

Have a look in this thread:

https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/502871/howto-create-missing-genesis-8-skin-parts-on-torso-surface-from-genesis-8-1-body-and-head-surfaces

M-C said:

Mendoman said:

For future, I hope Daz Studio 5 brings some real tech advancements for the figures.

That´s what I actually expected from a new generation.
Victoria 9 looks great but I struggle to see that big of an improvement over what Mousso or bluejaunte could give us with their figures. In fact one of the "big new features" - the 8k detail maps have allready been used by bluejaunte before.

That is why the announcement of G9 at this time with the meager improvements compared to what was expected, was such a disappointment as it also means that the figure people were/are waiting for, just moved 3 to 6 years into the future. 

Mendoman said:

For future, I hope Daz Studio 5 brings some real tech advancements for the figures.

That´s what I actually expected from a new generation.
Victoria 9 looks great but I struggle to see that big of an improvement over what Mousso or bluejaunte could give us with their figures. In fact one of the "big new features" - the 8k detail maps have allready been used by bluejaunte before.

hansmolleman33 said:

Exactly ! I am talking about Victoria 9 not Genesis 9..... The price tag of Victoria 9 is clearly an indicator on how much Genesis 9 figures will cost once the free base model is available.

30$ just for Victoria 9 ?!? What are DAZ management team smoking ? What about that so called bundle....1 bikini and 1 asset of hair for 80$ ?!?! GTFO !

Nothing has been said about what is included in the bundle yet, the hair and the bikini are just the bonus items given to ones that preorder the bundle 

gerster said:

Richard Haseltine said:

hansmolleman33 said:

The price tag alone for Victoria 9 makes it a huge pass. Is DAZ serious with their pricings ??

Free is too expensive? Victoria 9 is not the base, Genesis 9 is and that will still be free.

 

He complained that Victoria 9 is too expensive and not Genesis 9.

And Victoria 9 isn't free, for sure.

But if Victoria 9 is too expensive for the majority will DAZ soon see, once they released her.

I have no special opionon about that.

Exactly ! I am talking about Victoria 9 not Genesis 9..... The price tag of Victoria 9 is clearly an indicator on how much Genesis 9 figures will cost once the free base model is available.

30$ just for Victoria 9 ?!? What are DAZ management team smoking ? What about that so called bundle....1 bikini and 1 asset of hair for 80$ ?!?! GTFO !

I pre-purchased the Victoria 9 Bundle, but with my systems right now, with a 1080ti and 1080, not sure I will be able to really do her justice.

I am looking at upgrading my harddrive in a major way. There was a thread in Commons I just took notes from and I need to see what I have on my Dragon (desktop with the 1080ti). Expense is the issue. But I have also been thinking about this as the computer was build in 2017 and is struggling with many of the newer sets released today.

nonesuch00 said:

I'm looking forward to this Victoria 9 & company. The expressions are so extremely improved and the way fat looks too.

Yes, I am looking forward to Victoria 9 and Genesis 9 items, too.

I like expressions a lot, especially animated.

It is a pity, that Daz is not willing to reveal a details of the V9 bundle.

I also wonder, how and if Victoria 9 will transfer to Unity using Daz to Unity bridge.

Anyhow, great work on this new generation of the figures - well done.

I'm looking forward to this Victoria 9 & company. The expressions are so extremely improved and the way fat looks too.

I've not bought her pre-purchase yet, but certainly will in the week to come even though I have no real interest in realism for commercial use I am too much of a tech nerd not to buy into at least the basics morphs, Victoria, & Michael of Genesis 9 to see the progress they made when I try to do renders. I also enjoy seeing the progress of nVidia, DAZ 3D, and the PAs. People that garden, do home improvement, and such hobbies, well these kind of technical and artistic improvements in DAZ Studio and it's models are just the sort of gradual improvements that motivates us in other hobbies we do too.

It's not like I'm ever going to use them in a game as I prefer toons for that (and real life keeps introducing too much interference to disrupt what I'm doing in game planning anyway) or be a serious artist with them, but I can see AOBB making great likenesses of actors from oldtime movies and myself trying to see how close I can get to copying a still of a movie a character AOBB's made is in. That's sort of fun when I'm in the mood.

And if DAZ 3D and/or PAs make new toons for Genesis 9 I will almost certainly buy those too, with 3D Universe's Toon Generations for Genesis 9 the most likely. Also Raw Art, Joe Quick, Alessandro (spelling sorry but the guy with all the great animal products), and so on. I'll have to try and start cutting back on clothing and sets but when they make such that I like enough I usually come up with the money.

Richard Haseltine said:

outrider42 said:

bytescapes said:

daveso said:

Are 8k textures going to render on my system? What are the specs?

During the presentation, Jay Versluis described his system -- 48GB RAM, dual Xeon processors, a 3090 and a 2080, which is a pretty beefy machine -- and he also kept saying that he didn't want to do certain things (I think it was turning on SubD for View) or his system would become very slow.

He also said that he thought that if you had 8GB of VRAM, "you'd be OK". And that he'd try to find out whether V9 would render on a 4GB VRAM card, or if you'd need to scale down her textures with an optimizer.

Reading between the lines, it sounds as if V9 is going to be resource hungry. We know that she has 8K textures and double the polygon count of previous generations. So I think it's safe to assume that she will want all the resources you can throw at her. If you struggle with G8 figures now, you can probably expect to feel some pain.

The reason his system would get slow has nothing to do with his GPU. Remember Daz is single threaded, so using a workstation CPU is actually a detriment to the in app performance. Workstation CPUs pack tons of cores, but each individual core is a lot slower than a good consumer desktop CPU. So because Daz Studio is still siingle threaded, he is only using one single core with Daz Studio. I have a 5800X, and I can keep 6 or 8 Genesis 8 charactrs at subdivision 2 or 3  in my viewport without any issues at all. A single HD character in an empty scene like he had would not even make my 5800X's one core that Daz uses sweat. LOL.

The texture resolution of any character is up to the PA who makes them. Victoria 9 has 8K textures, that does not mean every single Genesis 9 character will. And Jay was incorrect that no Genesis has ever had so much detail before. Several characters in the past have used 8K textures. Bluejaunte characters have had 8K spec maps for a long time. George 8 had 8K torso textures. I have made 8K textures myself to a degree. At any rate, while Victoria 9 has 8K textures others may not. That said it is likely that Vicktoria 9 probably sets the standard for other Daz Original 9 Core characters that follow.

Texture data is controlled by Iray's compression settings. So you can limit the data by changing the settings. And you can always downscale textures if you really need to. Textures are by far the easiest thing to deal with. I personally very much prefer having 8K textures, because it is easier to downscale than upscale. I like this move a lot. We have a product that automates downscaling textures for you, too. So this part is a non issue.

The next thing is mesh data. Now this is in question. Until we can see the actual poly counts of the models next to each other it is hard to say how well this translates in practical use. But we can't compress mesh data like textures. The only option I am aware of is Decimate, and I am not sure it even works anymore. In general, I like that we get a better base mesh. But at the same time, why we needed a better base mesh is because Daz refuses to allow its customers to edit a HD mesh.

This brings up a totally different question. In the video Jay said that the new body morphs already have HD included. This is great...maybe. Since the user cannot sculpt with HD, if the user sees something they don't like on a body morph, can they sculpt that out??? Just as an example, what about a big vein on a guy. The vein doesn't show on the base much, if any, but does at HD level. Can the user remove this vein by sculpting, or will the HD part of the morph still retain some form of that vein? The same goes for creases and wrinkles, like aging. Or that crease on the bottom of a glute. I remember this being an issue with Tara 8 and her face scar, which could not be fully removed by sculpting the mesh. Daz eventually updated the character, but that was an outlier. Most characters don't get updated that way.

So while the changes look nice on paper, anti consumer practices may get in the way. If we the consumer could edit HD mesh we wouldn't need these 2 changes to begin with.

Daz Studio is not simply single-threaded, some parts are but others are not.

Specifically which parts??? Certainly some plugins may use more threads, but where in the base application does it use more than one?

Has this ever been clarified anywhere?