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  • Performance improvement suggestion when loading scenes
    As example, If I load a scene and I load the same scene again without changing anything, it takes 23 seconds to load, according to the logs this is what happens:

    2023-04-19 15:52:43.881 [INFO] :: Prepare asset load (open): PATH_TO_MY_SCENE
    2023-04-19 15:52:43.881 [INFO] :: Locking viewport redraw...
    2023-04-19 15:52:43.881 [INFO] :: Viewport redraw locked.
    2023-04-19 15:52:43.928 [INFO] :: Native format content directories: 4
    2023-04-19 15:52:43.928 [INFO] :: Poser format content directories: 3
    2023-04-19 15:52:43.928 [INFO] :: Other import format content directories: 0
    2023-04-19 15:52:43.928 [INFO] :: Begin asset load (open): PATH_TO_MY_SCENE
    2023-04-19 15:52:44.562 [INFO] :: Clearing the scene...
    2023-04-19 15:52:47.812 [INFO] :: *** Scene Cleared ***
    2023-04-19 15:52:47.812 [INFO] :: Determining missing assets...
     (4 seconds!! glad to see this line here, but it takes a lot :( )
    2023-04-19 15:52:51.136 [INFO] :: Setting textures...
    2023-04-19 15:52:51.292 [INFO] :: Scanning for addons...
    2023-04-19 15:52:53.488 [INFO] :: Creating node geometry...
    2023-04-19 15:52:53.543 [INFO] :: Creating UV sets...
    2023-04-19 15:52:53.543 [INFO] :: Creating materials...
     (3 seconds!! do we need to create the same materials again?)
    2023-04-19 15:52:56.382 [INFO] :: Resolving legacy figures...
    2023-04-19 15:52:56.382 [INFO] :: Preparing modifiers...
    ....

     

    I think it really depends on the assets / resources that need to be loaded... My single V9 scene is even slower: ( latest Public Build )

    2023-04-20 08:16:57.108 [INFO] :: Prepare asset load (open): /H:/G9Dev.duf
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.108 [INFO] :: Locking viewport redraw...
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.108 [INFO] :: Viewport redraw locked.
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.211 [INFO] :: Native format content directories: 3
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.211 [INFO] :: Poser format content directories: 2
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.211 [INFO] :: Other import format content directories: 0
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.211 [INFO] :: Begin asset load (open): /H:/G9Dev.duf
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.246 [INFO] :: Clearing the scene...
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.258 [INFO] :: *** Scene Cleared ***
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.258 [INFO] :: Determining missing assets...
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.731 [INFO] :: Setting textures...
    2023-04-20 08:16:57.897 [INFO] :: Scanning for addons...
    2023-04-20 08:17:03.677 [INFO] :: Creating node geometry...
    2023-04-20 08:17:03.687 [INFO] :: Creating UV sets...
    2023-04-20 08:17:03.688 [INFO] :: Creating materials...
    (7 secs with PBRSkin + those big maps. Each time it must load the map files on disk. No cache for materials)
    2023-04-20 08:17:03.707 Iray [INFO] - MDLC:COMPILER ::   1.0   MDLC   comp info : Loading module "......\pbr_skin.mdl".
    2023-04-20 08:17:10.566 [INFO] :: Resolving legacy figures...
    2023-04-20 08:17:10.566 [INFO] :: Preparing modifiers...
    2023-04-20 08:17:10.617 [INFO] :: Creating modifiers...
    2023-04-20 08:17:11.563 [INFO] :: Creating property aliases...
    2023-04-20 08:17:11.590 [INFO] :: Resolving 186055 formulas...
    2023-04-20 08:17:11.590 [INFO] :: Finding formula properties...
    2023-04-20 08:17:12.680 [INFO] :: Sorting formula properties...
    2023-04-20 08:17:12.724 [INFO] :: Creating ERC Links...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.204 [INFO] :: Finished resolving formulas.
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.263 [INFO] :: Processing scene data...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.264 [INFO] :: Finalizing modifiers...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.265 [INFO] :: Finalizing channels...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.265 [INFO] :: Finalizing materials...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.265 [INFO] :: Sorting property groups...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.271 [INFO] :: Setting up follow targets...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.271 [INFO] :: Start following: Victoria 9 HD << Genesis 9 Eyelashes
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.271 [INFO] :: Following started: Victoria 9 HD << Genesis 9 Eyelashes
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.272 [INFO] :: Connect base morphs: Victoria 9 HD << Genesis 9 Eyelashes
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.288 [INFO] :: Applying projection morphs...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.291 [INFO] :: Loaded morph deltas: 0m 0.3s - /data/Daz 3D/Genesis 9/Genesis 9 Eyelashes/Morphs/Daz 3D/Base/head_bs_EyelashesProjectionShape.dsf
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.335 [INFO] :: Creating morph projection map: Victoria 9 HD << Genesis 9 Eyelashes
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.364 [INFO] :: Base morphs connected: Victoria 9 HD << Genesis 9 Eyelashes
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.364 [INFO] :: Applying projection morphs...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.364 [INFO] :: Creating morph projection map: Victoria 9 HD << Genesis 9 Eyelashes
    ................................................................
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.801 [INFO] :: Setting current camera...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.801 [INFO] :: Finalizing scene data...
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.802 [INFO] :: Finished asset load (open): 0m 17.590s - /H:/G9Dev.duf
    2023-04-20 08:17:14.803 [INFO] :: Processing morph projection queue: Victoria 9 HD << Genesis 9 Eyelashes
    (16 secs, fr projection queue of anatomy to redraw unlock, as no cache for projection.)
    ................................................................
    2023-04-20 08:17:30.004 [INFO] :: Unlocking viewport redraw...
    2023-04-20 08:17:30.004 [INFO] :: Viewport redraw unlocked.


    Asset loading time 17.6s, total loading time 34.6s before viewport redraw, even if my computer is pretty robust... But the loading time in latest Public build was shortened by 10% at least comparing to General release, I was still a bit satisfied...

    By

    crosswind crosswind April 2023 in Daz Studio Discussion
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    Ken OBanion said:

    While entry #2 is rendering (and after 30 minutes, and only 2% complete, it's liable to take a while), I thought I'd get a jump on #3.  So here's my (pseudo-)random draw for round 3:

    8301 - Fairytale Collection - Charming For David
    7452 - Fantasy Castle 2011 - Castle Keep 2
    7413 - Trail Scouts
    2656 - Agila

    Man, that 'blast from the past' vibe is still going strong, isn't it!?

    So..., okay; challenge accepted!

     This one came together surprisingly quickly!

    I had to do it as three separate images, and then composited them, due to the scale of the scene, plus the fact that the various figures are all facing in different directions.  (And for the record, I don't recommend it, and I hope I don't have to do it again!)

    Anyway, here it is.

    Also used:

    David (obviously; otherwise that Charming outfit would be just another empty suit!)

    Donavan (MAT and morphs by LA3D - a ShareCG freebie)

    Jamie Hair by AprilYSH

    Michael 3 Sr2

    Level Hype (another LA3D morph package for M3)

    Shelby textures (LA3D again)

    Prince Charming Hair for M3

    The Scout for M3 (required for Trail Scout textures)

    Marauder for M3 (Rifle; yeah, it's an AR-15 -- what's your point?)

    Victoria 4.2

    DMR Lynette (MAT and morphs)

    V4 Ranger Hair

    Vandra (required for Agila textures)

    V4 Morphing Cloak and Cape

    DMs Courage Realm (Weapons and hand poses)

    Dark Tales textures for Castle Keep 2

    Easy Environments Witchcraft: Eclipse (Skydome)

    With a little bit of postwork in GIMP.  (Okay, a lot of postwork in GIMP!)

    Tag: OBanion_03

    Title: A Little Unfinished Business

    Long believed dead, Agila had instead been relentlessly hunting down the man who murdered her father.  In the course of her travels, she encountered a man out of his place, and out of his time who, lacking anything better to do, had joined her in her quest for justice and retribution.

    At long last, much to Prince Humperdinck's surprise, the two travellers arrived at his castle.

    Agila: "My name is Agila Montoya!  You killed my father!  Prepare to die!"

    Michael: "Seriously...!?"

    By

    Ken OBanion Ken OBanion April 2023 in Art Studio
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    Man, it's been so many years since I worked with any of the Generation-3 figures (David, Michael 3, Victoria 3, Stephanie Petite), I had all but forgotten just what a pain in the never-mind-precisely-where they are to work with!

    Oh, well....  As Phineas T. Farnsworth (a.k.a., Super Chicken) so famously said, "You knew the job was dangerous when you took it!"

    By

    Ken OBanion Ken OBanion April 2023 in Art Studio
  • Carrara Challenge #66 - Jumping Off a Browser Scene Go Splat !

    Diomede said:

    WIP - PhilW Fantasy Village.

    PhilW's Fantasy Village is still available here at Daz.  https://www.daz3d.com/carrara-fantasy-village

    PhilW always has amazing sets, from the Night and Day City, to the English Cottage, to this Fantasy Village.  The fantasy village uses a lot of replicators and can bog down a computer if you try to use it all at once, much like some of Howie's old scenes.  Recommend turning off portions of the set not in view for easier manipulation.  

    However, I decided to take a different approach this time.  I loaded the fantasy scene and left everything 'turned on.'  I inserted a spherical camera and adjusted its view to taste, but was mostly concerned with height from the ground and angle.  I then rendered out a spherical 2W x 1L image.  This is inserted into the Background map in the scene tab.

    So, here we have a genesis 1 skullcrusher ogre in the stocks that come with PhilW's fantasy village.  However, the stocks are actually part of the background rendered out from the village.  I just used a grid with holes as a shadow catcher.  Naturally, a fantasy scene has to have a Vicky, even if it is the ogre which is nearly naked.  I used shadow catchers for the doorway around Victoria 4.  Vicky's clothes are from RuntimeDNA's site, and so may be available now in the Daz store.  Not sure what went where.

    Waiting to see Vicky tickle the Ogre's feet !!!

    By

    Bunyip02 Bunyip02 April 2023 in Carrara Discussion
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    Ken OBanion said:

    And..., here's pull #2:

    7122 - Expressive Action Hand To Mouth
    4228 - Larian For Ninive 6
    270 - Platea Pergo Iray Addon
    6351 - Olympia 6 Hd Add-On

    Hmm....  Two Genesis 2 Females, a pose set for Victoria 4, and an environment.  Could it possibly get any more generic than that!?  And, in keeping with the theme...?

    I got nothin'.

     I came up with something.

    I decided to slip back into my usual routine, and my traditional genre, and do a vampire scene, but with a twist: First, this vampire is a guy; and secondly, he's actually wearing clothes!  And, since I was back on familiar territory {so to speak), it came together surprisingly quickly!

    Also used:

    Starry Sky Lights and HDRIs for Iray (by Sickleyield -- I love working with her stuff!)

    Birthday Girl Hair (Olympia)

    AERON for Genesis 2 Female

    Fancy Hair (Larian)

    Annika Storm Outfit for Genesis 2 Female

    Vampire's Bane (a prop set for Genesis 3 Female, but hey -- props are props, and they're not proprietary!)

    Victoria 4.2

    A_Sofia (MAT and morphs for V4; yet another ShareCG freebie from before you were born)

    Sapphire Hair for V4

    DMR Lynette's Dark Nights (Just the accessories)

    Dark Sorceress Mk2 by Flesh Forge (another freebie, this one from Renderotica!  (Hell, somebody had to...!))

    V4 Domino Outfit (Shoes - no clue where they came from!)

    Michael 4

    Elven Hair

    Notorious for M4/H4 (DAZ/RDNA)

    Mortuorum Sacris

    Altar (Guess where I got this one!  Go on; guess!)

     

    Tag: OBanion_02

    Title: Forget the Blood!  I Need Coffee!

    As the vampire hunters approached their quarry, they were brought to a halt by the vampire's faithful servant, Countess Sofia Renveldt, who issued a dire warning.

    Sofia: "Shh, quiet!  You do not want to rouse Drustan!  Drustan can be really cranky when he first awakens!"

    Olympia (loudly, and proving to the world yet again that she is the ballsiest non-trans woman on the planet): "Well, let's find out!  YO!  RISE AND SHINE, DRUSTAN, BABY!"

    Drustan (groggy and grumpy): "Bite me, Mortal!"

    Olympia: "Um..., isn't that supposed to be your shtick?"

    Larian: "Wow, you are definitely not a morning person, are you!?"

    Drustan (less groggy, but just as grumpy): "I'm a vampire, you nitwit!  None of us are morning people!"

    By

    Ken OBanion Ken OBanion April 2023 in Art Studio
  • Carrara Challenge #66 - Jumping Off a Browser Scene Go Splat !

    WIP - PhilW Fantasy Village.

    PhilW's Fantasy Village is still available here at Daz.  https://www.daz3d.com/carrara-fantasy-village

    PhilW always has amazing sets, from the Night and Day City, to the English Cottage, to this Fantasy Village.  The fantasy village uses a lot of replicators and can bog down a computer if you try to use it all at once, much like some of Howie's old scenes.  Recommend turning off portions of the set not in view for easier manipulation.  

    However, I decided to take a different approach this time.  I loaded the fantasy scene and left everything 'turned on.'  I inserted a spherical camera and adjusted its view to taste, but was mostly concerned with height from the ground and angle.  I then rendered out a spherical 2W x 1L image.  This is inserted into the Background map in the scene tab.

    So, here we have a genesis 1 skullcrusher ogre in the stocks that come with PhilW's fantasy village.  However, the stocks are actually part of the background rendered out from the village.  I just used a grid with holes as a shadow catcher.  Naturally, a fantasy scene has to have a Vicky, even if it is the ogre which is nearly naked.  I used shadow catchers for the doorway around Victoria 4.  Vicky's clothes are from RuntimeDNA's site, and so may be available now in the Daz store.  Not sure what went where.

    By

    Diomede Diomede April 2023 in Carrara Discussion
  • Let's appreciate/discuss today's new releases - ongoing thread

    caravelle said:

    Hylas said:

    https://www.daz3d.com/nahuel-for-genesis-9-hd

    Ohhhh... he's a babe.

    As someone who's now definitely decided to skip G9, I'll just have to content myself with longingly gazing at him cool

    Well. He reminds me a lot of a Genesis 8 base figure that was also supposed to be from South America. Or was it Mexico? Anyway, the Latin Americans at Daz are all Spanish or otherwise white anyway.... I'm not blown away by him.

    Yanno, you're right. I'd love to see a proper Latin American with Native American features. The only character I have that really does is Benita for G8F. 

    By

    AllenArt AllenArt April 2023 in The Commons
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    Bunyip02 said:

    Ken OBanion said:

    And..., here's pull #2:

    7122 - Expressive Action Hand To Mouth
    4228 - Larian For Ninive 6
    270 - Platea Pergo Iray Addon
    6351 - Olympia 6 Hd Add-On

     

    Hmm....  Two Genesis 2 Females, a pose set for Victoria 4, and an environment.  Could it possibly get any more generic than that!?  And, in keeping with the theme...?

    I got nothin'.

    Two fashionistas walk past a women clad with red, yellow, blue, and green clothes.
    One of them says to the other - " I wouldn't be caught dead in those colours "
    The other replies - " But you could be reincarnated as a Scarlet Macaw "

    yes
    Or a lorikeet.

     

    By

    barbult barbult April 2023 in Art Studio
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    Ken OBanion said:

    And..., here's pull #2:

    7122 - Expressive Action Hand To Mouth
    4228 - Larian For Ninive 6
    270 - Platea Pergo Iray Addon
    6351 - Olympia 6 Hd Add-On

     

    Hmm....  Two Genesis 2 Females, a pose set for Victoria 4, and an environment.  Could it possibly get any more generic than that!?  And, in keeping with the theme...?

    I got nothin'.

    Two fashionistas walk past a women clad with red, yellow, blue, and green clothes.
    One of them says to the other - " I wouldn't be caught dead in those colours "
    The other replies - " But you could be reincarnated as a Scarlet Macaw "

    By

    Bunyip02 Bunyip02 April 2023 in Art Studio
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    And..., here's pull #2:

    7122 - Expressive Action Hand To Mouth
    4228 - Larian For Ninive 6
    270 - Platea Pergo Iray Addon
    6351 - Olympia 6 Hd Add-On

    Hmm....  Two Genesis 2 Females, a pose set for Victoria 4, and an environment.  Could it possibly get any more generic than that!?  And, in keeping with the theme...?

    I got nothin'.

    By

    Ken OBanion Ken OBanion April 2023 in Art Studio
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    Ken OBanion said:

    Anyway, here's my first pull:

    7654 - Treasured Trinkets (I have absolutely no clue what this is!)
    2238 - Victoria 7 Expression Set
    6162 - Besieged (Okay, this could get interesting...!)
    4018 - Apatosaurus (And, with that, I know exactly where I want to take this one!)

    Pray for me...!

    Finally!

    (I had to wait until my data plan renewed, when I have enough bandwidth to upload this beast!  Anybody remember when 128kb/sec was considered fast?)

    I finally figured out what that 'Treasured Trinkets' thingie is; it's a texture set for the V3 Fantasy Collar and accessories set.  Victoria 3!?  Seriously!?  But, I'm happy to report that there's still some life in the old girl yet!

     

    Also used:

    Ariana for Genesis 3 Female

    Chace Hair

    Andre for Genesis 3 Male

    Miles Hair for Genesis 3 Male

    Gregori Swimsuit

    Beach Vibes Outfit for Genesis 3 Male

    Nerdy Guy (Glasses)

    Wolf's Head Pendant

    Detective Poses and Props (Camera)

    Brandon for Genesis 2 Male (It really was the name of the character, I swear!)

    Brian Hair

    Ash (Genesis 2 Male)

    Drifter Hair

    Army Uniform for Genesis 2 Male (x2)

    T-Rex

    Victoria 3 (Yes, really!)

    Zullema (MAT and morphs for V3, a ShareCG freebie from a long, LONG time ago!)

    Annika Hair (another ShareCG freebie.  I think.  Hey, it's been a while!  Looks nice, though...)

    V3 Jane Dress (another ShareCG freebie from way back when)

    Dragon Tamer Spear (a Generation3-era prop from... somewhere!)

    EJ Drago for Genesis 2 Male

    Edric Hair

    Mighty Gianni outfit (believe it or not, I actually used half of it!)

    Tropical Cave

    Tropical Coast

    Tropical Plateau

    Tropical Quest

    Tropical Quest - Jungle

    Worlds of Fantasy Island Castle

    Inflatable Boat

    Wine Me!

    Happy Camper Essentials

     

    Tag: OBanion_01

    Title: The Romance Hasn't Died -- Yet

    "Only you, Harry!  Only you!  'A romantic getaway vacation, on a beautiful tropical island,' you said!  'What could possibly go wrong?' you said.  Unless you just neglected to mention that it was the Island of Doctor Moreau!"

    By

    Ken OBanion Ken OBanion April 2023 in Art Studio
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    Bunyip02 said:

    Draw # 3

    4958 - Courtly Intrigue Poses PoserCF, SKU:16497
    3643 - Dragonworld: Wildenlander, SKU:4170
    5912 - Logan, SKU:17492
    5138 - Aslan Court 1 Decor 1 Ps, SKU:16761

    Random numbers generated Apr 17 2023 at 16:24:49 by psychicscience.org  
    Free educational resources for parapsychology and psychical research.

    Stop Staring

    Ivan's wife - "Stop staring at that Elven wench - you might be back from the dead after escaping that Orc ambush but you'll wish they caught you if you keep staring at her !"

    Extras used -

    Aslan Court 1 - required
    Victoria 3 - required
    International Beauties Skin Texture 4
    Embrace-Hair
    Aiko 3
    A3 Dark Elf (Free) by Eden Evergreen
    Mulberry for A3
    A3 Warrior Class clothes
    A3 Caramella Hair
    Genesis 2M - required
    Wildenlander for G2M
    M4 Ivandri Hair AprilYSH converted to G2M

     

    By

    Bunyip02 Bunyip02 April 2023 in Art Studio
  • Good Magic Orb Products

    Not the ones from your examples but maybe interesting for you:

    https://www.daz3d.com/the-arcanist-props-and-poses-for-victoria-8-and-genesis-8-female

    By

    Hylas Hylas April 2023 in The Commons
  • Genesis 9 skin optimized for freckles?

    I struggle to get on board with Genesis 9. I bought the pre-release of Victoria 9 and it is downhill from there. Apart from the odd unisex figure, none of the Genesis 9 skins that came after Victoria 9 convinces me.

    Yesterday I bought MSO Dola because of the 8k PBR textures. Even tried adjusting translucency and so on. Still a doughy skin.

    With Victoria 9 being delivered with freckles and vitiligo skin, I wonder whether G9 skin is optimized for freckles, blemishes and so on, but less useful for "normal" skin?

    By

    alienarea alienarea April 2023 in The Commons
  • How can i possibly correct my lighting/translucency issue?

    Those are the Victoria 4 internal orgsns, which I assume you purchased here, and they will have been rendered in 3delight in Daz Studio or even in Poser.

    Do a render of the hearts, with everything else hidden, do a render of the figures, lit as you wish. plonk one on top of the other in an image editor and selectively erase/mask the top one to let the bottom one show through.

    By

    Richard Haseltine Richard Haseltine April 2023 in New Users
  • Geoshell Eye Builder affects everything except the eyes

    Recently started trying to use this: https://www.daz3d.com/geoshell-eye-builder-for-victoria-81

    Trying to apply any of the geoshells seems to apply the inverse of what it should be. The shell covers the whole torso, chest, neck and head, but not the face. I've tried using the prebuilt eyes and tried using the asset to build my own, both come out with the same result. Does anyone have experience working with this asset that could tell me what I'm doing wrong?

    By

    daepik1 daepik1 April 2023 in New Users
  • Julia 9 HD

    I'm less and less impressed with Julia. She seems to look best when mixed with Kaylee or Victoria, or as a guy.

    By

    Hylas Hylas April 2023 in The Commons
  • Julia 9 HD

    I've been playing a bit with her. Her out of the box body proportions aren't the best but with the teen body morph option for losing neck weight and the several options if you add the make-up and skins I think is a win win.

    1. Using the hair of the gamer bundle (I like her better with the Taylor hair shown in the promos) and some geoshells

     

     

    2. With that combo 50% Julia  50% Victoria. Teen Skin and some body morphs. A bit noisy, I was impatient. blush

     

     

     

     

    By

    carlosgimpera carlosgimpera April 2023 in The Commons
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest

    acb said:

    Pull #2

    4108 Raptor HD for Genesis 8.1 Male (SKU#86417)
    3907 Living Room Assets 01 (SKU#85267)
    456 Falling Down Poses for Genesis 8 Female and Victoria 8 (SKU#45677)
    3825 Kento 8.1 Add-On for MetaMixer (SKU#85010)

     "Brrrreaking News"

    You caught the true RRRR-spirit in this one - Well done!

    By

    Totte Totte April 2023 in Art Studio
  • * Closed * RRRR - "Back from the dead" Render Contest
    luci45 said:

    Pull #4

    5513 Tattoo Machine
    1207 DA Elijah 7 Eternal Poses
    65 99 DAZ Studio Props - The Office
    6258 Welding Cart

    Welcome back, Ken. Looks like you got a really nice first pull.

    I don't know if I'd call it "nice", but it is, as Totte noted, pretty much par for the course for me. It will be a real "blast from the past", that's for sure! That 'Treasured Trinkets' thingie? It's a texture set for the V3 Fantasy Collar! (Victoria 3!? Seriously!?) The order date was from back in 2011!

    By

    Ken OBanion Ken OBanion April 2023 in Art Studio
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