Poser users take note
Kalypso
Posts: 208
Seeing Predatron's sale I decided to get some poser-compatible items of his that I was missing. Once done with downloading I felt it best to back up his products and went in search for the original files from my product library. And that's when I was shocked to discover that I do not have access to the Poser files of products I bought years ago and they have been turned into DS/DSON only!
Specifically, the Cypress trees and Poppies which I had ordered on Sept 10, 2012 and which are in my Runtime in poser format are now available through my Product library as only DS/DSON files. I had thought that anything we buy will still be available for download but it seems some older products may be getting updated to omit Poser files (the reason for which I cannot fathom) and thus rendering parts of the product library useless for me since I still use Poser.
I will now have to go through endless pages and check to see what I don't have backed up hoping it is still available in the original Poser format I had bought it. I'm not sure if this is something the vendor requested or DAZ but in either case it is not acceptable for customers to be cut off from access to files they have bought in the past. I sincerely hope this was a mistake and expect it to be corrected.
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Comments
Please contact DAZ 3D through the support system to highlight this problem.
As a Poser-only user also...thanks for the heads up.
I think they are working on this issue as I have had several products that had only a single file updated over the previous months and weeks into a DS and a Poser version of the files.
The last one updated in my account was Serengeti, yesterday.
This is because it was a Platinum Club Item, and all the older products from the Platinum Club are being updated.
I say this because i don't want anyone to get the wrong idea. The updates you are seeing where a DS set has been added are mostly Platinum Club items.
This is because it was a Platinum Club Item, and all the older products from the Platinum Club are being updated.
I say this because i don't want anyone to get the wrong idea. The updates you are seeing where a DS set has been added are mostly Platinum Club items.
The problem here is the opposite to that. The original files included a Poser installer. Now some of them have a main installer and a PoserCF
There are several which have a main installer and a DS CF. but the two noted do not.
I submitted a ticket explaining the problem and hopefully the Poser files will be uploaded. Unfortunately I don't have time until the weekend to check other older products that I had failed to back up but if I find more I will notify support again. Just wanted to let other Poser users know in case they ever need to back up their purchases.
Just an update for any Poser users still following this. Today I got a reply from support basically telling me that the older installers were not re-packed with the original Poser content and the zips available now are only for DS and DSON. This is unacceptable since I had relied on the product library and no mention was ever made that we should back up or risk losing Poser files.
Lesson learned. Let's just hope this has not happened to many products but even so it is highly unprofessional.
This will impact Carrara users as well. Older products pz2 files work in Carrara DSA do not.
This if true is really alarming for me as I use Carrara 8.1 still as well as 8.5 for many reasons and know some C7 users who will be most unhappy
I also use Poser as well as DAZ studio.
I have suspected DIM of removing files before and now am thinking I may need to rethink just relying on it blindly.
This is disturbing. i don't use and will never use DIM, so not sure how/if this affects me yet. Even though i am primarily a DS user, i still have 3 versions of Poser installed up to the latest and have multiple poser runtimes that i use in DS also.
If you originally bought Poser files the poser files should remain available as that was what was actually bought. If they choose to add DS files that is wonderful but they shouldn't remove the poser files after the purchase.
I'm not happen with the way it overwrites the different versions of DS. I didn't realise this until too late and now found that I can't go back to an earlier more stable version as I'm having a problem with crashing when I use the weight mapping tool. I do however like the ability to use it to download and install products...especially when you have bought a lot of items.
Very annoying, really. I have tons of items and I do not have all of them backed up...
I completely agree with what you say, Kalypso...
...can you go to the the items from your Product Library and do a manual download? i checked a couple of the items recently updated I have (don't have the two you mentioned) and you could still DL the PS/PoserCF versions.
No, this is the problem. The files available for download now are just DS/DSON. None of the original Poser files (geometries, pp2) are available for download any more. Like I told support I can repackage them from my Runtime and back them up but what's the point of having a product library then? They told me the files are usable in Poser with DSON but the issue I'm having is that the original files were Poser format usable in Poser without DSON. The .pp2s included in the Poser companion files now just call on the python script for DSON, no geometry that Poser recognizes is included any more.
I think I'll just get a new HD and back up my entire Runtime. At least I'm pretty sure I have backed up the items I didn't install upon buying.
I understand vendors switching from Poser support to DS only because of the hassle involved to support both platforms and maybe Poser-only users are a small percentage of customers at DAZ these days. I appreciate and try to support as much as I can those that do continue to put out Poser content. But what I can't get is why a vendor who used to support Poser a few years ago and even still does on occasion would have his product updated to cancel that support as in the case of the poppies and cypress trees. When I bought them in 2012 they were in Poser format and possibly DS (I don't remember as I don't download those installers) and now they are only DS/DSON. Why drop support after you had already gone to the trouble to make the product Poser compatible?
...even the manual downloads? That isn't good.
...maybe it's good I still have a lot of content with the old .exe installers backed up as I also dabble in Carrara.
Wow.. This is just.. rich
Fortunately I have all my content backed up
I can't tell if this is just a poor management decision or a deliberate attempt at pushing Poser users even further away..
DSON will never get anywhere near my Poser install ever again, all it ever did was create conflicts. Nowadays, all I shop are old items (and the occasional new set from Jack Tomalin, THANK YOU for still being Poser friendly!!), and if they are being converted to DSON only, I guess that is just another reason to stop shopping here completely!
What's the difference technically, other than DSON being incompatible with older versions of Poser?
What's the difference technically, other than DSON being incompatible with older versions of Poser?
I don't know or care. I'm just hoping that someone who knows what's happening will eventually see this and realize it's a mistake that needs to be fixed since I suspect support does not really understand the issue. I don't believe it was intentional as it makes absolutely no sense.
I have emailed Predatron and asked him to come to this thread.
There are people who still use older versions of Poser too would you believe, some cannot run newer stuff on their WinXP computers.
(not me I started with Vista which everything hates but I have thought of putting P7 back on my laptop for dabbling while the Win7 Desktop is busy and that little laptop cannot run DS4.anything!!)
The thing is why remove functionability where it existed before, by all means update and add to stuff but please do not make it incompatible for users of older software including earlier versions of DAZ studio too, some actually use D|S 2 too and Carrara.
Adding my voice to this also...please do not exclude Poser ONLY versions of our already purchased products. In the event I have a corrupted file and need to re-download they will become useless to me. I use only Poser...no DSON. Thank you! Dani
Oh please, no DSON-only files in my older products, thank you very much. Because I mainly use Poser, with occasional forays into Studio. Which is fine for the newer Genesis and Genesis 2 stuff, even so I like to get as much of that working in both programs whenever possible. Losing Poser compatibility with older products that I bought and still want to use ... well that would suck royally and not in a fun fashion either. :-(
I really hope that this is just a fluke or an error in communication... But being that I don't see anyone officially refuting this, I'm quite worried...
Forcing people to choose, especially long time customers, is always a very bad idea.
Say No to DSON only.
...I currently have PP 2010 as well as Carrara 8.5. I gave up trying to use Genesis/G2 in them which really kills the usefulness. Particularly so with PP2010 in which I use the cloth room since Daz dynamics are "closed ended" to specific clothing content created with Optitex Software (which none of us could ever afford).
I have no issue with Gen 4/Gen 3 characters in either application however that doesn't help with cloth dynamics for Genesis/G2 or importing my Genesis/G2 characters into Carrara settings. Until Daz actually gets it's own cloth dynamics engine, PoserPro will still be a major part of my toolbox.
Is this why I couldn't get Predatron's poppies to appear in Carrara? (I must admit I didn't spend a lot of time investigating). I suppose I still have the option of exporting an obj from Studio and importing it, but that's a PITA, especially considering Carrara is a Daz product. Maybe I should dig a little further and raise a ticket.
Yes. I too hope it is an error in communication or a fluke. I spent thousands of dollars on Poser content here, and although I have the vast majority of the installers and zips downloaded on an external drive, it's just one backup drive. Having lost a hard drive in 2010 and most of the data off one external backup and quite a bit of data off the second external backup, I'd hate to find the Poser installers and zips of content I purchased no longer exists to download.
DSON isn't a feasible solution for me either. Won't get into the whys that is. It's been addressed enough times by enough people. It's why I don't buy any product that doesn't provide a Poser Core Installer. The one product I did buy intending to convert to Poser obj format didn't work out all that well for me. Documentation had not been updated, and too much had changed between versions for the instructions to work, so the product was never usable in Poser. It looked to be such a lovely product too.
Though I purchase a bare fraction now of what I once spent a month here, I do still purchase Poser environmental/architectural products if it comes with a Poser Core Installer. If this is a policy change and not a mistake, I can't take the risk of purchasing content that may not be available at a later date to redownload.
I'll explain it with an analogy: Imagine you bought a book in English from Amazon, then they retracted that version and gave you one in Spanish and told you to use Google Translate to read it. Sure, it works, for a given value of 'work'
(the technical difference simplified is that unlike native Poser files that Poser can read directly, DSON is a script that 'translates' DS files for Poser, often causing freezes, lag, and in my case, script errors galore)
I'll explain it with an analogy: Imagine you bought a book in English from Amazon, then they retracted that version and gave you one in Spanish and told you to use Google Translate to read it. Sure, it works, for a given value of 'work'
(the technical difference simplified is that unlike native Poser files that Poser can read directly, DSON is a script that 'translates' DS files for Poser, often causing freezes, lag, and in my case, script errors galore)
OK, thanks. No that's not good. Haven't used DSON much so far but intend to, so I too hope that this gets solved.
That is inacceptable! Thank you for the warning!!!
I am not a Poser user. This is completely unacceptable though. We have been assured over and over that all products we purchase will always be available for re-download. DAZ needs to remedy this immediately.