G8 figures so much harder to render than G2 or G3

My 3D Spin

Why is it that G8 figures are so much harder to render than G2 or G3. Are they using new techniques that
are more advanced? Even G2 figures with detailed skin are so much easier.
 

DustRider

I'm guessing your using Iray to render, and that by "harder" you mean it takes longer to converge. With those assumptions, the answer is many G8 figures use the dual lobe specular shader (introduced with G8F/V8), which takes longer to render/converge than the previous version used with G3. It provides a bit more realistic skin than the previous shader (this is subject to opinion), but that also means it takes longer to converge because of the additional samples/light bounces needed to refine the additional SSS information ..... at least that's the way I understand what the shader does, I sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong. Regardless, it is the new shader that is the primary cause of the increased render times with most G8 figures.

My 3D Spin

DustRider said:

I'm guessing your using Iray to render, and that by "harder" you mean it takes longer to converge. With those assumptions, the answer is many G8 figures use the dual lobe specular shader (introduced with G8F/V8), which takes longer to render/converge than the previous version used with G3. It provides a bit more realistic skin than the previous shader (this is subject to opinion), but that also means it takes longer to converge because of the additional samples/light bounces needed to refine the additional SSS information ..... at least that's the way I understand what the shader does, I sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong. Regardless, it is the new shader that is the primary cause of the increased render times with most G8 figures.

Its not only the Render time is also about how many actors you can place in a scene before the computer totaly gets messed up.

Paintbox

My 3D Spin said:

Its not only the Render time is also about how many actors you can place in a scene before the computer totaly gets messed up. 

By "the computer gets totally messed up" you probably mean in goes to CPU rendering. This is because G8 character also tend to have a bit memory requirement. Reducing textures with multiple characters is best. When you initialize the render, just before the iterations begin, you see the values of the memory requirements and if you are rendering CPU or GPU. Something like Scene Optimizer is great if that is the case.

My 3D Spin

Paintbox said:

My 3D Spin said:

DustRider said:

Its not only the Render time is also about how many actors you can place in a scene before the computer totaly gets messed up.
 

By "the computer gets totally messed up" you probably mean in goes to CPU rendering. This is because G8 character also tend to have a bit memory requirement. Reducing textures with multiple characters is best. When you initialize the render, just before the iterations begin, you see the values of the memory requirements and if you are rendering CPU or GPU. Something like Scene Optimizer is great if that is the case.

Ok. Thank you - The Scene optimizer tool lokks like a good idea

DustRider

My 3D Spin said:

DustRider said:

I'm guessing your using Iray to render, and that by "harder" you mean it takes longer to converge. With those assumptions, the answer is many G8 figures use the dual lobe specular shader (introduced with G8F/V8), which takes longer to render/converge than the previous version used with G3. It provides a bit more realistic skin than the previous shader (this is subject to opinion), but that also means it takes longer to converge because of the additional samples/light bounces needed to refine the additional SSS information ..... at least that's the way I understand what the shader does, I sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong. Regardless, it is the new shader that is the primary cause of the increased render times with most G8 figures.

Its not only the Render time is also about how many actors you can place in a scene before the computer totaly gets messed up.

Ahh .... Yes the tool that Paintbox noted should help for larger scenes. Genesis 8 figures typically use more texture maps than G3 and G2, so G8 will typically use more GPU memory for each character. HD characters will use more memory as well, because the figure is being subdivided (more polygons) the get the needed HD detail (you can reduce the number of subdivisions to make the figure use less memory, but you will also lose the HD details). 

My 3D Spin

DustRider said:

My 3D Spin said:

DustRider said:

I'm guessing your using Iray to render, and that by "harder" you mean it takes longer to converge. With those assumptions, the answer is many G8 figures use the dual lobe specular shader (introduced with G8F/V8), which takes longer to render/converge than the previous version used with G3. It provides a bit more realistic skin than the previous shader (this is subject to opinion), but that also means it takes longer to converge because of the additional samples/light bounces needed to refine the additional SSS information ..... at least that's the way I understand what the shader does, I sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong. Regardless, it is the new shader that is the primary cause of the increased render times with most G8 figures.

Its not only the Render time is also about how many actors you can place in a scene before the computer totaly gets messed up.

Ahh .... Yes the tool that Paintbox noted should help for larger scenes. Genesis 8 figures typically use more texture maps than G3 and G2, so G8 will typically use more GPU memory for each character. HD characters will use more memory as well, because the figure is being subdivided (more polygons) the get the needed HD detail (you can reduce the number of subdivisions to make the figure use less memory, but you will also lose the HD details).

How do i reduce the Sub divisions?

frankrblow

Try deleting all the eyelashes from your G8 fiures and see how much faster those scenes render. The lashes really slow things down, and hog memory, too.

DustRider

My 3D Spin said:

DustRider said:

My 3D Spin said:

DustRider said:

I'm guessing your using Iray to render, and that by "harder" you mean it takes longer to converge. With those assumptions, the answer is many G8 figures use the dual lobe specular shader (introduced with G8F/V8), which takes longer to render/converge than the previous version used with G3. It provides a bit more realistic skin than the previous shader (this is subject to opinion), but that also means it takes longer to converge because of the additional samples/light bounces needed to refine the additional SSS information ..... at least that's the way I understand what the shader does, I sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong. Regardless, it is the new shader that is the primary cause of the increased render times with most G8 figures.

Its not only the Render time is also about how many actors you can place in a scene before the computer totaly gets messed up.

Ahh .... Yes the tool that Paintbox noted should help for larger scenes. Genesis 8 figures typically use more texture maps than G3 and G2, so G8 will typically use more GPU memory for each character. HD characters will use more memory as well, because the figure is being subdivided (more polygons) the get the needed HD detail (you can reduce the number of subdivisions to make the figure use less memory, but you will also lose the HD details).

How do i reduce the Sub divisions?

Go to the parameters tab, with you figure selected as shown here and reduce the number in "Render SubDivision Level":

Some props and outfits and figures that use displacement maps will have subdivisions set up in the surfaces. You can change that subdivision by selecting the proper material in the surfaces tab shown here "SubD Displacement Level":

Hope this helps!

Try deleting all the eyelashes from your G8 fiures and see how much faster those scenes render. The lashes really slow things down, and hog memory, too.

Hmm, interesting. I never really noticed that, but I have noticed that they look a bit odd without lashes while testing out V8 when G8F was first released 

My 3D Spin

I tried changing the Sub D Level on two figures from 4 to 2 on 2 HD G8 figures. They where still much harder ro Iray
preview and Render than G3 and G2 figures.

My 3D Spin

Why dosent artists consider keeping up with the technology of Render engines instead of making 
figures that are hard on most PC.s. Many G2 and G3 figures are HD and have very realistic skin
but is still easy on the Iray preview and Rendering.
 

I am very hesistant now with buying any G8 figures..

Richard Haseltine

What happens if you take a Genesis 3 figuer adna ply Genessi 8 materials, and vice versa? That would help to determine which was the root of your issue - though if it's the materials that would suggest that it is precisely keeping up with the technology of the render engines that is involved.

My 3D Spin

So, i had a Scene with a G2 and a G3 Figure in an Envirorment and it worked perfectly. Fast preview and
then fast Render. I then delete the G2 figure and load a G8 to the same Scene. I then change the HD to
Base figure and change the Sub D level from 2 to 1 on the G8. The Scene becomes Unresposvie with every turn
i make. If i move a figure Daz becomes unresponsive for several minutes. If i render the render window
become unresponsive etc.  In task manager my Disc goes straight up to 100% and stays there a long time.
Even after i close DAZ.

My 3D Spin

Richard Haseltine said:

What happens if you take a Genesis 3 figuer adna ply Genessi 8 materials, and vice versa? That would help to determine which was the root of your issue - though if it's the materials that would suggest that it is precisely keeping up with the technology of the render engines that is involved.

I applied the skin from a G8 to a G3 and that worked fine. 

Seven193

If Genesis 2 uses 2k textures, and Genesis 8 uses 4k textures, then of course your computer will be more responsive rendering G2 figures.