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DAZ Productions, Inc.
224 S 200 W, Suite #250
Salt Lake City, UT 84101
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© 2024 Daz Productions Inc. All Rights Reserved.Daz 3D is part of
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DAZ Productions, Inc.
224 S 200 W, Suite #250
Salt Lake City, UT 84101
Licensing Agreement | Terms of Service | Privacy Policy | EULA
© 2024 Daz Productions Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Comments
Well if everybody did it I think it would.
No you end up with a situation where the various stores are still trying to undercut each other, Stores have offers along the lines of "If you can find it cheaper elsewhere we will refund the difference" and such like. Prices do keep dropping for a while, but so does quality. You get hidden price increases, such as a reduction in the amount of content in a product, packs get smaller but this is not announced. Eventually you end up with a large amount of "discount" stores and a few who charge more, but supply quality products. THen of course the next move is that the prices in the cheaper stores start increasing slowly, but without any change in the quality. Eventually you will be paying more for less without realising it.
I wonder if the vendors feel the same way, I have seen posts from vendors expressing opposite sentiments than these, presumably they are just sops to get our money - or was the post directed personally at me.
So true and i am fine with it.
It's not personal. That's the whole point. Of course a vendor is gonna faff and koo at you. They'd be silly not to. They want people to like them because as an extension of that you might just end up buying something. It's professional courtesy. It's the guy behind the counter at Wallmart asking you how your day was.
Of course people might now believe that I'm trying to say everyone who runs a business is a cold hear-ted faking monster. Not at all. They're pretty decent for a bunch of capitalists in fact. But don't kid yourself that you're any more special to them than the sound your money makes when it rolls into their pocket. Every product includes some basic support because they want you to buy their next product too. It's not good and it's not evil, it's just business. Knowing this for what it is can be quite liberating because you learn to make purchase choices not based on honeyed words but on quality and value for money. They want my money and I want quality and that's what makes the world go round. ;)
I am quite aware that business is to make money but you have just painted the vendors and staff here as a bunch of coldhearted bloodsuckers, and personally I don't think thats fair especially as alot of them claim to not do it for the money but because they enjoy it.
I would hope that Daz and those who work or represent the company do have some respect for this community especially considering how its the community that help the new comers and therefore help the business flourish.
I have to wonder if you believe vendors are somehow less than human. That if our work is rejected or appreciate that we have no feelings about it. The reality is that most of us are striving diligently to try and please people. Yes, in part because our income depends on it but also in part because most art is created to appeal to someone on some level and an industry like this will not appeal to people who are not at least partly driven by that need. It is unlikely many people go into this industry and stay in this industry any length of time if they have no interest in having people approve of their work.
I read Harry's post, and I'm wondering why there's such a visceral reaction to it... it seems to be the common "wisdom" where I live... even though it's completely wrong.
I have to take issue with is the notion that business is not personal.
The idea that Business an impersonal affair is a very Marxist notion designed to make collectivism more appealing.
Business people, in my experience, want very long term relationships with clients. Yes it's about earning a living, but it's also about delivering good service. This is the foundation of Enlightened Self Interest.
The best products on the market are those that have effort invested in them by the producer and the seller. DAZ, in my opinion, epitomizes this. It's a huge reason why, after so many years (and Zygote before them) I am still coming back. I like the product they produce and I like the effort they put into making that product the best it can be. They've gone from being a back-water outfit producing models for hobbyists reviled by those in the profession to producing the single most advanced Commercially marketed figure there is. I'd give an example of an impersonal business but I don't want to start a flame war.... r...
Business is very personal. Anyone who treats it as an impersonal affair will not enjoy success for terribly long without making many enemies (which also ends up being personal...)
Are you under the impression that we have much in the way of capital goods? I suspect 90% of the content providers out there work at home with one or two computers and a half decent chair. The only real solid capital that we poses is human capital and that is limited to 1 or 2 people in almost all cases and the only increase in value to our "companies" is via sweat equity. Admittedly we are given the free choice of what we do with out lives work wise and that is true of capitalist systems but it is also true of other social systems as evidenced by the fact that not all content creators are American or live in capitalist countries.
Well if everybody did it I think it would.
No you end up with a situation where the various stores are still trying to undercut each other, Stores have offers along the lines of "If you can find it cheaper elsewhere we will refund the difference" and such like. Prices do keep dropping for a while, but so does quality. You get hidden price increases, such as a reduction in the amount of content in a product, packs get smaller but this is not announced. Eventually you end up with a large amount of "discount" stores and a few who charge more, but supply quality products. THen of course the next move is that the prices in the cheaper stores start increasing slowly, but without any change in the quality. Eventually you will be paying more for less without realising it.
But all that is already happening now, at least where I am, except for the last part perhaps.
I think the main reason for all this is that the majority - both sellers and buyers - always want as much as possible for as little as possible. If everyone would agree on paying a reasonable price for everything, i.e. a price that reflects the costs and the amount of work involved in producing something, things would work better.
Making money is part of it, but it's just as important to offer a good service or a good product, not because you have to or otherwise you won't sell anything, but as an ideal. When making money becomes the only ideal we end up where we are now, with a collapsing world economy.
Perhaps capitalist means something other than what I thought it meant. Most westerners are capitalists (including myself) as that is the economic system we are using. And my point was definitely not that any specific group is worse than another. Sheesh. I'm saying consumers are too often emotionally attached to a product when the creator of the product often don't even know their name and most likely don't care what their name is anyway. They post all this emotional stuff about how unfair they are being treated and how they demand justice to be served. They have a right to do this of course. I'm just saying they're wasting their breath. Of course I might be wrong and all vendors lie awake at night worrying about the fact that one Joe Smith of Somewhere wants to stop shopping here because they didn't check out a sale item when they had the chance.
Are you under the impression that we have much in the way of capital goods? I suspect 90% of the content providers out there work at home with one or two computers and a half decent chair. The only real solid capital that we poses is human capital and that is limited to 1 or 2 people in almost all cases and the only increase in value to our "companies" is via sweat equity. Admittedly we are given the free choice of what we do with out lives work wise and that is true of capitalist systems but it is also true of other social systems as evidenced by the fact that not all content creators are American or live in capitalist countries.
Heh. I just applied for local business licenses so I can open my own site in addition to my brokering at DAZ and Rendo. I had to describe my square footage used for business. It's around 27 sq. ft. because my workstation is 5' x 5'5" in my bedroom in a shared apartment.
My capital for this business consists of two computers, one laptop, this old chair, and my... I'm female so let's say "courage." ;) I don't do this job just for the love (it has to support me and two cats), but I sure do love this job.
Miss SickleYield you are my favourite capitalist in the whole wide world!
Now give me a discount so I can buy some more stuff from your store!
:lol:
Flattery will get you emoticons, you naughty fellow, that's about it. :D ;) :o
Lol. I'll probably end up being charged for the emoticons too. :lol:
The creator of a product doesn't have to care about the name of the guy who bought his or her product so long as he or she cares about the product itself.
The smart ones will give decent service when there are issues with a product and make a solid attempt to rectify them. The motivation is that the producer gets a reputation that not only keeps people coming back, but gets spread.
What is interesting is that most often what I see described about capitalists not caring about clients applies far more to the government worker.
I pretty much live at the public library. Except for two librarians, all of them are impersonal and treat library patrons with some level of disdain. I see this at the DMV, City Hall, the County Court House, the Federal Building... they are secure in their jobs because most of us have to deal directly with them at some point. In business, people have options. There is Poser, DAZ Studio and iClone. There are a bunch of choices for 3D Figures out there... (well... there is Genesis, and the rest at various levels of obsolescense....) The point is, we all have choices. Consumers go where they get the best value first, and stay when they are well treated.
You had to buy a business license to start a website????????????????
You had to buy a business license to start a website????????????????
In my city and state, and when that site is for the purpose of making money, absolutely. You don't have to get a license to start a site talking about your cats or sharing recipes, I don't think.
It makes sense though. You're still operating a business even though your customers are spread across the globe and how would the government get their cut if you didn't declare this? I don't think it would be fun being locked up for tax evasion. :lol:
I know we pay taxes out our butt on what we make here
I'd ignore it and make them come to me, at which point I'd tell them I work out of a PO Box in Nevada.
I'll bet you do! :(
Are you bragging or complaining Frank?
Lol, just teasing. ;)
Complaining cause I have to pay 15% more in taxes then your average person for being self employed.
Well, you have to admit, being self employed you are part of the 1% rich elite who is supposed to spoon feed, cloth and house the rest of us :)
and when you go shopping for my shoes, don't forget I want the new air jordans!
I hear you. That's a global thing though. It's as if governments all over the world got together at some point and said 'All people who owns a business must be rich and should therefore pay super super tax'.
High level employees also get punished this way. I pay 25% tax on my income. That's one quarter of my pay check gone every month. But then again, welcome to Africa. Lol. :lol:
In the U.S. it's 35%, and that's not counting State income tax, that's only the federal level.
Ultimately, [edit for clarification: as a customer,] what's the difference between the vendor who gives you good service and personal attention because s/he thinks it will improve the bottom line, and the vendor who gives you good service and personal attention because s/he cares about you?
For the most part, PAs* seem to be a friendly and helpful bunch, and seem to value relationships they build here and on other sites. Maybe for some the value is more social and for some the value is more economic in nature, but I'd imagine that generally it's a mix of both. If someone is only in it to make a profit, then (with a few exceptions, if any) I think they'll soon find more lucrative opportunities outside of our little corner of the market. I certainly prefer to assume that the motivations aren't entirely financial.
Personally I do prefer to buy from PAs who do things like contribute to the forums, sponsor contests, and make freebies. I even go into sales sometimes thinking, "Okay, I'll buy something from vendors X, Y, and Z, and then see if there's any cash left for other things..." So there probably is some economic incentive to do these things, in addition to the social benefits of contributing to the community.
*Of course there are a number of PAs who aren't too active on the forum, and given the negative tone that exists around here sometimes, I can't say I blame them...
Oh, and yes the thread title should be changed...though the original title certainly got the attention of a number of vendors!
I can give you a third reason: because in giving good service the vendor might learn something that will give his or her next product better value... and that happens more often than not. Personal service improves the bottom line always. That's the beauty of it... being nice means more money? Really?
That kinda aces my ability to be in business simply because I'm so grouchy... :P