Digital Art Zone

Richard Haseltine - 05 November 2012 01:32 PM

nowefg - 05 November 2012 09:41 AM

I got as far as ctrl/double click on HSS, and the texture does apply, but the eyes show white, and render like that. I reapplied the original eye texture, and still there was a white area along the upper edge of the lower eyelid, to the tear duct.

The problem is that the eye surface and tear materials are set to be transparent but to catch specular highlights. When you apply HSS the opacity reverts to 100%. Ideally you would exclude those materials, since they are already doing their job and don’t need the SSS or other features that HSS brings. If you go to the Surfaces pane and expand the list of surfaces unbder the figure you can ctrl-click (cmd-click for a Mac0 to deselect the eye surface and tear areas.

Thanks, Richard,

I had some trouble finding the surfaces list to exclude from. I’ll go for it again, being careful, this time, (per my last post).

Jaderail - 05 November 2012 12:47 PM

Omnifreaker is the one who said Uber Surface Shader was the more advanced and preferred version. It was discussed at length on the old forums. Human Surface and Simple Surface are part of the install for people who feel that they do all that is needed in their images. To get better results with Uber Surface you do need to learn how to tweak the settings that have been added. USS does read all the settings for the other shaders, talks to 3Delight better and provides more settings to get your surfaces to look even better.

I has just suggesting this, why bother with HSS (EHSS but not Elite any longer) when the newer USS does the same job and more. If I’m going to take the time to learn something I’m going to learn the newest and best if I have access to it. I did not mean to confuse anyone.

There was an involved threat about this where it was shown that UberSurface and UberSurface2 do *not* do the same job and more as EHSS. I had posted a picture of Tamesis that used HSS and was unable to get the same results using US2, neither was anyone involved in the discussion and it was a pretty sophisticated crowd where we got pretty deep in the details of the different shader settings. Their are fundamental differences. US2 has more ‘options’ but those do not just ‘stack’ on the HSS ones as one might think.

After much playing, *no one* was able to get back some of the detail that got lost in US2 from the EHSS version (rendered in UE2.)

That is not to say that US2 doesn’t have some very nice advanced features beyond what is available in EHSS, nor that someone might not be able to get the results desired in US2. However, *it is not as simple as ctl+click on the texture* as some might think. Far from it.

If one reads what Omnifreaker said, he did as someone pointed out to me in the thread, mention that he totally rewrote certain aspects of the shader from HSS/EHSS to UberSurface and therefore the settings do not directly translate.

Gedd - 05 November 2012 02:44 PM

Jaderail - 05 November 2012 12:47 PM

Omnifreaker is the one who said Uber Surface Shader was the more advanced and preferred version. It was discussed at length on the old forums. Human Surface and Simple Surface are part of the install for people who feel that they do all that is needed in their images. To get better results with Uber Surface you do need to learn how to tweak the settings that have been added. USS does read all the settings for the other shaders, talks to 3Delight better and provides more settings to get your surfaces to look even better.

I has just suggesting this, why bother with HSS (EHSS but not Elite any longer) when the newer USS does the same job and more. If I’m going to take the time to learn something I’m going to learn the newest and best if I have access to it. I did not mean to confuse anyone.

There was an involved threat about this where it was shown that UberSurface and UberSurface2 do *not* do the same job and more as EHSS. I had posted a picture of Tamesis that used HSS and was unable to get the same results using US2, neither was anyone involved in the discussion and it was a pretty sophisticated crowd where we got pretty deep in the details of the different shader settings. Their are fundamental differences. US2 has more ‘options’ but those do not just ‘stack’ on the HSS ones as one might think.

After much playing, *no one* was able to get back some of the detail that got lost in US2 from the EHSS version (rendered in UE2.)

That is not to say that US2 doesn’t have some very nice advanced features beyond what is available in EHSS, nor that someone might not be able to get the results desired in US2. However, *it is not as simple as ctl+click on the texture* as some might think. Far from it.

If one reads what Omnifreaker said, he did as someone pointed out to me in the thread, mention that he totally rewrote certain aspects of the shader from HSS/EHSS to UberSurface and therefore the settings do not directly translate.

Thank you for the correction Gedd. I got lost when things got deep and I was still a Semi New User at the time. I was more than bit lost at the time and am still not good enough to get good results from any of the shaders. I’m sorry I spread my wrong understanding. I now have better info and will provide it to other users in the future. You have helped me and I thank you for that.

Once again I’m sorry I posted info I was not sure about. I was trying to be helpful, now I have better info and will do better in the future.

Nothing to be sorry about, I’m sure I could have put it better. I was frustrated at the misunderstanding that confused me at the time and simply wanted to save anyone else from going through the involved process to discover this. They are all good products and have their place. You help a lot of people Jaderail, don’t ever feel bad for that. I have learned a lot from your posts. One thing I continually work on is trying to not let my frustration to a situation come across as frustration with a person, or even a particular thing being said (rather then the larger ‘context.’)

I second Gedd, on that. Thanks to all the contributors that help move the learning forward.

Meanwhile, I’ve been exploring the settings on the surfaces tab, for Elite Marie in HSS, USS, and DS Default.

The setting changes I used were recommended as starting points in Kraig Hausman’s article on EHSS, and, thanks to everyone’s how-to help, the results are fruitful and interesting.

Not having made note of the original settings before making the changes, though, I’m wondering if there is way to restore the Surfaces tab settings to their “default” condition. I can’t seem to get back to my original “wrong” settings, to document the findings from square one.

I should point out, one can ‘upgrade’ an HSS/EHSS texture to UberSurface/UberSurface2 and it might give much better results. It all depends on the particular texture. In a nutshell, what I found with the Tamisis texture is that moving to US blurred out some of the detail and I couldn’t get it back even with much playing (Someone might, just none of us could.) Other textures this might not be the case. It’s one of those “you’re mileage may vary” types of things. Ubersurface does offer some features not available in HSS/EHSS as Jadrail pointed out, so it’s worth playing with if one wants to get the most out of a particular character they’re working with. All of this goes out the window I believe if one steps outside 3Dlight renderer to something like Cycles or Octane (or that L one ;p.)