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How do I transfer ‘loose’ fitting clothing?
Posted: 28 September 2012 03:40 PM   [ Ignore ]
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OK… here is an image. On the left is before along with the settings I ‘normally’ use in the transfer utility. I want to to be a loose shirt. It messes up in lots of places but most obviously under the breasts. I have tried about a dozen different things and just don’t seem to be landing on what group of settings I need to use.

Thanks!

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Posted: 28 September 2012 09:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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After you run the transfer utility, select the clothign in the scene tab, go to the options menu on the same tab (upper right of each tab) and go down to edit and choose Apply Smoothing Modifier.  That should hopefully take care of it.

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Posted: 28 September 2012 09:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Yeah, that is my normal procedure, but with this it just gets worse after adding subd and smoothing. I’ve tried most of the projection templates and am not getting anywhere.

I’m seeing some oddities in the projection template area in 4.5. I have duplicates of ‘tight’ and no loose under a number of them, like shirt.

I tried dress knee length… same thing. Bodysuit loose seemed to create an entirely new mesh and I lost about half of my materials in the process.

I did build this over Genesis basic female, like I’ve done many other items. You can see I used the current setting on the source. It’s like the magnetization or whatever you want to call it is reaching out and grabbing the mesh and pulling it in no matter what I try. I’ve done a lot of tight fitting items and get along fine with them but…. no luck with this so far. I may have to start over and build a mesh that fits and then add thickness and pull the outer layer to be loose. Anyway, I was hoping there was something I was missing. I suppose there is always the bones method, but I’m not very good at that yet. My skull seems too thick over in that area. wink

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Posted: 28 September 2012 10:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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OK.. Figures that this was the first loose item I had done and had this problem. Something must be acting up with my mesh. I just made a 5 minute dress… LOL… Please don’t pick on it… and here is a before and after image.

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Posted: 28 September 2012 11:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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Hi dumorian…

dumorian - 28 September 2012 09:55 PM

I’m seeing some oddities in the projection template area in 4.5. I have duplicates of ‘tight’ and no loose under a number of them, like shirt.

I tried dress knee length… same thing. Bodysuit loose seemed to create an entirely new mesh and I lost about half of my materials in the process

The reason you have duplicate templates is that you have both the old .dsf and the new .duf projection templates in the Projection Templates folder
data/DAZ 3D/Genesis/Base/Projection Templates/

They re-did the templates and renamed some of them. Just delete the .dsf templates.

This is what you should have -

Bodysuit /Loose.duf
          /Tight.duf

Boots /BootsThigh.duf

Dress /Knee Length.duf

Gloves /Tight.duf

Hair /Long.duf
      /Short.duf

Pants /Loose.duf
      /Tight.duf

Shirt /Tight.duf

Skirt /Knee Length.duf

The Dress Knee Length template is a tight upper body suit and that’s why your loose dress shrinks down around the torso.

Body Suit Loose is like a pair of over-sized coveralls and will distort the skirt part.

Have you tried with “no” projection template?

Hope this helps… smile

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Posted: 28 September 2012 11:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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Thank You! I ridded myself of those projection dufs and all is well on the duplicates.

I am only at about the 6 month stage with Daz…so still green. Anyway, I normally start off with just what I show in the first image above. No projection. Then, ‘if’ there is merit to using one, for instance a long dress, I will see if I really need it.

I forgot that I had another shirt laying around on a laptop, so I grabbed it in one of its med poly stages and just started over. Something was acting up with that mesh as I have tried other things as well and am not having the same issue. That first mesh was fairly hi poly and has a complete interior mesh as well, so was becoming a bear to deal with. It was just easier to start with what I had and I’m almost back to where I was in less than an hour. And I do have a mesh that does transfer like it should. smile I really don’t want to go back to ‘exactly’ where I was. wink

Again, thanks… good info there and thanks for your time looking those files up and listing them.

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Posted: 28 September 2012 11:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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Hi… you very welcome, it’s my pleasure to help others when I can… smile

Anyway, I normally start off with just what I show in the first image above. No projection.

Doh… shut eye  Maybe I need glasses, oh wait I already wear them… cool grin  LOL

I forgot that I had another shirt laying around on a laptop, so I grabbed it in one of its med poly stages and just started over. Something was acting up with that mesh as I have tried other things as well and am not having the same issue. That first mesh was fairly hi poly and has a complete interior mesh as well, so was becoming a bear to deal with. It was just easier to start with what I had and I’m almost back to where I was in less than an hour. And I do have a mesh that does transfer like it should.

Okay, that ‘interior’ mesh could have been causing problems. When modeling, anything you don’t want to be ‘tight’ make sure you leave sufficient space between the mesh layers so that the transfer utility and/or projection templates doesn’t shrink it to much. Also after using the transfer utility it is generally best to go in and adjust the weight maps using the weight brush and the smooth brush to even out some of those mesh distortions.

Again, thanks… good info there and thanks for your time looking those files up and listing them.

No trouble at all since I posted them previously a few weeks ago… grin

Have fun…

nicci… smile

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Posted: 29 September 2012 12:17 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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Well… I just added one more level of smoothing on my Hex mesh and the same thing started happening. This one is still in single layer mesh. What I’m seeing is when my mesh approaches the same grid size… resolution… whatever you call it… surface per cm?... this starts happening.

Now, IIRC, Daz 4 had the smoothing iterations set to like 10 or 15 by default. 4.5 I think is at 2 by default. I increased that to 15 to 20 and things came back into shape. Yes, I try to get by with minimum settings as I expect the higher this is set, the more computing power it uses?

So, when I get my item finished, it looks like I will need to run off into my land of frustration… weight mapping! ohh

I have gotten pretty good with materials, textures and bumpmaps… Pretty decent with modeling, but it seems every time I get into the weight mapping I wind up spending a lot of time and wind up with 0 actual results.

This shirt is a part of a package I’m building. I hope I can perhaps become a PA. The package is a swimsuit with shorts and this shirt as optional ‘coverups’. And, I have some ideas for maybe a few accessories, but we will see how far I get with making a decent product first. One of the things that has me worried, is getting it all packaged properly. Whew there are a lot of steps to doing this right. But, a whole lot of those steps were just a short time ago extremely difficult and now are just old hat. It’s coming… I am from the CAD world, so I had to rid myself of a lot of that thinking right off the start. wink

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Posted: 29 September 2012 12:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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I not familiar with how things really work in Hex ( I have it and I want to learn it, but I’m one of those Blender nuts tongue rolleye ) but if it’s like the Sub-D modifier in blender than, yeah, that happens as the mesh slightly shrinks depending on the available settings. I’m often adjusting the mesh when ever I Sub-D.

They lowered the default settings in Smoothing, but overall it runs allot faster now.

If you think learning DS weight-mapping is frustrating, don’t go near Blender weight-painting LOL

As with anything new, there’s always that learning curve. I dove into DS weight-painting from day 1 that Pro became available and there was ZERO info available then… it took me a few weeks of hair pulling and walking away many times until I started to get the hang of it. And as soon as I had a grasp of making the maps, they went and added new tools to make it easier… sick LOL

I started with CAD also and then vector graphics and bit map painting/editing. My first venture into 3D was with Daz Studio 3 on my join date. The next day I got Blender and my head exploded, brains everywhere shock  Needless to say, once I scooped them back up I stuck with DS until I had a better grasp on things and then dove head first into learning Blender.

I’m still learning new things in DS and Blender all the time and working to improve my projects.

Good luck on your content project, I look forward to seeing you as a PA, maybe in time for next years PA sale… cheese

nicci… smile

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Posted: 29 September 2012 01:04 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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Well, I have Hex of course and Silo and Blender. I’m pretty good in Hex. I think you know you are getting decent with it when it stops crashing. I rarely ever crash anymore. Silo I like a lot but I do find some things easier in Hex so I often times and hopping from one to the other. Blender, well, I’m just starting with the mesh building in there as of now and am more than green with it. Silo has very much a minimalist interface… Hex about average and Blender has more tools in your face and yes… walking around is a good solution!

I delved into this world just a bit back in the mid to late 90s with Visual Reality. Funny that my last upgrade to it included a free full version of Poser 1.0! So, I guess that dates it? For some thought at the time, which I don’t remember now, last March I decided I wanted some characters… or a character… I think for a little website avatar. I found Daz and it was ‘free’ and dang I got hooked. Free? It is a long ways from free anymore. Daz is doing pretty good off of me.

Meanwhile… I messed with weight maps again and then ‘took a walk’ and during that walk it occurred to me that I need to be removing instead of adding, so now back to try that all again. There are so many bones at play and each with perhaps 4 mappings plus bulge mapping. Just trying to figure out which one or ones are actually holding what I’m working on is interesting in itself.

Now, it seems like in Daz 4, if you used the weight map brush on one side of a mesh it traveled through to anything behind it? Seems like this was shown in the Daz Weight map video with the sash? But, I’m not seeing that in 4.5 and if so, that is an improvement. Some things I just couldn’t rotate to get clear space behind them.

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Posted: 29 September 2012 01:50 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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I have some half dozen modeling apps that I’ve collected, but I’m hooked on Blender, or you can say I’ve been blended. There are so many tools available that make model building so easy once you know where and how to use them. But I always live by, use what works for you and if I can find the time to set aside to learn Hex, I know I can find a fit for it in my workflow.

I found Daz though a Banner Ad ( I never even look at those ) I had just watched the Final Fantasy movie and wondered how they made the characters. So I did a Google search and found a Maya tutorial on modeling a figure. On one page of the tut was a Banner for DAZ3D free character creation. Curiosity got the better of me and that’s all it took. Downloaded DS3, loaded V4, clothed, posed, lit and rendered. It was very intuitive and my first render was Blank Stare Vicky on a Beach with a Volley Ball… LOL  But I saw the value in the program and the available content.

The next day my nephew suggested Blender, I blamed him for the headache I had for the rest of the week… mad

I don’t know if you have blondie’s rigging tutorial, it covers weight maps. I don’t have it myself yet, but I do plan on adding it to my library of useful tutorials.

Using the maps generated from the Transfer Utility is an ok starting point. Use the Smoothing Brush to add or subtract to ease some of the distorted mesh where possible. And bend the joints to see if the weights need tweaking and use a Brush on the bent joint to adjust or smooth them out.

It might be easier to learn weight painting by using a dummy just for learning and practice instead of trying on your current project.
I figured that one out after trashing a few projects… tongue rolleye   That’s why blondie included the Gingerbread man I believe.

Anyways, you’ll get the hang of it…

nicci… smile

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Posted: 29 September 2012 02:07 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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Well, seems like all I can say I learned about the weight mapping tonight was that the Alt key is remove instead of add. LOL! I just went through pretty much all of it on this shirt and painted, removed and added and never found the key to what I needed. So, I started deleting maps to try to find the one that was doing this and still… no Epiphany.

Yes, I do have Blondies tuts with the Gingerbread man. I should go back through that one again. (I have a number of tutorials stored up waiting for me).

And, so I must call it for the day. And the next 4 days will have my mostly away from being able to play on my computer. Oh well… when I get back I wonder how much I will have forgotten again. But, it does look like this project is going to force my learning of weight maps. I really do need to get those under control anyway.

Thanks for all the input. It is very helpful.

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Posted: 29 September 2012 02:17 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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Well sometimes the distortions induced by the Transfer Utility to the mesh can’t be fixed by the weight maps, or at least that’s what I have found to be the case sometimes…

A few days off is often a good thing… I do it often when I get stuck by a problem project… a few days latter and an empty brain will often bring better results for me and maybe even an ‘epiphany’ moment to boot… wink

I’m not sure how much help I’ve been to your exact problem, but glad to have helped. If I think of something specific, I’ll let you know here…

nicci… smile

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Posted: 29 September 2012 04:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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1) which version of 4.5 is this, if it’s 4.5.0.114 then there is a bug in the auto grouping function in both transfer utility & autofit, it’s been fixed in the beta.

2) like I said in that other thread, ALWAYS USE THE DEFAULT SHAPE when your making clothing for Genesis, anything else just gives you problems.

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**shuffles of with a new headache** tongue wink

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Posted: 08 October 2012 07:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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OK… I went back to the beginning and spent lots of time with weight mapping, played with d-formers and thought the process through as best as I can with what I know and I do think a person is a lot better off starting with Genesis base figure, at least when doing loose fitting clothing. I would be happy to be corrected on this. wink

This image is getting closer to a finished product… stall a ways to go and maybe some tricks for morphing which I learned trying to fix the first one. AAARGH!!! How many trashed meshes to I have on my hard drive now?

Most of my stuff so far has been tight fitting and again, I’m happy to be corrected, but I find building female items on Genesis Basic Female to be a lot easier to model as well… male body forms just don’t have some of the parts? red face Again, ‘so far’ this has worked really well, but only for tight stuff. Maybe there is some other transfer method one could use to get equally good results side stepping the transfer utility.

Meanwhile, this item is a portion of a suite I’m trying to create as my first hopefully PA items. Which leads me into another question.

I am trying to get my files in order! I have reviewed the Daz publication on publishing. I have downloaded the zip file with the example file layout. I have reviewed a number of products that are installed on my system. Mostly, this whole area seems to be a bit in disarray. I see that there is a thread working on the metadata. They need a lot more info on what files should go where.

I’m trying to get the first part of this series all set up right locally for publishing.

1. I see lots of dsa files strewn about. Are these still the standard for Studio 4.5? (seems like I bought a utility to make these… I guess it’s time to pull that back out)
2. Do these dsa files hold everything to do with something? For instance, is a dsa file created to hold a ‘material option’ the container for the texture files, bump map, UV maps and so on?
3. Is there a resource to help with what directories should go where? Something beyond the very basics provided in that zip file for publishers? For instance, where should one save a pose, a material, the figure prop itself. UVs, texture maps, morphs and so on?
4. Am I missing something obvious in Daz that does this publishing bit for you?
5. And the nagging issue. Why is there a Documents/Daz3d/Studio and a Documents/Daz3d/Studio 4 folder and why does stuff keep insisting on finding Studio 4 when I’m putting everything in Studio? :( Sometimes I hate Windows!

OK and on a lighter note, here is a clip of the new loose shirt which is still very much a work in progress.

Thanks for all the help!

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