Digital Art Zone

 
     
Using V4 and M4 facial expressions for Genesis
Posted: 17 July 2012 09:14 PM   [ Ignore ]
New Member
Total Posts:  14
Joined  2010-04-06

Genesis will accept general poses and hand poses that were made for Generation 4 characters, though not perfectly. Unfortunately, it won’t accept legacy face expression poses. Is it possible to, say, convert the poses for use with Genesis?

Profile
 
 
Posted: 17 July 2012 10:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
Administrator
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  8546
Joined  2007-11-06

Facial expressions aren’t really poses, they’re morphs.  If you have GenX you could convert the facial expressions that way.

 Signature 

PostgreSQL CMS FAQ

Product Updates: Non-Genesis/G2 DIM Zips starting July 2013
Non-Genesis Items with Metadata
Plugin Version Numbers for DS 4.5
Updated Genesis Products

Profile
 
 
Posted: 17 July 2012 11:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
Power Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  1716
Joined  2012-02-07

Greetings,

fixmypcmike - 17 July 2012 10:30 PM

Facial expressions aren’t really poses, they’re morphs.  If you have GenX you could convert the facial expressions that way.

I…I did not realize that!


Thank you!  I’m going to have to give that a try…


mutter, mutter...learn something new every day, if I’m not careful…


—Morgan

 Signature 

Want wishlist discount notifications, better wishlist sorting, or to see ALL current discounts? http://3dwishlist.com/demo

Look at my deviantArt Gallery, give me feedback and feel free to follow!

This Firefox GreaseMonkey/Chrome Extension tweaks the wishlist and the product pages, adding cool new features to both and cleaning up small UI issues.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 18 July 2012 01:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
Power Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  1179
Joined  2009-01-09
Cypherfox - 17 July 2012 11:32 PM

Greetings,

fixmypcmike - 17 July 2012 10:30 PM

Facial expressions aren’t really poses, they’re morphs.  If you have GenX you could convert the facial expressions that way.

I…I did not realize that!


Thank you!  I’m going to have to give that a try…


mutter, mutter...learn something new every day, if I’m not careful…


—Morgan


That works; however, the side effect is that a converted Gen4/GenX’d expression calls the appropriate V4/M4 shape. So if you try to use a GenX converted expression on a converted Gen3 character or on M5 or V5, the character will abruptly look somewhat different because the body base shape will change from whatever it was to M4/V4.

 Signature 

VWrangler at deviantArt (NSFW for some images; login required to view those)

Profile
 
 
Posted: 18 July 2012 08:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
Administrator
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  8546
Joined  2007-11-06
vwrangler - 18 July 2012 01:05 AM
Cypherfox - 17 July 2012 11:32 PM

Greetings,

fixmypcmike - 17 July 2012 10:30 PM

Facial expressions aren’t really poses, they’re morphs.  If you have GenX you could convert the facial expressions that way.

I…I did not realize that!


Thank you!  I’m going to have to give that a try…


mutter, mutter...learn something new every day, if I’m not careful…


—Morgan


That works; however, the side effect is that a converted Gen4/GenX’d expression calls the appropriate V4/M4 shape. So if you try to use a GenX converted expression on a converted Gen3 character or on M5 or V5, the character will abruptly look somewhat different because the body base shape will change from whatever it was to M4/V4.

Really?  I thought you had to dial the V4/M4 shape separately.

 Signature 

PostgreSQL CMS FAQ

Product Updates: Non-Genesis/G2 DIM Zips starting July 2013
Non-Genesis Items with Metadata
Plugin Version Numbers for DS 4.5
Updated Genesis Products

Profile
 
 
Posted: 18 July 2012 08:24 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
Power Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  1179
Joined  2009-01-09
fixmypcmike - 18 July 2012 08:10 PM
vwrangler - 18 July 2012 01:05 AM

That works; however, the side effect is that a converted Gen4/GenX’d expression calls the appropriate V4/M4 shape. So if you try to use a GenX converted expression on a converted Gen3 character or on M5 or V5, the character will abruptly look somewhat different because the body base shape will change from whatever it was to M4/V4.

Really?  I thought you had to dial the V4/M4 shape separately.


GenX-generated presets call the shape automatically. I think most Genesis presets do, actually, but GenX-generated ones definitely do. I discovered this when I tried using a V4 expression on M4, just to see how it would look.  The results were, shall we say, unexpectedly busty.

 Signature 

VWrangler at deviantArt (NSFW for some images; login required to view those)

Profile
 
 
Posted: 19 July 2012 12:17 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
Active Member
Avatar
RankRank
Total Posts:  787
Joined  2005-09-19
vwrangler - 18 July 2012 08:24 PM

GenX-generated presets call the shape automatically. I think most Genesis presets do, actually, but GenX-generated ones definitely do. I discovered this when I tried using a V4 expression on M4, just to see how it would look.  The results were, shall we say, unexpectedly busty.

If it’s an actual call then it may be possible to edit it out of the .dsf.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 21 July 2012 05:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
Member
Rank
Total Posts:  73
Joined  2005-01-14
vwrangler - 18 July 2012 08:24 PM
fixmypcmike - 18 July 2012 08:10 PM
vwrangler - 18 July 2012 01:05 AM

GenX-generated presets call the shape automatically. I think most Genesis presets do, actually, but GenX-generated ones definitely do. I discovered this when I tried using a V4 expression on M4, just to see how it would look.  The results were, shall we say, unexpectedly busty.

If you load v4 on genx and apply the expression there, you can check only the face morphs you need to port, then select region face or head, no auto follow, and port them without the v4 body. Later when you use it on genesis you will need the v4 head morph applied though, otherwise it will look different. I’m assuming you won’t click on the expression preset with genesis but rather dial in the newly created genx morph.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 21 July 2012 02:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
Power Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  1179
Joined  2009-01-09
awz4158 - 21 July 2012 05:10 AM

If you load v4 on genx and apply the expression there, you can check only the face morphs you need to port, then select region face or head, no auto follow, and port them without the v4 body. Later when you use it on genesis you will need the v4 head morph applied though, otherwise it will look different. I’m assuming you won’t click on the expression preset with genesis but rather dial in the newly created genx morph.


True, but then you’re adding the expressions morphs and facial controls to the Genesis genepool again, which a preset doesn’t. A preset works with what’s already there, and as far as I can tell, for facial expressions, if you’re doing GenX transfers anyway, the underlying morphs already exist. Once you’re doing any number of GenX conversions, Genesis is going to become large and slow to load/save (relatively speaking), so I’d like to restrict the additional morphs added to the genepool to the ones that are unavoidable. (The only thing I really miss about M4/V4 tech is the ability to add only those character morphs I wanted. On the other hand, I can do mixing and matching that I couldn’t with Gen4. But still…)


I looked inside one of the expression presets that I’d transferred, and the top of the file looked like this:

{
 
"file_version" "0.5.0.0",
 
"asset_info" {
  
"type" "preset_pose"
 
},
 
"scene" {
  
"animations" [
   {
    
"url" "#FBMMichael4?value",
    
"keys" [
     [ 0
1 ]
    ]
   }
,
   
{
    
"url" "#PBMNavel?value",
    
"keys" [
     [ 0
1 ]
    ]
   }
,
   
{
    
"url" "#M4_CTRL_JawFix?value",
    
"keys" [
     [ 0
1 ]
    ]
   }


With the exception of the line about the PBMNavel?value, every URL in the file started with #M4.  That said, it looks like, as long as you edit out that first section with #FBMMichael4?value (or #FBMVictoria4?value or whatever the actual shape is), the preset will load the expression without necessarily calling the shape itself; I was able to use the edited M4 expression on a V5 character, and she still looked like herself, didn’t change shape or size or anything except her facial expression. I tried also editing out the #M4_ from each line with a search and replace, but because GenX transfers are shape-based, without that, the preset couldn’t link to the appropriate structure to control.


That said, there are still some things to watch out for. I’ve got a few expression sets that came with characters, and it turns out when those are translated to Genesis by GenX, they not only call the shape, they call the complete character. I don’t think there’s any way to edit those so that they’re not character specific; it’s too embedded in the file in too many places.

 Signature 

VWrangler at deviantArt (NSFW for some images; login required to view those)

Profile