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All I ask is that Vendors Use The same folder name for each catagory on their products.
Posted: 10 July 2012 02:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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Jaderail - 10 July 2012 02:22 PM

Right Click, in DS and Rename. Folder, item, what not, nevermind….

You can’t move stuff in DS right? If so that would be golden. That way maybe even the CMS would catch the change if you happened to move stuff around that had Metadata.

 

I only use metadata for Genesis stuff but some items are V4 and Genesis and they tend to put the content in the poser folder structure when it works for both(at least for two hair items I am thinking about). So when you move the poser data around it bugs out the metadata which is sad news because the references no longer work.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 02:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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What Zev is asking is pretty straightforward and, as he has said, is already being done by some.

This is not a Poser folder issue, it’s basic file naming convention.

I have only produced a few free items but each Character, Pose and Texture follows the exact same folder structure in each section, each named for the item. It really is just a common sense workflow.

Everyone seems to be going off on a tangent talking about Studio and Metadata but, let’s face it, sometimes you have to track down a files real location, especially in Carrara. As far as I can see, Metadata will lead to a disorganised structure as producers are now less tied to having to build products with a structured system. Even looking at what is in my Runtimes now, without the issue of metadata, I can easily see which vendors have a good solid workflow and thus inspire more confidence in their products.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 03:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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larsmidnatt - 10 July 2012 02:26 PM

You can’t move stuff in DS right? If so that would be golden.

Most things you can. I’m sure it messes up the metadata, but the way I set up my content\runtimes I don’t need the metadata.


If I have a product named X, I move all the materials, poses, lights etc and any add ons for X into sub folders of X, (and a huge thanks to all the vendors that do this!). That way everything related to it is right there.

 


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Posted: 10 July 2012 03:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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larsmidnatt - 10 July 2012 02:26 PM
Jaderail - 10 July 2012 02:22 PM

Right Click, in DS and Rename. Folder, item, what not, nevermind….

You can’t move stuff in DS right? If so that would be golden. That way maybe even the CMS would catch the change if you happened to move stuff around that had Metadata.

You can move files, singly or in groups, but not a folder as a folder.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 03:13 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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Kendall Sears - 10 July 2012 11:11 AM

The vendors aren’t going to change their workflows
Kendall

You mean workflaws…. smile

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Posted: 10 July 2012 03:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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If one tries to organize things by adding a new system on top of a mess, it never works in the end in my experience.

larsmidnatt - 10 July 2012 11:16 AM
Kendall Sears - 10 July 2012 11:11 AM

  Metadata is *one* way to solve that problem.  Another is to ditch the ridiculous Poser legacy completely.

Kendall

Metadata is a pain of its own. It’s not consistent and it is a separate system all together. It is not the end all by any stretch of the imagination. I know there are the meta-data Evangelist, but in reality it does not work for everyone. Trying to add metadata to your own content is such a large time investment it is really much faster to simply manage folders.

Metadata is nice and fancy but not what it is sold to be. I do agree the poser system is ridiculous but you can’t ditch something that has so much content. I agree the OP is asking for something that will never happen.

Long story short; metadata is overrated and the legacy system is dated.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 03:37 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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Zev0 - 10 July 2012 11:21 AM

It doesn’t seem to bother other users otherwise it would have been enforced a long time ago.

Ok, I’m assuming that was just sarcastic ;p

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Posted: 10 July 2012 03:49 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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FSMCDesigns - 10 July 2012 11:36 AM

See, that is the thing, i don’t view the poser runtime file structure as wrong or ridiculous, it is what i have used for years…

The problem is that most people don’t want to put in years to learn something that is totally unintuitive and fractured in their experience. I tried and didn’t use Poser v1-6 because I did think that the system was unintuitive to the point that I didn’t want to be bothered trying to wrap my brain around it. I mean come on… calling a texture a ‘pose’ because of some underlying technical aspect? That is just unacceptable in a user interface imo. Separating objects from their textures, accessories, poses and lightsets just doesn’t make sense to most people. In general people expect when they purchase something that everything in that package should be contained in one place. Add to that the fact that everything got further fractured by having stuff in the poser folder structure and stuff in the DAZ folder structure for the same package and it’s an unrecognizable mess for most people. I’m sure anyone here who’s read the forums much has seen multiple posts where people comment “I have had xxx item for (some period of time,) I didn’t know it came with yyy.” Just saying that person is stupid isn’t a solution, one shouldn’t have to think that hard about these things.

Items should be in subfolders of the package they came with. One shouldn’t have to hunt for things. Metaphors and labels that have to do with underlying technology rather than user frames of reference are a known mistake in interface design. Having multiple subfolder groups poser and DAZ which stuff gets split across is a problem.

There are workarounds yes, but workarounds should not be confused with solutions. The solution is to fix the underlying problems.

Do we really want a community based on exclusiveness where the only ones able to participate are the ones who take the time to learn strange idiosyncrasies, or do we want an inclusive community that continues to evolve in a more usable and friendly way. One way leads to extinction, the other growth.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 03:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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An addendum to the last post. Generic light set, pose and camera folders only apply for generic light sets, cameras, and poses. Any of these created for a specific scene should be with that scene as they usually don’t apply to other scenes, and if they do in some instance.. well we know where they are wink

The true test of usability is, does it make sense to someone who’s never used the product before… I think most people here would agree the current state of storage in DAZ fails in this respect.

I love DAZ and hope for good things for the future, so I put this forth with best intentions.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 04:00 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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larsmidnatt - 10 July 2012 02:26 PM

You can’t move stuff in DS right?

Yes, you can move stuff and many of us do. However, there are rules as to what you can/can’t move, and they are a secret mystery only revealed under a full moon in the shadow of the crypt where Jim Morrison was buried. wink

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Posted: 10 July 2012 04:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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RoguePilot - 10 July 2012 02:43 PM

What Zev is asking is pretty straightforward and, as he has said, is already being done by some.

This is not a Poser folder issue, it’s basic file naming convention.

I have only produced a few free items but each Character, Pose and Texture follows the exact same folder structure in each section, each named for the item. It really is just a common sense workflow.

Everyone seems to be going off on a tangent talking about Studio and Metadata but, let’s face it, sometimes you have to track down a files real location, especially in Carrara. As far as I can see, Metadata will lead to a disorganised structure as producers are now less tied to having to build products with a structured system. Even looking at what is in my Runtimes now, without the issue of metadata, I can easily see which vendors have a good solid workflow and thus inspire more confidence in their products.

Thank you:)

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Posted: 10 July 2012 04:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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Gedd - 10 July 2012 04:00 PM
larsmidnatt - 10 July 2012 02:26 PM

You can’t move stuff in DS right?

Yes, you can move stuff and many of us do. However, there are rules as to what you can/can’t move, and they are a secret mystery only revealed under a full moon in the shadow of the crypt where Jim Morrison was buried. wink

Data, Runtime, and ReadMe’s are special folders in a DS-format content folder.  Outside of those folders, you can move DS-format content anywhere.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 04:47 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
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Zev0 - 10 July 2012 11:21 AM

Oh it can happen if sites put that in the rules of product uploading, But its just me complaining. It doesn’t seem to bother other users otherwise it would have been enforced a long time ago.

It’s bugged the hell out of me for years.  Every once in a while, there are forum posts in which people complain about precisely the same thing.


My pet peeve: there is a certain texture artist here at Daz that puts all of their products under a folder in their name rather than the name of the product.  I curse every time I install their stuff.


For some reason, metadata just doesn’t work for me.  When I installed DS, and all the newer Genesis stuff I bought, I scrupulously installed all of the metadata files.  But the smart content was finding only about 10% of it, which was utterly useless.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 04:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
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That’s just it.  It ISN’T a texture.  It’s a set of textures/material settings, so I never found “Pose” to be counter intuitive for applying material settings to an object.  Textures are actually put in a Texture folder under the Runtime.

It also made complete sense to me for lights to be in Lights, Cameras to be in Cameras ... etc.  It’s not at all different from filing taxes in a Taxes folder, utilities in a Utilities folder, rent/mortgage papers in a Rent/Mortgage folder.  Marriage/Divorce papers in a Was I Crazy?!? folder.  And ... so on.
 

What NEVER made sense was vendors naming the folder in Figures “Jane’s Sexy Dress,” while naming the MAT folder “Club Outfit,” and naming the product itself ... “Night on the Town.” 

.

Gedd - 10 July 2012 03:49 PM

I mean come on… calling a texture a ‘pose’ because of some underlying technical aspect? That is just unacceptable in a user interface imo.

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Posted: 10 July 2012 04:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
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Satira Capriccio - 10 July 2012 04:52 PM


What NEVER made sense was vendors naming the folder in Figures “Jane’s Sexy Dress,” while naming the MAT folder “Club Outfit,” and naming the product itself ... “Night on the Town.” 

This.

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