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Metaball art
Posted: 25 October 2013 03:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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Can Bryce be “tricked” into creating animated ripples from a water drop?

I would say creating such ripples is quite easy - just use several toruses (tori), each timed to expand outwards one after the other. Additionally, varying their thicknesses, colour and transparency, too, would create the effect e.g. thickest and less transparent starting off from the centre, and deceasing, increasing respectively as they expand.

I suspect the same could be done with production of a droplet (metaballs combined..etc.,) falling into water, with the additional return upwards drop…etc. Getting them all to work together - drop falling, upward-drop, ripples etc.,... - would be a timing task, but doable, I would imagine, in Bryce.

Jay
PS. Slightly off-topic (and not), but just got the free DS 4.6, and tried the figure animations (running, walking, jumping, face expressions…etc.,), and wow, so amazingly real.

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Posted: 25 October 2013 08:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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Jamahoney - 25 October 2013 03:57 AM

Can Bryce be “tricked” into creating animated ripples from a water drop?

I would say creating such ripples is quite easy - just use several toruses (tori), each timed to expand outwards one after the other.

Try it – It’s not so hot smile Trying to get the torii blending with whatever you’re using as the basic water plane/terrain will always create a hard seam at the intersection.

I suspect the same could be done with production of a droplet (metaballs combined..etc.,) falling into water, with the additional return upwards drop…etc. Getting them all to work together - drop falling, upward-drop, ripples etc.,... - would be a timing task, but doable, I would imagine, in Bryce.

It really isn’t – Sorry Jama, but fluid dynamics is an extremely manual, tedious and ultimately unrewarding effort in Bryce.

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Posted: 26 October 2013 04:56 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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Ah yes, Oroboros...those problems - seams, fluidity…etc., - I can see would undoubtedly occur: one woudl be better off doing them in some other ‘wares like, say, Blender or other.

My ani’s usually involve simple camera movememnts as these suit my needs, however, must tackle a complex one in Bryce some day - just for the fun and experience. Why in Bryce, well, that’s all I’m kinda used to right now - the prospects of learning a new ‘ware is always off-putting, I’ve found (too much of a life to live instead…;)) Tried Carrara, Blender and others, but Bryce’s setup makes it so interactively simple - that’s its attractiveness, I suppose (oh, and it’s cheap wink).

Jay

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Posted: 26 October 2013 03:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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Jamahoney - 26 October 2013 04:56 AM

Ah yes, Oroboros...those problems - seams, fluidity…etc., - I can see would undoubtedly occur: one woudl be better off doing them in some other ‘wares like, say, Blender or other.

We-ell… yes and no… Just as David and Horo learn and have fun with materials and HDRI (and modeling - some of the Kline cubes Brinnen is coming up with are warping my brain), there are other experiments that can be done with animation.

Ultimately, all 3D apps lie. Or rather, they present tools for users to help them create scenes that don’t exist, under conditions that seem reasonable, but are false representations of a vision in 2D. Even 3D movies aren’t actually 3D: they employ tricks of light to portray false perspective.

This is a liberating point-of-view, in my opinion. It means 3D design and animation isn’t about accurately portraying reality, and it means you can do anything you like in order to achieve the ends, and that means CHEATING IS ALL GOOD.

Finding out HOW to cheat… THAT’S the pursuit all Bryce users are involved with.

Fluid dynamics is hard to do in Bryce, but part of why it’s hard to do is because there hasn’t been much experimentation with it. Animation doesn’t deliver short-term results. People get impatient. Here’s a shortlist of current fluid dynamic solves:

1. Rotate/Scale a fluid material over the surface of an object;
2. Warp a terrain and move it through a landscape.

There are specials, like creating waterfalls and creating concentric ripples, but they come down to pulling materials through objects again, and they look pants from the wrong angles.

One thing that hasn’t got a lot of attention is Dynamic Terrain Deformation, and this is my own term so don’t try googling it smile DTD is basically either:

1. Having a terrain oscillate its form between two states, or;
2. Having a terrain deform in steps between successive picture maps

Lack of experimentation leads to brain-lock. People know they can create a terrain, alter its shape in the terrain editor, AND they can play with the scale, rotation and position of the terrain in an animation. They can also skew the terrain, using World view, rotating the terrain off-horizontal and then scaling it.

What people rarely do is play with the actual terrain data over time. So you could create a static moonscape, for instance, and then at a moment in time, load in a similar picture but with an added crater, and have the moonscape suddenly create a crater at a moment in time.

This is altering the terrain data. Each point in a terrain is simply a height value, and each one of those points can be changed over time. Terrains are an extremely complex ‘grouped object’, if you like.

So it seems to me that there might be alternative ways to animate terrain patterns rather than dissolving between two pictures. Or maybe adding more than two pictures. (This is all the fractal landscape generators do in Bryce: generate pictures for terrain mapping, nothing more.)

Also, you can load a TEXTURE as a terrain pattern, as detailed in a tutorial by Mr Brinnen somewhere… I think you SHIFT-click the Create Picture button or something… Perhaps this offers a quick way to generate related, offset patterns for more realistic height flows.

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Posted: 27 October 2013 02:13 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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Oroboros - 26 October 2013 03:19 PM

Also, you can load a TEXTURE as a terrain pattern, as detailed in a tutorial by Mr Brinnen somewhere… I think you SHIFT-click the Create Picture button or something…

That would be [Ctrl]+[Alt] or [AltGr] (option on the Mac) on the picture button. Has been working since at least Bryce 4. In Bryce 4, the DTE jumps up immediately, Bryce 7.1 needs about one second to do so. This is also described in Susan Kitchens Bryce 4 book on pages 531/532.

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Posted: 27 October 2013 05:58 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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Image and Animation link below shows ripples’ experiemnt in Bryce (Bryce 6.3). It took about 30 mins’ to create the scene and props (stones, reeds and tori), and another 30 mins’ for the full render (reduced screen size, 30-second animation at 15 fps).

Ripple Animation (YouTube link ~ 30 seconds long)

What was involved?
(1) Create a series of toruses each one bigger in size than the previous.
(2) Group them all, and shrink this group down to as far as you can go (roughly) - for the first keyframe of the animation.
(3) For the last keyframe of the animation, simply expand out this group again to what the series of toruses looked like in (1) above.

The splashes are just two squished spheres with a cloud mat applied while they appear on the scene for a brief time. The ripples don’t react physically with the reeds, or produce interference patterns, as Bryce doesn’t do ‘real’ physics. However, with a little more time, tweaking all the above could lead to a better, convinceable scene.

Jay
PS. Pesky fireflies at the end of animation - where’s the spray when you need it…psssst, pssst.

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Posted: 27 October 2013 11:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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Nice work Jama, and that’s about the limit of the torii technique. Ages ago I thought this wasn’t satisfactory, so I was trying to flatten the torus out as it got wider, to simulate the role gravity and friction have to play on dampening wave prominence. For me… not great for close-ups smile

I did get a satisfactory result with metaballs, but it took a few parenting/animation mechanics that, IMO, were excessive for the finished effect. If I get some time tonight I’ll try and remember how I did it smile

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Posted: 27 October 2013 11:37 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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@Jay:  Nicely done, and convincing.  Ever thought of doing one using water bugs?

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Posted: 28 October 2013 05:33 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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Cheers, Oroboros. Yeah, I think you could get a more convinceable ripple-like pattern over time with adjustments to the tori parameters etc., - it was a simple but interesting experiment in the end.

Guss...“Ever thought of doing one using water bugs?”...haha, saw what you did there - damn firelfies wink

Jay

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Posted: 31 October 2013 03:30 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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Sorry for the delay, but this was roughly the technique I used for pond ripples.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nps7jvKZKWc

Feel free to ask questions if interested.

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Posted: 31 October 2013 04:26 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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Jay and Oroboros -the ripple animations are awesome.

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Posted: 31 October 2013 05:11 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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Oroboros...that’s quite an excellent ripple animation - very convinceable even at this close-view setup (some form of floating device, say, a fishing bob, on the water surface bobbing up and down as the ripples passed could also be tied in to the whole scene, I guess). Use of the tori/metaballs/rock connection is one that I wouldn’t have thought of, and it’s defintely the way to go for Vindazi if he’s thinking of producing his own ripple work.

Initially, I thought of stacking the toruses in my experiment - each single torus slightly above the other etc. However, what I didn’t account for is that as you expand out the tori-group, each torus in the group takes on a different volume, and so adjustments (e.g. position above/below the water plain, or, say, reducing the outer tori thicknesses, volumes…etc.,) had to be made. With your setup, however, you don’t have to as, literally, it takes on a life of its own. Spooky (yeah, Halloween reference wink).

Well done
Jay
Edit: thanks, Mermaid.

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Posted: 31 October 2013 12:17 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
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@Oroboros:  That’s an awesome demo of ripples.  Nicely done.

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Posted: 31 October 2013 12:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
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@Oroboros - very convincing.

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Posted: 31 October 2013 10:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
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Thanks all smile

Jamahoney - 31 October 2013 05:11 AM

Use of the tori/metaballs/rock connection is one that I wouldn’t have thought of, and it’s defintely the way to go for Vindazi if he’s thinking of producing his own ripple work.

This is basic top-down machine structure. A ‘machine’ is just a localised animation that you can move around. The ripple-creating metaballs are parented to hidden toruses; the toruses to the hidden rock. If I want to copy the entire, finished ripple animation machine I just select the rock and copy it. Everything, including the animation sequence, is copied.

Initially, I thought of stacking the toruses in my experiment - each single torus slightly above the other etc. However, what I didn’t account for is that as you expand out the tori-group, each torus in the group takes on a different volume, and so adjustments (e.g. position above/below the water plain, or, say, reducing the outer tori thicknesses, volumes…etc.,) had to be made. With your setup, however, you don’t have to as, literally, it takes on a life of its own. Spooky (yeah, Halloween reference wink).

Torus thickness can be altered over time. Your bigger problem was the rate of scaling. Under constant conditions, waves propagate at linear speed. Scaling a group of concentric objects doesn’t replicate this: inner-rings barely grow, while outer rings start fast but begin to slow down. (In nature, wave speed decreases as you get to shallower water, but wave amplitude (height) also gets more pronounced.)

But there’s a shortcut. Create one wave, animate the torus, animate the parented metaballs, go crazy, make it perfect. Then, select the torus, copy it and paste it. Then get into the AML and delay the keyframe occurrences of this new animation by a few frames. Ta-dahhh… waves.

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