Klugdge,thank you so much for your feedback.
A real fast note here. This is NOT an online gaming community nor does it play one on TV. You’re trying to mix apples and acorns and it just doesn’t work.
I do not have the numbers to confirm nor deny how many users of DAZ content are playing online games.
You made a guess based on your personal opinion and are now presenting it as a fact.
I assume that you do not know the number as well.
No,. I said the community is not a gaming community. On a gaming site, you have gamers with gamer values. There probably are gamers here but the focus isn’t gaming and collecting awards etc. It’s primarily 3D art. That is fact. That some members may be involved in gaming doesn’t make the community as a whole a gaming community. That also is fact. The precise numbers don’t matter and what you’re presenting is edging toward a straw man argument.
The folks here have an entirely different set of interests et al and the sort of “awards” you’re pushing just ain’t gonna cut it.
I also asume that you are in no place to speak for the whole community to speak what their interests are.
I don’t have to. I’ve been reading the responses and that is a darned good indicator of how the community feels about that concept.
But speaking in the name of the whole community is exactly that kind of behavior that is causing that an opinion is considered dominant when in fact it might not be.
Speaking in terms of the representative group here is valid. What you’re doing is trying hard to force an opinion on others simply because it works in an entirely different environment.
With that, the mods et al here are volunteers in many cases as is true of a number of other 3D art-related forums I’m on. Again, this is an entirely different community that doesn’t require having paid pros handling the majority of the forum topics & discussions. Apples & acorns.
This goes offtopic and into more detail into the forum staff aspect but it is also connected so I pick it up.
YOU opened the door so expect commentary on it.
The main difference between DAZ and other 3D related art forums is that DAZ is also a business.
Oh. And Renderosity, RDNA, Content Paradise and the other “R” place aren’t? Whoa, news to me! Even Fantasy Attic is a business (as Fantasy Realms) yet the mods are volunteers. I know because I am one.
While on art forums everyone is there to discuss art on the DAZ forum several different things happen:
Okay, let’s go over them point by point ...
- Help forum
Very professinally handled with a lot of friendly people. Really no complaint at all here.
Oh, so volunteer mods aren’t so bad after all. Imagine that.
- DAZ Studio forum
Here is some kind of a grey zone were the first issues arise.
On the one hand it is quite well structured to discuss only topics related to DS.
What about those dedicated to Carrara, Bryce or Hex? They also are DAZ products.
- Some people expect that when the write feature requests they are actually read by DAZ staff.
Personally I observed that some issues actually might get noticed because sometimes DAZ staff is posting in release posts.
But there is not much indication that they will look at any other threads.
Oh. So this says they don’t read without posting. Interesting. Mr Haseltine, would you or another DAZist care to comment on this?
If forum staff is telling customers with issues to file a ticket they may end up alienating the client even more.
Funny, that is precisely what a client is supposed to do, file a ticket. I’ve yet to see anyone alienated by this except on occasion those who’ve filed tickets and not been satisfied with the results. From what I’ve seen, both DAZ and volunteer folks have been exceptionally courteous & helpful when that happens.
What is needed here would be paid Software Support Staff.
Who do you think handles the tickets? The paid software support staff does. Imagine that! They’ve also been known to show up in the forums. Memory serving, DAZ_Spook is just such a person. (He also didn’t like my joke about Spooky Software. *sigh* ... such is life.)
- the commons
Idealy the commons could be a place for off topic communication.
Yes, I suppose a portion could be set up for off-topic discussion BUT why not a separate General OT discussion area - kind of a “Water Cooler” area? Why not suggest this rather than complain that it doesn’t exist? As a side note, OT discussions do pop up now and then plus, if you read the threads, you’ll find that OT discussions take place in them. By the same token, I don’t know that when the forums were first established there wasn’t an OT area that went away due to atrophy. Any Old Timers care to answer that one?
The main and biggest issue happens here because of the lack of a “Sales Forum”
How many complaints of customers about products they purchased end up in the commons?
Ummm ... that is part of the purpose of the Commons. Let me quote from the forum header, “Here is where you may feel free to discuss anything related to DAZ 3D or the 3d / digital art world. Here you can talk about the latest DAZ 3D product, or any other ideas and suggestions you might have with all of your fellow community members.” (emphasis mine) Where does it say that product issues are not to be posted there? (Hint: It doesn’t.)
So that mixing together “Apples & acorns” as you put it may actually be the underlying problem of quite a few issues.
No, the apples & acorns mix referred to trying to treat this as a gaming forum with gaming values and attitudes.
DAZ is not just one thing it is many. This also yields many different expectations.
To bring them all together is difficult but then the challange of any business.
And, oddly enough, DAZ does a decent job of it. It’s not perfect by any means but no forum is. Not here, not Rendo, Not RDNA, not CP, not the other R place ... not anywhere I’ve been and I’ve been to a good number of forums, mostly managed by commercial enterprises. I don’t believe it’s possible to create a “perfect” forum since people are different and look for different things.
I could have let the thread go on for a few days and then see what happens. But that might also lead that most people would just loose interest by then. As Herald of Fire pointed out he was confused by the purpose of the thread.
So am I, for that matter. And if a thread isn’t interesting people will wander off and look elsewhere. From the body count, this isn’t one of the more interesting threads going.
How many times in the last months have you felt like adding your opinion to a topic but then did not because you were in the minority?
How many times have you felt that the dominant opinion is allready formed and there is no point of adding your voice?
How do you like the way the forum communication is going at the moment?
In general, quite well. As mentioned previously, no forum is perfect and there are bumps in the road but when humans are involved this is going to happen. It’s part of human imperfection.
As to the dissenting minority, did you consider the possibility that NO one has a contradictory view in some cases so the vocal majority is, in fact, everyone? OTOH, if you want a “discussion” that leads to deleted posts and locked threads, try opening a Studio vs Poser thread or maybe “Genesis is proof DAZ has abandoned Poser users” thread. (I think both of those topics are verboten now, come to think of it.) They got lively and lead to ad hominim attacks within a day. Or less. Does the gaming community allow flamefests or would the same thing happen there?
To be completely honest, I don’t find any merit in your arguments but then our backgrounds and experiences here are completely different. Sauce for the goose isn’t sauce for the gander here or on any forum.