Aiko 3 and Genesis

thatbumzzzthatbumzzz Posts: 0
edited December 1969 in The Commons

Aiko 3 seems to have been quite the phenomenon, theres so many wonderful(if you like anime) stuff for her that I dont find for Aiko 4, and the morph shapes are much closer to traditional anime in my opinion.

My question is, how much of this stuff works with Genesis? If I get the Aiko 3 for Genesis will all the clothes, skin and hair for Aiko 3 work? What about the morphs? If I use Gen X will I be able to get the exact same facial morphs? And what about the various eye morph products for Aiko 3, do those work for genesis? Lastly will Melody at RDNA, the one used to create many animal heads, work for Genesis with the Aiko 3 morph since Melody was intended for Aiko 3?

Thanks in advance.

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Comments

  • Zev0Zev0 Posts: 3,577
    edited December 1969

    Aiko3 clothes work on Genesis. Hair yes. Morphs through Genx should work as good as gen4 transfers .No aiko3 or gen3 texure support (convert to aiko4/v4 via textureconverter2). So the only no go is textures, unless you convert them to gen4.

  • MattymanxMattymanx Posts: 3,398
    edited December 1969

    I dont think Melody will work because its a whole different character that makes use of the Aiko3 body but has a completely different head.

  • SpottedKittySpottedKitty Posts: 3,248
    edited June 2012

    No, the Melody morphs and textures can't be transferred to Genesis because the different head makes it a different mesh with different UVMaps. I'd be very happy if someone were to figure out a way to do it, though, as I have a large (and boisterous!) crowd of Melody-based characters, and I'd love to be able to use some of the Genesis features on them.

    Edit: And many of my Melody characters use the digitigrade legs. Has geometry swapping been fixed yet in D|S4, or is it still horribly broken?

    Post edited by SpottedKitty on
  • Kulay WolfKulay Wolf Posts: 10,861
    edited December 1969

    No, the Melody morphs and textures can't be transferred to Genesis because the different head makes it a different mesh with different UVMaps. I'd be very happy if someone were to figure out a way to do it, though, as I have a large (and boisterous!) crowd of Melody-based characters, and I'd love to be able to use some of the Genesis features on them.

    Edit: And many of my Melody characters use the digitigrade legs. Has geometry swapping been fixed yet in D|S4, or is it still horribly broken?

    I think DS4 uses geografting which would allow the adding of digitgrade legs.

  • HellboyHellboy Posts: 686
    edited December 1969

    There are no Gen 3 UVs for Genesis. Texture Convertor should work as mentioned.

    Aiko 3 clothes work if you have the Aiko 3 Iconic Shape.

    http://www.daz3d.com/shop/a3-and-h3-shapes-for-genesis/


    Morphs can be transfered with the Gen3 addon for GenX:

    http://www.daz3d.com/shop/genx-addon-gen3-for-a3-and-h3/


    But to get the morphs to look right you’d need the Iconic Shape.

  • RCDescheneRCDeschene Posts: 2,085
    edited June 2012

    Oh God, do I wish Genesis had Gen 3 Texture capabilities as well! Like everyone says, 3D Universe has the Texture Converter 2 add-on that supposedly does the trick, however, I also heard from multiple users of it that there is occasionally stretching, which puts a bit of a knot in my stomach as I debate whether or not I should go through the trouble of making the investment...


    But yeah, if you get it, let me know how it works.

    Post edited by RCDeschene on
  • Cliff BowmanCliff Bowman Posts: 1,545
    edited June 2012

    There is always DAZ's 30-day money back option if the texture converter doesn't produce the results you want... :)


    In theory if the map stretches in order to fit to a V4 map, using the V3 shape should "un-stretch" it again as you're going back to the original geometry shape (ish) for that texture. It'd be interesting to try, anyway :)


    Cheers,


    Cliff

    Post edited by Cliff Bowman on
  • RCDescheneRCDeschene Posts: 2,085
    edited December 1969

    There is always DAZ's 30-day money back option if the texture converter doesn't produce the results you want... :)


    In theory if the map stretches in order to fit to a V4 map, using the V3 shape should "un-stretch" it again as you're going back to the original geometry shape (ish) for that texture. It'd be interesting to try, anyway :)


    Cheers,


    Cliff


    Granted that can always be simply done, but what if I were to use a Gen 3 Texture on a non-Gen 3 or mixed character Genesis figure?

  • Cliff BowmanCliff Bowman Posts: 1,545
    edited December 1969

    Granted that can always be simply done, but what if I were to use a Gen 3 Texture on a non-Gen 3 or mixed character Genesis figure?

    The more the character's shape deviates from the shape the texture was created for, the greater the chance of smearing/stretching issues :(

    Somewhere there'll be a "tipping point" where the resultant quality is insufficient.

    Cheers,

    Cliff

  • pwiecekpwiecek Posts: 680
    edited June 2012

    Just a couple of points:


    Texture converter works very well for organic patterns like furries skins and VERY badly for clothing style 2nd skins.


    As far as the mesh stretching and unstretching, the algorithms used by Texture Converter and Genesis/Studio are very unlikely to be reciprocal. Its far more likely that the double conversion will make things worse rather than better

    Post edited by pwiecek on
  • RCDescheneRCDeschene Posts: 2,085
    edited December 1969

    Hence why DAZ should really consider adding Gen 3 UV support for Genesis themselves instead of having me buy a program that I'll most likely just end up returning. I mean no disrespect to 3D Universe when I say this, either...

  • Cliff BowmanCliff Bowman Posts: 1,545
    edited December 1969

    Agreed. I wonder how much effort it would be to do? Probably quite considerable... hm.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,339
    edited December 1969

    The problem is that there are surfaces on Genesis that are split between two surfaces, on different maps, in the Gen 3 mapping. Alternative UVs are a surface proeprty, I don't think they can split a UV region in two as would be needed to apply the Gen 3 maps directly.

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,882
    edited December 1969

    The problem is that there are surfaces on Genesis that are split between two surfaces, on different maps, in the Gen 3 mapping. Alternative UVs are a surface proeprty, I don't think they can split a UV region in two as would be needed to apply the Gen 3 maps directly.


    Not to mention that that would be ANOTHER step away from Poser compatibility for Genesis. Hitting a moving target is extremely hard. Changing the Genesis base for something like that could hurt any fledgling efforts by "others" to get Genesis into less capable software.


    Kendall

  • Cliff BowmanCliff Bowman Posts: 1,545
    edited December 1969

    The problem is that there are surfaces on Genesis that are split between two surfaces, on different maps, in the Gen 3 mapping. Alternative UVs are a surface proeprty, I don't think they can split a UV region in two as would be needed to apply the Gen 3 maps directly.


    Not to mention that that would be ANOTHER step away from Poser compatibility for Genesis. Hitting a moving target is extremely hard. Changing the Genesis base for something like that could hurt any fledgling efforts by "others" to get Genesis into less capable software.


    Kendall

    I suspect you'll find that's already been done - existing UV maps aren't all consistent like you'd find on the Gen4 or the Gen3 figures - they are cut up differently. Even have different UV vertex counts IIRC.

  • Kendall SearsKendall Sears Posts: 1,882
    edited December 1969

    The problem is that there are surfaces on Genesis that are split between two surfaces, on different maps, in the Gen 3 mapping. Alternative UVs are a surface proeprty, I don't think they can split a UV region in two as would be needed to apply the Gen 3 maps directly.


    Not to mention that that would be ANOTHER step away from Poser compatibility for Genesis. Hitting a moving target is extremely hard. Changing the Genesis base for something like that could hurt any fledgling efforts by "others" to get Genesis into less capable software.


    Kendall

    I suspect you'll find that's already been done - existing UV maps aren't all consistent like you'd find on the Gen4 or the Gen3 figures - they are cut up differently. Even have different UV vertex counts IIRC.


    I'm aware of your efforts as well as a few others. Adding "yet another" UV set would exacerbate the problem.


    As it stands it is enough of a problem to work around the limitations inherent to Poser without adding additional hurdles.


    Kendall

  • pwiecekpwiecek Posts: 680
    edited June 2012

    For the Melody conversion:


    Well, this is not the best solution, maybe not even a good one:


    Convert the body texture using texture converter as if you were going to use it on V4/A4.


    Strip the head off of melody, rig it and transfer the morphs


    Strip the Digitigrade legs and rig them as separate boots, transfer the morphs
    (BTW: As far as I know melody doesn't HAVE digitigrade legs. Are you sure those didn't come from Kasa (Rendo) or conversion from V4? If that's the case this will all still work.)


    Find some 3rd party tail and do the textures by hand.


    Load your Frankenstein. Parent the head and legs rather than conforming. Hide Genesis legs below the point where you parented the new legs. They'll follow whatever joint you parented them to, but below that they must be posed independently.


    Pose everything to hide the ugly seams.

    Post edited by pwiecek on
  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 3,777
    edited December 1969

    The problem is that there are surfaces on Genesis that are split between two surfaces, on different maps, in the Gen 3 mapping. Alternative UVs are a surface proeprty, I don't think they can split a UV region in two as would be needed to apply the Gen 3 maps directly.


    Not to mention that that would be ANOTHER step away from Poser compatibility for Genesis. Hitting a moving target is extremely hard. Changing the Genesis base for something like that could hurt any fledgling efforts by "others" to get Genesis into less capable software.


    Kendall

    I suspect you'll find that's already been done - existing UV maps aren't all consistent like you'd find on the Gen4 or the Gen3 figures - they are cut up differently. Even have different UV vertex counts IIRC.


    I'm aware of your efforts as well as a few others. Adding "yet another" UV set would exacerbate the problem.


    As it stands it is enough of a problem to work around the limitations inherent to Poser without adding additional hurdles.


    Kendall

    So improvements and advances to Genesis are going to be held back because of Poser's limitations?

  • pwiecekpwiecek Posts: 680
    edited December 1969

    The problem is that there are surfaces on Genesis that are split between two surfaces, on different maps, in the Gen 3 mapping. Alternative UVs are a surface proeprty, I don't think they can split a UV region in two as would be needed to apply the Gen 3 maps directly.


    Not to mention that that would be ANOTHER step away from Poser compatibility for Genesis. Hitting a moving target is extremely hard. Changing the Genesis base for something like that could hurt any fledgling efforts by "others" to get Genesis into less capable software.


    Kendall

    I suspect you'll find that's already been done - existing UV maps aren't all consistent like you'd find on the Gen4 or the Gen3 figures - they are cut up differently. Even have different UV vertex counts IIRC.


    I'm aware of your efforts as well as a few others. Adding "yet another" UV set would exacerbate the problem.


    As it stands it is enough of a problem to work around the limitations inherent to Poser without adding additional hurdles.


    Kendall

    So improvements and advances to Genesis are going to be held back because of Poser's limitations?

    Read the thread, that's not what they're saying at all.

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 3,777
    edited December 1969

    Actually I have read the thread and what I'm getting is that adding the Gen 3 UV swap abitity is difficult but can be done, but to add another set of UV's to Genesis will make using Genesis in Poser even harder.

  • SpottedKittySpottedKitty Posts: 3,248
    edited December 1969

    pwiecek said:
    (BTW: As far as I know melody doesn't HAVE digitigrade legs. Are you sure those didn't come from Kasa (Rendo) or conversion from V4? If that's the case this will all still work.)

    Whups, yes, I meant the digitigrade legs from the Kasa set. It's been so long since I originally set up the base characters, I sometimes forget that bit. From the ankles down they're kind of skinny out of the box, but I also have the CDI morphs which give some more options for body shaping.

  • thatbumzzzthatbumzzz Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Nice to see this discussion is still going. I am bummed to hear it is difficult to add GEN 3 maps to Genesis, so maybe I will have to invest in some aiko 3 morphs and such. Or maybe some of the people that made the wonderful Aiko 3 things will rerelease them for Genesis? Now that'd be awesome :)

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,339
    edited December 1969

    Texture Converter 2 with the right plugins (at least V4 and V3 for Aiko 3)will let you convert Gen 3 maps to Gen 4, which will work on Genesis. They work best on natural textures - things with stripes and regular patterns get distorted as they need to be pushed around to fit the new template.

  • RCDescheneRCDeschene Posts: 2,085
    edited June 2012

    Texture Converter 2 with the right plugins (at least V4 and V3 for Aiko 3)will let you convert Gen 3 maps to Gen 4, which will work on Genesis. They work best on natural textures - things with stripes and regular patterns get distorted as they need to be pushed around to fit the new template.

    Well, doesn't V3 technically cover the entire Gen 3 line where all Gen 3 figures share the same UV set?


    If that's the case, it makes me wonder why TC2 has specific plug-ins for M3/D3, SP3, A3, etc.

    Post edited by RCDeschene on
  • Kulay WolfKulay Wolf Posts: 10,861
    edited December 1969

    A3 and H3 have different material zones in the legs than the rest.

  • FixmypcmikeFixmypcmike Posts: 11,620
    edited December 1969

    Texture Converter 2 with the right plugins (at least V4 and V3 for Aiko 3)will let you convert Gen 3 maps to Gen 4, which will work on Genesis. They work best on natural textures - things with stripes and regular patterns get distorted as they need to be pushed around to fit the new template.

    Well, doesn't V3 technically cover the entire Gen 3 line where all Gen 3 figures share the same UV set?


    If that's the case, it makes me wonder why TC2 has specific plug-ins for M3/D3, SP3, A3, etc.

    There are some differences, although in general I've found V3 textures work pretty well on any of them. The nipples may be a bit off, and A3/H3 have an extra mat zone on the legs.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,339
    edited December 1969

    Texture Converter 2 with the right plugins (at least V4 and V3 for Aiko 3)will let you convert Gen 3 maps to Gen 4, which will work on Genesis. They work best on natural textures - things with stripes and regular patterns get distorted as they need to be pushed around to fit the new template.

    Well, doesn't V3 technically cover the entire Gen 3 line where all Gen 3 figures share the same UV set?


    If that's the case, it makes me wonder why TC2 has specific plug-ins for M3/D3, SP3, A3, etc.

    There are some differences, although in general I've found V3 textures work pretty well on any of them. The nipples may be a bit off, and A3/H3 have an extra mat zone on the legs.

    That's why I listed just the V3 and V4 plugins - though as Mike says there are minor differences (one noticeable difference is the mapping around the brow on SP, though that doesn't affect Aiko 3 of course).

  • vwranglervwrangler Posts: 1,459
    edited December 1969

    Texture Converter 2 with the right plugins (at least V4 and V3 for Aiko 3)will let you convert Gen 3 maps to Gen 4, which will work on Genesis. They work best on natural textures - things with stripes and regular patterns get distorted as they need to be pushed around to fit the new template.


    Slightly off topic, but has anyone very recently tried to purchase Texture Converter 2 and install it on Windows 7? I tried that earlier this week, and Windows 7 reported that the program was corrupted. I tried redownloading and got the same respnse. I tried the FixDaz64.exe program for older installers, and that produced cascading memory errors until I terminated the process. I put in a ticket, of course.


    Slightly closer to topic, one thing to note that a few people reported using GenX to transfer Aiko3 morphs to Genesis,making sure that the Gen3 Aiko iconic shape is installed first, is that you get some weirdness around the eyes. Some of it is simple positioning issues that were present in the original morph (if the morph has an Eye Fix file, you'll still need that, and they seem to convert reasonably well), and some was just oddness. For some characters, the eyelashes detach at the outside corners; I'm not sure D3D was ever able to quite figure out why. The figure still mostly look OK, and the issue can be mostly handled in post, but it's something to be aware of going in.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,339
    edited December 1969

    I wasn't using a download from the new store, but I did manage to install TC2 under Windows 7 - as I recall it gave the "May not have installed correctly" error, but I don't recall its being a great battle to get it there.

  • vwranglervwrangler Posts: 1,459
    edited December 1969

    I wasn't using a download from the new store, but I did manage to install TC2 under Windows 7 - as I recall it gave the "May not have installed correctly" error, but I don't recall its being a great battle to get it there.


    Must be something about the new store then. I've tried to install it three times on two different computers running Windows 7 64-bit, and all three times, Win7 reported that the installer was corrupt. (If you have easy access to it, can you tell me what the installer file size is supposed to be? I'm getting a 2.2MB file that Win7 is actually seeing as a complete file; it's just screwed up. If you don't have easy access, don't worry about it.)

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