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3Delight Surface and Lighting Thread
Posted: 03 May 2013 02:30 PM   [ Ignore ]
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Okay… first off, there are a bunch, and I mean A BUNCH of people out there experimenting with Sufrace Settings trying to get good skin, and good surfaces, amoung other things.

Let’s Start with lights.

If you are going to post to this thread, please use a lightset you have created or one that is freely available from ShareCG.  Please be so kind as to post your light settings or post the light set itself on SCG or DA or whevever so the rest of us can experiment with those.  Having a baseline is important, and lights are a very huge part of any baseline in rendering.

For now, I’ll be using this light set: http://www.sharecg.com/v/69039/view/21/DAZ-Studio/WC-3Delight-Baseline-Test-Lighting

It contains four lights, Ue2 and a camera.  The standard 3 Point Light Set, Key, Fill and Back, and a specular light attached to the camera.

Shaders: Please limit your shaders to those that come with D|S or those freely available.  That means DAZ Studio Default, Human Surface, UberSurface… the UberSurface2 and PW Shaders are purchased, and that’s great, but we’re trying to work within everyone’s means, so let’s keep it as simple as possible.

When you post your render, please describe the important settings you used.

I will not cloud the innitial post with my attitude about surfaces, but let me just say this:  It has come to my attention that with Skin Materials Diffuse when used with SubSurface Scattering should add up to around 100%, with Diffuse being weak and SSS being strong.  I’ve been told that a setting of 30% Diffuse - 70% SSS.  Some believe Specular should be part of that mix, but I’m telling you this: Specular represents a different surface, oil and/or moisture on the skin, and should be considered to be a separate surface within that shader.

This is not true of solid materials that do not have SubSurface Scattering.  Carefully consider the surface you are creating when setting up your shader.  Metal should have no SSS, but Diffuse and Specular and perhaps some reflection.

Cloth should have Diffuse, Specular and SSS.

Concrete depends on if it’s shiny or rough.  Rough will have no reflective qualities, but shiny probably should.

What the goal of this thread is: To be the GOTO thread for understanding Shaders in 3Delight under controlled conditions (shared light sets or easily set up light sets).

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Posted: 03 May 2013 02:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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Okay.

This render used this light set: http://www.sharecg.com/v/69039/view/21/DAZ-Studio/WC-3Delight-Baseline-Test-Lighting

The materials settings are as follows:

Hair UberSurface Shader: Diffuse Strength 15% (used Specular Map), Diffuse Roughness: 2.0.  Specular Strength: 40% (used Specular Map for strength), Subsurface Strength: 45% (used displacement map for strength)

Skin: UberSurface Shader: Diffuse Strength (used colour map for strenth): 50%, Subsurface Strength: 100% (used Lana specmap for strength), Specular Strength: 100% (used Lana Specmap for strength)

The colour maps are basically VBon2000 Bonnie.

I know, I know, I broke the rules regarding SSS+Diffuse on the skin, so SUE me…  However, on the clothing I absolutely adheared to them.  For more shiney parts, like her belt, I have the spec at 90% and the diffuse at 10%.  For the jeans, I have Diff: 30%, Spec: 20% and SSS: 50%.  Not at all happy with the top… so I’ll not bother reporting that…

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Posted: 03 May 2013 03:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Um, Wancow, I only see a png in the archive -_-

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Posted: 03 May 2013 03:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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Thanks Kattey, fixed smile

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Posted: 03 May 2013 03:46 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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And now I only see duf file ^^”
(but I can make my own png)

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Posted: 03 May 2013 05:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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I disagree slightly with your initial conditions, wancow.  Specular is part of the equation.  But its a niggly point.

Mind sharing your thoughts on the lights?

I think you have too many for a simple test.  Why the addition of a specular light? Are your three point lights set to diffuse only?

I would drop your fill light, drop the specular light and keep just your main light, back light and UE.  What is the UE set for? And have you enclosed your scene in some solid geometry? Believe it or not, these things MATTER.  Try it and see.

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Posted: 03 May 2013 05:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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The Specular light is there because I don’t get enough specular on my renders.  You can disagree with me all you want to BUT YOU WOULD BE WRONG AND I WOULD BE RIGHT SO DEAL WITH IT!!!!!
raspberryraspberry:P:P:P:P

The only had and fast rules are that your lights and materials be re-creatable by everyone…  If you’re setting up different lights, please post those somewhere or give us the relevant data to be able to build them ourselves… I find it easier just to post them.

The deal with specular on the skin, you’d have adifficult time convincing me I’m wrong on that, but a reeely great render might do it. raspberry

UE2 simulates ambient light.  I like the results I get with it, that’s why I use it in the vast majority of my renders.  Oh yes, I’m well aware they matter… smile

I don’t need you guys to USE my lights, but I do want them available to show how I got my results…  Believe me, you post light sets for a baseline on what you’re doing, I will grab them faster almost than you can upload them smile

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Posted: 03 May 2013 05:33 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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This couch was posted on ShareCG by FreeFashion: http://www.sharecg.com/v/68822/browse/21/DAZ-Studio/The-70s-couch-with-armchairs

Same lightset as my render of Sam above: http://www.sharecg.com/v/69039/browse/21/DAZ-Studio/WC-3Delight-Baseline-Test-Lighting

Okay, applied UberSurface to all three material groups.  Applied the Diffuse Texture to the Specular Strength on all three material groups and left the rest where it was.  Diffuse: 20% Strength, Specular 80% Strength.  Both set to white colour with the colour map only on the diffuse channel.

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Posted: 03 May 2013 06:24 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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hmmmmmm

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Posted: 03 May 2013 06:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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Evilded, this won’t work unless you tell us the settings smile

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Posted: 03 May 2013 06:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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but does it warrant it? I have only my own judgment, and that is biased.

I seek outside verification of the worthiness of my attempt smile

//only being a little cheeky.  seriously, I think its good, but I’m not a good judge of myself.

Two distant lights, one main and one back/rim.  Main light pale yellow, turned down to 70% intensity; ray traced shadows with some blur and lower shadow bias.  back light pure white 100% intensity. UE light set to occlusion w/soft shadows, pale blue in color 60% intensity with about 50% indirect light as well.

David 5 with JM’s Gunnar textures. HSS. Diffuse around 70% with the colors maps and pure white diffuse color, diffuse color pure white, diffuse roughness .85 (I went the other way from you, as skin has a broad diffuse reflectance like the primary specular).  Both specular channels in use, specular maps applied to both. Specular color pure white (skin reflects WHITE, its not METAL… metal is about the only substance that tints its reflections), first spec about 40% str, 10% glossiness; sec spec 25% str, 15% gloss, 30% sharp.  Velvet ON, greenish-blue color, 20% str 15% falloff.  Fresnel On, settings off… so I am not going to post them.  SSS color maps in SSS color with pure white color; str 30%, ref 1.4, scale 1.

Large cylinder primitive with a neutral gray diffuse color enclosing the figure.

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Posted: 03 May 2013 06:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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It’s very much worth it!  I doubt I have that texture set, but I think Philip is pretty close… would love to see if I can get the exact same results.

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Posted: 03 May 2013 06:54 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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wancow - 03 May 2013 06:42 PM

It’s very much worth it!  I doubt I have that texture set, but I think Philip is pretty close… would love to see if I can get the exact same results.

thanks, you’ll find that my specular settings are pretty close to M5 Phillip out of the box, except for the color.  Get rid of that blue (?) specular. BUT, each texture set is different.  I have a jumping off point that I tweak from there depending on how the textures react to the light I am working with (and sometimes you gotta change the light if it ain’t working.)

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Posted: 03 May 2013 07:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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Slightly refined, with better render quality as well.

Are his damn nostrils glowing?!

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Posted: 03 May 2013 07:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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wancow - 03 May 2013 02:30 PM

30% Diffuse - 70% SSS.”

“30% Diffuse - 70% SSS” threw me off for a bit, that symbol - at first I thought it to mean minus?
I think you are stating if we use only 30% diffuse, we will need to have 70% SSS so 30% + 70% = 100% correct?
If this were the case, wouldn’t black white and gray SSS strength textures throw the equation out of balance?

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Posted: 03 May 2013 07:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]
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Yes they would… What I could do, I suppose, is make a negative for the diffuse and apply that map, that should balance it out…

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