Problems editing Genesis in Blender

drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
edited December 1969 in Technical Help (nuts n bolts)

Basically that. Is there some way to create a Genesis .obj that can actually be edited in Blender? When I bring one in, it won't allow me to go into edit. I actually managed to do some rigging in one, but it doesn't weight map properly and forget about bending, although the bones will torque the figure violently out of shape.

What am I doing wrong?

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Comments

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    Basically that. Is there some way to create a Genesis .obj that can actually be edited in Blender? When I bring one in, it won't allow me to go into edit. I actually managed to do some rigging in one, but it doesn't weight map properly and forget about bending, although the bones will torque the figure violently out of shape.

    What am I doing wrong?

    Right-click on it after import to select the imported obj before you can go to edit mode.


    It's not going to import with rigging. The obj format doesn't hold that information, just the vert and material groups. There have been scripts to supposedly do it with the collada format but so far they don't seem to work with complex bipeds (I tried one back in Gen 4).

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Sheeeeesh!

    Thanx, Sickle Yield. That much I already knew. (Been practicing and studying both DS and now Blender) What it turned out to be was the need to select all the sections independently with Shift held down, then CTL + J in object mode. That may clear up other problems with rigging too.

    I had a decent reply typed up, then the site lost it for me. Have to remember to copy what I post to the clipboard. For some odd reason, when I do that simple act, the editor doesn't lose my work.


    Any good links to the Deviant Art forums? It's been recommended to me.

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    No, what you need to do is import with "keep vert order" checked and "split" turned off so you don't have to mess with ctrl+J (that's going to give you an ugly unwelded mesh).


    I'm not really on the DA forums, so I can't help you there. I guess I've always assumed Poser and DAZ users were a small group compared to others and there wouldn't be much relevant to my interests compared to here.

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    That makes sense about the forums.

    As for the import/export: That, I imagine, is what I was fishing for. Outbound settings. I'll give that a whirl... even though I'm gradually getting the hang of sculpting faces in Blender.

    I had suspected settings might cause the issue.

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Unfortunately, upon exporting, those settings were not in the dialog box...

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    Unfortunately, upon exporting, those settings were not in the dialog box...

    Because those are settings for importing the obj to Blender, not exporting from anything.

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Alright...

    I guess my psychic powers are a little bent ghoulee today...

    I'll try that.

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    Alright...

    I guess my psychic powers are a little bent ghoulee today...

    I'll try that.

    My original post says "import." I'm not sure why psychic powers are required.

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    A new pair of bifocals might help...

    I see that now. I also did that correctly this time and, yes, not only did that work, but I noticed it gave me the option of orienting the object to load right-side-up.

    Now I'll have to work at rigging Genesis in Blender. Probably should try a few more simpler models first, but I've been making some headway on rigging things...

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 5,298
    edited December 1969

    I'm just beginning to learn about Blender. This is useful info. So Shay, you use Blender to make all your fabulous stuff for Genesis? If so I might be bugging you ALLOT!

    RUN, far far away! :P

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    RAMWolff said:
    I'm just beginning to learn about Blender. This is useful info. So Shay, you use Blender to make all your fabulous stuff for Genesis? If so I might be bugging you ALLOT!

    RUN, far far away! :P

    I sure do. Blender is a persnickety and heavily hotkey-dependant interface, but once you take time to learn it, it's incredibly powerful. The 2.5 series are so, so much better than things were back when I started out, especially as regards the sculpt tools. And in the new versions it hardly ever crashes (which, from what I hear, is in no way true of Hexagon).


    The only thing it really doesn't do well that I wish it did is facilitate painting across UVs and baking between them. That's why I keep going ZBRUSH ZBRUSH WE WANTS IT when this topic comes up - when I've created character sets I've had to use a merchant resource and touch up seams in a 2d program, and it's fiddly and a pain.

  • daveleitz68daveleitz68 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    When I import a genesis figure into Blender I use the mcjTeleBlender script by Casual that you can look up in the Freepository section of the forums. The script also purports to convert DAZ materials into Cycles nodes, but I find the implementation very, very limited. Given time I may figure out a way to create OSL ubersurface shader nodes for Cycles out of DAZ RSL shaders, but that is a possible future project depending on my time and interest. In the mean time I've just been experimenting with my own node groups which are not too difficult to figure out and assign to imported scenes.

    As far as changing the shape, I have no problems pushing verts and sculpting on figures, hair, clothes, etc. The mcjTB script is easier than the basic OBJ export option in DS4.5 in that respect. However, rigging an imported character is a major project. I've got a Blender Foundation DVD on 'Humane Rigging,' but I have not attempted to go that far yet. In order to properly rig and set up shape keys, it is a good idea to have some animation experience. For that I also highly recommend the 'Blender Animation Toolkit' DVD available at the Blender Foundation and Blender Cookie.

    In the mean time, however, I've resorted to using Blender shape keys to store poses of figures that I have already set up with materials. I pose in DS and export with mcjTB. I save that file with the new pose and open my figure 'library' .blend file. I append the new posed figure to the library file and then add a shape key. I can't explain it here, so just look up the tutorial video...
    http://cgcookie.com/blender/2013/03/22/non-destructive-modeling-with-shape-keys-in-blender/

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Hi fellows,

    This what I've been learning: There are good tuts and ones that suck because they are poorly planned. Those ( with DAZ, too) are more like hand waving than real teaching. VscorpianaC has a plethora of tuts on YouTube. She is very mindful of the student's needs, zooming in to show where one is to click, in lieu of leaving it all a blur on a postage stamp. I watched, and learned from, one of her tuts on modeling with a background image in UV space. Now I'm on to modeling a human cephelon (brain.)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUyu50EyjrI

    One of the first things I learned was through the Blenderwiki "Your first animation" tut. That didn't completely sink in till I went to www.blendercourse.com and downloaded that pdf. Between those I learned the need to know when to use the LMB, MMB, Wheel & (most important) RMB. RMB selects and remembering what modes do just what is a good bit of getting on one's way.

    Once exploring edit mode, all those in grained, I was able to model a skyscraper in all of 10 minutes. In sculpt I've been able to use Dynamic Topology/symmetrize and Mirror/Symmetry to sculpt heads. One has to remember not to confuse DAZ conventions with those of Blender. It's no problem, though, to use d-formers in DAZ to get, say, a symmetrical valley in a plane to become a city per se, then to bring it into Blender and work it over. Blender allows us to select a single face, then delete or subdivide it. DAZ does not, or I haven't learned how just yet.

  • daveleitz68daveleitz68 Posts: 0
    edited April 2013

    Between those I learned the need to know when to use the LMB, MMB, Wheel & (most important) RMB. RMB selects and remembering what modes do just what is a good bit of getting on one's way.

    Starting in Blender 2.5 I set up the controls the way I like them. I do NOT select with the right mouse button in the viewport. So counterintuitive and ridiculous a thing that I still can't believe that they set that as default behavior. Especially since I use a pen tablet quite a bit. Fortunately, those are easy to change. I also made it slightly harder to change the location of the 3D cursor by adding 'Alt' to my 'right click.' My 'right click' is now basically just a way to cancel potential location, rotation, or scale changes in the 3D viewport. 'Left click' selects and moves. 'Middle click' with CTRL and SHIFT rotates, zooms, and pans the view. I've even set up DAZ Studio to the same viewport settings I have in Blender using the 'middle click,' CTRL, and SHIFT keys. Of course, everyone has their personal preferences.

    Post edited by daveleitz68 on
  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    One thing I learned in that "first animation" tut is that an object, the head in that case, moves along with the rigging controls even though there are no vertices included in their weight map regions. I'm assuming, at this point, as long as the object is parented to the body, it will still be affected by the controls that control the limbs. This may have an advantage that would act like tendons and muscles, thus a more complex figure, composed of more than a single mesh object, might provide more graceful control.

    I am still learning with the default preferences. I'm sure I'll need to change that s time goes on, but I personally have no problem with right click selecting. Maybe that will change someday.

  • GeddGedd Posts: 2,444
    edited April 2013

    If you aren't having problems with it I would suggest sticking with it as the 3d cursor does come in handy in some advanced areas. It basically is like giving another dimension to your ability to select and interact. Some people never get comfortable with the 3d cursor either though.

    Post edited by Gedd on
  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Hmmmm...

    What are you defining as a 3D cursor? I'm using the arrow, a box or a circle. Are you meaning that the cursor moves in 3D's?

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited April 2013

    Hmmmm...

    What are you defining as a 3D cursor? I'm using the arrow, a box or a circle. Are you meaning that the cursor moves in 3D's?

    I'm pretty sure that's a widget. The "3d Cursor" in Blender is a tiny circle with four lines intersecting it, like a crosshair. It is most useful for recentering objects or snapping them to world center (that's what I use it for, anyway). When you use add-mesh, the object added will be snapped to the 3d cursor regardless of the cursor's scene position. Shift-S gives you your controls for it or snapping objects to it.

    Post edited by SickleYield on
  • niccipbniccipb Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Hi...

    You can also use the 3D cursor as the center for translations, such as using it as the pivot point to rotate a whole object or just a set of selected vertices or faces.... you just set the median point as the 3D cursor instead of the default which is I believe an average of the currently selected vertices... you can change this on the Tool shelf at the bottom of the viewport...

    nicci... :)

  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    niccipb said:
    Hi...

    You can also use the 3D cursor as the center for translations, such as using it as the pivot point to rotate a whole object or just a set of selected vertices or faces.... you just set the median point as the 3D cursor instead of the default which is I believe an average of the currently selected vertices... you can change this on the Tool shelf at the bottom of the viewport...

    nicci... :)

    <--What she said.

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited April 2013

    That much I had... Just wasn't certain what Gedd was referring to. Now I know... :)

    Yes. I like that. DAZ is similar in that respect.

    I, too find it convenient. Wish it was active in sculpt mode.

    Post edited by drcharbonneau on
  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited April 2013

    Since we have a sort of ad hoc Blender discussion going here, I've been playing with texture paint, but I'm missing something. What I'm wanting to do is apply a different texture to each face, or a group of faces, on a single object, for example, a rusty metal on the top, distressed wood on three sides and glass on the fourth... maybe even something for nosey people that might look on the bottom.

    Is this possible? If so how?

    I imagine I could make a cube out of separate planes as separate objects, but it seems as though Blender should have thought of this long ago and provided a method.


    Oh... BTW, cgcookie wants cash to download much of their tuts.

    Post edited by drcharbonneau on
  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    Since we have a sort of ad hoc Blender discussion going here, I've been playing with texture paint, but I'm missing something. What I'm wanting to do is apply a different texture to each face, or a group of faces, on a single object, for example, a rusty metal on the top, distressed wood on three sides and glass on the fourth... maybe even something for nosey people that might look on the bottom.

    Is this possible? If so how?

    I imagine I could make a cube out of separate planes as separate objects, but it seems as though Blender should have thought of this long ago and provided a method.


    Oh... BTW, cgcookie wants cash to download much of their tuts.

    BlenderCoookie is free.


    It sounds like you're wanting to use materials assignment. http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Doc:2.6/Manual/Materials/Assigning_a_material


    With each one on a different mat zone you can then assign separate materials, UVs and textures to them if you wish.

  • daveleitz68daveleitz68 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Quite a few very useful and well made tutorial videos are free at Blender Cookie. While I'm not a 'citizen' myself, I think the price they ask for full access is very reasonable.

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited April 2013

    @BlenderCookie commentary:

    Yes, some are free, but when you want to get the "punch line," part 2 video, you must pay. Yes, they are useful and some freebies are complete. As for worth, I agree, but to someone balancing a budget on a fixed income, even the lowest price is something one must plan for well ahead and obstacle events happen. When someone asks me "How are you doing, Doc?" I generally respond, "Mostly without." A doctor title doesn't always mean wealth. MD's usually are affluent. Ph.D's? Not as often. Still a free-lance...

    I'll look into that tut, SickleYield. Thanks.

    Edit:

    Went there. Read that. It appears that UV editing is the only way, still it is a way. Already have a couple tuts on UV editing, so I guess the old dude can't be lazy this time... ;)

    Post edited by drcharbonneau on
  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    @BlenderCookie commentary:

    Yes, some are free, but when you want to get the "punch line," part 2 video, you must pay. Yes, they are useful and some freebies are complete. As for worth, I agree, but to someone balancing a budget on a fixed income, even the lowest price is something one must plan for well ahead and obstacle events happen. When someone asks me "How are you doing, Doc?" I generally respond, "Mostly without." A doctor title doesn't always mean wealth. MD's usually are affluent. Ph.D's? Not as often. Still a free-lance...

    I'll look into that tut, SickleYield. Thanks.

    Well, there's also YouTube.

  • GeddGedd Posts: 2,444
    edited April 2013

    Ok, so... looking for Blender tutorials, let me see:

    Blender Guru, probably my favorite
    Blendalicious
    Blender Arsenal
    Blender Diplom
    Blender Nerd
    Born CG
    Bugzilla
    David Allen Ward
    Free Stuff Lawl
    Get Blended
    Jason Welsh, also a favorite
    Michalis Gkiokas
    The Blender Survival Guide
    Wirehead King

    And if none of those tell you what you want, just do a Google/Youtube search on Blender tutorials... it has more free training available then anything else probably other than possibly Gimp.

    Post edited by Gedd on
  • SickleYieldSickleYield Posts: 5,993
    edited December 1969

    Good list!


    My first Blender orientation was done in person, so I don't know all of the resources available. When I need to learn more about a recent feature, I usually google it, then flail around experimenting with that information until I figure it out. That's not helpful to a beginner, though - one doesn't necessarily know what words to look for.

  • drcharbonneaudrcharbonneau Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Hi Gedd,

    I agree, that's quite a list. I do the YouTube quite a bit now and have created a decent library. Certainly there's a lot more and I imagine before I'm done, I'll be putting them all on DVD's. (One reason is I'm not certain how much longer there will even BE an internet. The Mayans were correct, it would seem, where climate changes became drastic. The outer layers of the sun actually are in an "off" state as of last May. That's just the tip of the iceberg; no pun intended.)

    One thing I noticed while reading about the UV mapping was mention of Gimp. I may try that, even though the one video tut on UV mapping used Paint to texturize the map. I tend to think a trade-off is needed between vertices and the illusion of texture. I watched one video about creating a city. The fellow doing the work did well. Nonetheless, it left a good bit to be desired. I had actually modeled a skyscraper using my own technique, but I'm certain the vertices will eventually add up to a very long render if the machine wouldn't simply choke.

    Other considerations are screen real estate. To do some projects I'd like to do will simply need a 32" screen. I realized that when I started messing with modeling a cephalon, as in brain. Because brains are not symmetrical (especially artists and big thinkers) it would take six windows to do a good job: Anterior, Posterior, Right, Left, Top and Bottom. Maybe Santa will bring the other half a 40" TV so I can use the 32" for a monitor...

    Hi SickleYield,

    I'm doing basically the same as what you related. What I've been doing is making mental notes of what I have questions about, then finding the tuts. You guys have been helpful if nothing more than to suggest a page or video or method.

    I don't agree with the five year learning curve excuse though. I've been at it part time for a couple weeks now, some of that involving downloading tuts. I'd say by June or July I'll have some show and tell... :)

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 5,298
    edited December 1969

    Gedd said:
    Ok, so... looking for Blender tutorials, let me see:

    Blender Guru, probably my favorite
    Blendalicious
    Blender Arsenal
    Blender Diplom
    Blender Nerd
    Born CG
    Bugzilla
    David Allen Ward
    Free Stuff Lawl
    Get Blended
    Jason Welsh, also a favorite
    Michalis Gkiokas
    The Blender Survival Guide
    Wirehead King

    And if none of those tell you what you want, just do a Google/Youtube search on Blender tutorials... it has more free training available then anything else probably other than possibly Gimp.

    Do you mind if I copy your links over to my Blender thread? This is a fabulous list!

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