Need help with Genesis

jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
edited December 1969 in Carrara Discussion

I am relatively new to Carrara. I have been going through tutorials to learn with the goal of adding Carrara into my workflow. I am starting a new animation project and I have created a custom male figure using an M4 texture map in DS....I will be using both Carrara and DS for this animation. The problem: having a hard time getting my custom Genesis into Carrara complete and animatable. Here is what I have tried.

1 - Created a custom character preset in DS and applied it to a male Genesis figure in Carrara. Instead of creating my character, it created a second, total gray figure.

2 - Created a scene subset in DS and imported into Carrara: texture came over but lost all the morphs.

3 - Tried to import a whole scene with just a custom figure in it (duf) but errored out and would not load.

4 - Saved as collada and brought into Carrara. Texture and morphs came in and rendered beautifully but came is totally static. Can animation be brought in with collada? There is no way to move this figure.

I didn't try fbx because I have read complaints that morphs don't follow. I am at a loss here. How can I get my fully animatable custom Genesis into Carrara? I could use M4, however, the outfit I have chosen is for Genesis only and I don't see Crossdresser support for Genesis yet.

Comments

  • bighbigh Posts: 5,532
    edited December 1969

    jaebea said:
    I am relatively new to Carrara. I have been going through tutorials to learn with the goal of adding Carrara into my workflow. I am starting a new animation project and I have created a custom male figure using an M4 texture map in DS....I will be using both Carrara and DS for this animation. The problem: having a hard time getting my custom Genesis into Carrara complete and animatable. Here is what I have tried.

    1 - Created a custom character preset in DS and applied it to a male Genesis figure in Carrara. Instead of creating my character, it created a second, total gray figure.

    2 - Created a scene subset in DS and imported into Carrara: texture came over but lost all the morphs.

    3 - Tried to import a whole scene with just a custom figure in it (duf) but errored out and would not load.

    4 - Saved as collada and brought into Carrara. Texture and morphs came in and rendered beautifully but came is totally static. Can animation be brought in with collada? There is no way to move this figure.

    I didn't try fbx because I have read complaints that morphs don't follow. I am at a loss here. How can I get my fully animatable custom Genesis into Carrara? I could use M4, however, the outfit I have chosen is for Genesis only and I don't see Crossdresser support for Genesis yet.

    I use DUF from DS 4.5 - be sure to Bake the timeline before saving .
    Here is a scene - M4 Genesis from DS 4.5 to Carrara 8.5 - just did it - link

    http://youtu.be/S_wk3t0oonE

  • ManStanManStan Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    You are using the C8.5 beta right?
    Collada has been borked since studio 4 was first released. I don't expect it to get fixed.

    I've worked a lot with genesis from studio to carrara in DSF and DUF both worked fine for me. I've also got animation done in studio saved and run in carrara; too bad the dynamic clothing wont transfer in the animation. Something else that has been borked since studio 4 was released and DAZ seems disinclined to fix.

    Wish I could help, I'll do a few run throughs because I was more concerned about getting the right uvmapping then morphs. So never tried with a morphed genesis; I do that in carrara.

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,035
    edited December 1969

    HI :)

    If you're using DS4.5,. you should be able to save the figure, plus it';s clothing and textures and morphs as a DUF "scene" file.
    that will open in Carrara 8.5.

    if you have any errors in that process,. then it could be that you're using something which Carrara cannot use, like a DS plugin, or DS lighting like uber environment..

    you can also save the Figure,. as a character preset (duf),. and save the material preset (duf), and pose or animation preset (duf)

    then you can open carrara 8.5,. create a new scene and import the Duf "character",.. (which will include any morph adjustments) then select that figure, and import the material / pose / animation files

    You can also adjust a genesis figure directly in carrara,. so, you could set the morphs in carrara, rather than working in DS and importing.

    Avoiding importing and exporting between different programs is a really really good idea.

    hope it helps :)

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 6,943
    edited December 1969

    3DAGE said:
    You can also adjust a genesis figure directly in carrara,. so, you could set the morphs in carrara, rather than working in DS and importing.

    Avoiding importing and exporting between different programs is a really really good idea.

    hope it helps :)

    This is very true. I try to limit work outside of Carrara to only what cannot be done in Carrara.
    However, it sounds to me that you've actually made custom morphs? If that's the case, I would suggest looking through these pages to figure out how to actually store the content you've created in a manner that it can be sold or shared. But according to everyone else, you shouldn't have to do that... just saving using DS|4.5 should do the trick, for that.

    I'm sorry. Wish I could help. I wish I new D|S better - and I will, one day.

  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited December 1969

    So, I ended up building my character in Carrara as was suggested. I was able to save a material preset from my Genesis character in DS (M4 texture) and it applied to Genesis in Carrara perfectly! Those morphs I created were from GenX/M4. I had created a character preset in DS but it didn't work in Carrara so I tried a Shaping preset. WORKED PERFECTLY!! I am having a bit of a problem with the texture of the beard. Looks great in DS....looks like c**p in Carrara.

  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 7,704
    edited December 1969

    jaebea said:
    So, I ended up building my character in Carrara as was suggested. I was able to save a material preset from my Genesis character in DS (M4 texture) and it applied to Genesis in Carrara perfectly! Those morphs I created were from GenX/M4. I had created a character preset in DS but it didn't work in Carrara so I tried a Shaping preset. WORKED PERFECTLY!! I am having a bit of a problem with the texture of the beard. Looks great in DS....looks like c**p in Carrara.

    What looks like crap specifically. I can't help with Genesis specific issues as I'm C7.2, but shading/textures may be another animal.

  • ManStanManStan Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    jaebea said:
    So, I ended up building my character in Carrara as was suggested. I was able to save a material preset from my Genesis character in DS (M4 texture) and it applied to Genesis in Carrara perfectly! Those morphs I created were from GenX/M4. I had created a character preset in DS but it didn't work in Carrara so I tried a Shaping preset. WORKED PERFECTLY!! I am having a bit of a problem with the texture of the beard. Looks great in DS....looks like c**p in Carrara.

    Check the alpha channel in the beard shader. More then likely; just guessing, you have a color added to the alpha map, just drag and drop the alpha map right on the alpha channel.

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,035
    edited December 1969

    HI jaebea :)

    bear in mind that C8.5 is still "Beta" rather that a production version.

    There are still some issues with mapping , specifically with textures like (Philip for M5), where there are beard and moustache "overlay" images,. but these overlay textures are not the same dimensions as the face texture map,.

    best solution right now is to combine the maps you need in an image editor to make a new texture map for the face.


    I'm also guessing that the "GenX" which as I understand it,.. is a script which (converts morphs from gen4 figures to genesis) may be the reason that the scene from DS will not open in Carrara.

  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited April 2013

    @3DAGE I kept getting errors about particular morphs that could not be found and came to that same conclusion. That is why I decided to work it in Carrara as suggested. I was surprised that all morphs carried over in the shaping preset....I got up and danced a jig!!

    @Evilproducer and Manstan This beard prop didn't come with an alpha map. In DS, it just has colors plugged into different paces in its shader tree. That certainly did not translate very well in Carrara. I spent about 4 hours last night playing with it. I tried applying the hair shader into the beard and got some interesting results...not exactly what I wanted but knew I was on the right track. So I hunted down a accepted hair texture within my resources and experimented with different alpha maps. I came up with an acceptable beard. Its not good enough for close ups but then as I thought through the scenes I was going to use in Carrara, I didn't need a high level of detail.

    GenJesusCA.jpg
    640 x 480 - 161K
    Post edited by jaebea on
  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 6,943
    edited December 1969

    Looks pretty cool, actually. I'm wondering what the Highlight channel looks like. Is it possible to make the highlight darker? Like almost, if not black? That might make it better close up.

  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 7,704
    edited December 1969

    When you get a little more experience, you could try using Carrara's hair. You will find it hard to go back to prop or figure hair!

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 6,943
    edited December 1969

    True... but that dude's hair is freakin' awesome!

  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited December 1969

    @Dartanbeck Thanks! I really worked on that hair to get it looking good!

    @evilproducer I have bought a couple of the Carrara hair figures to play with. I am pretty familiar with strand based hair from Poser and I have the Garibaldi Hair too. Looking forward to playing with Carrara hair.

    @Dartanbeck About that beard....I checked the highlight and I had set it at what was set in DS...a light blue highlight. It is now black. Here is the close up of the head. It still doesn't look as nice as the one rendered in DS but it is still pretty good.

    Face.jpg
    640 x 480 - 29K
  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited December 1969

    Another question...I am trying to find instructions on saving this figure so that I can use it in several different scenes. Can anyone help me with this....or maybe tell me how to do it.

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 6,943
    edited December 1969

    Of course!
    I have a rather in-depth article in my Carrara Walkthrough regarding creating your own custom browser fro storing stuff.

    In the meantime, all you need to do is go to the 'Objects' tab and select 'My Objects' at the top of the list. Now drag the character into the browser window along the bottom of the screen there.

    Before doing so, allow me to explain a bit further, if I may:
    As mentioned in the walkthrough, this My Objects category in the browser is actually a folder that resides in the following location:
    My Documents > DAZ3D > Carrara 8 (or Carrara 8.5) > My Presets > My Objects
    (just bear with me for a sec?)
    So if you would rather save the entire scene contents as well as having all of the options available, simply go: Save As, and navigate to that folder, at which time you can create subfolders - as many as you like - and then save. This new subfolder system will now become available within that "My Objects" part of the browser. Just go to the far right, just above the browser and click on the little black page icon: "Update Folder" and your new folders will show up! :)

    More later... gotta go

  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited December 1969

    GREAT, thank you! I actually have and am watching the Carrara 8 Training Videos from Infinite Skills. I will definitely be going through your walkthrough in more detail!

  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited December 1969

    When trying to add clothing or poses, I am getting an error message that says "nil pointing error". Tried to search forum for this but couldn't find anything.

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,035
    edited April 2013

    HI :)

    What clothing item ?,.. and How are you adding it ?,.. EG: select your figure in the scene,. then double click the thumbnail icon for the Clothing item, or Drag and drop ?

    That should load the clothing onto the selected figure,. and conform the clothing to that figure.

    if you don't have anything selected in the scene,.. then the clothing item will load into the default position (Scene zero) when you double click.


    Also,. is the clothing made for the figure you're using,...or....

    more info, or pics of what you're doing can help.

    DS Dynamic clothing ?..... (this needs to be simulated using DS).


    some of this stuff may be helpful.

    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7907045/Carrara_first_steps.zip

    Post edited by 3DAGE on
  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited December 1969

    Genesis clothing for the Genesis figure. I double clicked...nil pointing error..(with the figure selected, double clicking on the clothing item has never worked for me)....dragged and dropped onto figure..nil pointing error...dragged and dropped onto the names of the figures on the "scene tree"...worked only when I dropped it onto the word "actor". Never could get the pose to work. I have watched the Infinite Skills DVD for this, following instructions. Its not rocket science to add clothing and poses. I have worked in Poser for 12years and DS for 5 years o I don't get this problem. This figure is the one I have been working on. I saved in into the the object file. He is now in a scene and the program seems to be behaving differently with him in the scene then when he was alone.

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,035
    edited December 1969

    Hi :)

    I was going to ask what specific clothing items,. but it sounds like you're getting this same error whatever you try,. which isn't good,. and isn't normal.....

    So,.. let's try something different.. house-keeping :)

    Go to your Daz temp folder,. which should be in ( My Documents / Daz3D / DazTmp ) on a windows system.

    Make sure you're not running Carrara or DS,... and if there are any files in that temp folder,.. delete them.

    Then open Carrara,. load your scene and try to load the clothing.

    Double click should work,. (it's the standard way to load items) and shouldn't give you an error,. at worst, it should do nothing (if it's a mat or pose and you don't have a figure selected)

    Even is you have an empty scene, you should be able to double click a figure or clothing item in the browser and it'll load into the scene.

    Genesis is structurally different from V4 etc.. and the way it works in carrara is different. so following a tut using V4 may be confusing if you're working with genesis.

    With Genesis, you have the "Character name", then the "Figure" or Model level,. then the "Actor" level, then the Hip etc...

    you should select the "Figure" level,. then load your clothing item from the browser
    This will add it to the main "Character name" level,. so that the figure and clothing are all in a group.

    With V4 and previous figures,. you have the "figure" or "Character name" level, then the "Model" level, then the Hip etc...
    You should select the main "Figure" or "Character name" level,.. then load clothing or poses etc.

    But,.. if you're having errors whenever you double click on items in the browser,.. there may be other issues,. as that should be the normal way to work in Carrara, Poser and DS, and it shouldn't give you an error.

    but I'd need a lot of info about your system and specific items and work-flow to even begin to figure that out,...
    So,... with a new bet version on the horizon,.. my advice would be to hang on,. try the next beta,. and see if you still have the same issues.

    On using genesis,. and saving it in a scene....

    When you load genesis into carrara, it treats it more like a "Native" figure,. than an imported poser figure. so, when you save a scene with genesis,. it saves the "model" geometry for genesis, as it would if you had built a model in carrara.
    so, it kind of becomes a carrara figure. so,. it's possible that it seems to work differently for you in a saved scene,. but I'm not sure exactly what you mean by

    He is now in a scene and the program seems to be behaving differently with him in the scene then when he was alone.


    behaving differently ..how?

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 6,943
    edited December 1969

    Here's a cool tip.
    You know how it seems to take forever when you first load genesis? That's really the only time for that session. Subsequent loading of Genesis are like a hot knife going through butter. I've also been noticing that, even with my cool orc shaders in place and having five of them run through a surface replicator,making bunches of them, they seem really friendly with Open GL and Carrara's render engine.

  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited December 1969

    Cleared the DS Temp file (there was a couple of things in there). Loaded my scene, selected the figure level (Genesis) and double clicked my clothing item (a Genesis tunic) and up pops the following error: "A nil pointer error has occurred. File: DsfParameter.h, Line:464" Usually, it doesn't say File or Line so that's a bit different. If I select the top name or "Actor" and double-click, the tunic comes in but I can't see it. Its loaded as the last item on the list. I am closing my scene and going to try all of this on my Genesis figure by himself....

    Ok, the clothing would only load when I selected Basic Male at the top of the list. Can't select the textures in DS. Guess I will have to load them manually. Now, with the figure alone, I can get a pose applied (M4 pose..Genesis poses won't load) but no matter how I parent the clothing, it will not follow the figure. The naked figure poses and the clothing stays in the T pose. Very frustrating. :(

  • 3DAGE3DAGE Posts: 2,035
    edited December 1969

    HI :)

    You should regularly clear out the Daz temp folder,. especially if you're getting crashes,. since that leaves a partial temp file.

    AFAIK some DS shaders may not be in duf format,. depending on what version of DS you're using,. if you're using DIM you can check to see if there are any updates, or check what format the files you have are.

    If you're using DS4.5,. then you can load the clothing , apply the textures, and save the "Material preset"
    as duf,. the select your clothing in carrara, and Import the DUF material preset.
    that'll apply the mats' to the item or figure.

    Because Carrara's shader engine is different from DS,. you;ll probably want to make some minor adjustments to the imported DS shaders, so that they work better in carrara.
    Normally the Highlight and Shininess channels ned too be adjusted,. but you should also have some Carrara shader, (high res shaders for M4 / V4) which you can look at, as a good example of the settings you should have in a skin shader.


    Normally,. you would Select the figure in the carrara scene list,. browse for the clothing,. then double click to apply it to the selected figure, and it should "Automatically" be set to "Fit to" that figure. (pic 1)

    If it doesn't, ...or, ..you didn't have a figure selected,. then you can select the clothing item,. and you'll see a "Fit to" drop down menu, where you can select your figure. (pic 2)

    When you select the Clothing item. the Smart content browser should change to show you the materials which apply to that selected item.

    (if that's not happening for you) then I'd need to know the specific clothing you're using. so i can check it.

    If you're getting an error when you load a specific clothing item,. then is could suggest an issue with that item.

    Try another item, to see whether it's that one item which has a problem, or all items.

    if you get an issue when loading all items, then it would suggest that something else is going on.

    If you're not seeing the materials for a clothing item. when you select it,. check that the DAZ Content Management Service is running.


    Genesis poses should be applying to genesis figures, (pic 3)

    if you have nothing selected,. or the wrong thing selected,. then the pose / item won't apply,. but it can currently leave an entry at the bottom of the scene instance list,.. this should be deleted, since it's not really there. .. also,.. go to EDIT / Remove unused / objects / shaders,. (just to tidy that up)
    then select your figure and apply the pose.

    M4 poses (in duf format) will also apply to a genesis figure,. but the bone structure and joint limits are different, so it's more than likely that the Gen4 pose will not work well on a Gen5 figure.


    hope it helps :)

    pose_gen1_.jpg
    1280 x 1024 - 285K
    cloth_gen_2.jpg
    1280 x 1024 - 224K
    cloth_gen_1.jpg
    1280 x 1024 - 292K
  • jaebeajaebea Posts: 296
    edited December 1969

    By nature, I am a problem solver, so when something doesn't work, I will try it a different way. I selected Genesis and doubleclicked and when it didn't work, I selected model, then Actor and so on. Genesis poses would not work no matter what I did. M4 poses worked but would not include the clothing. After hours of frustration last night, I am giving up on Genesis in Carrara for now. I brought my custom M4 into Carrara without a problem. He works perfectly with clothing and poses.
    Thanks for your patience and help!! I am sure I will be coming back with more Carrara questions.

    I took advantage of the tutorial sale yesterday and bought the Advanced Carrara Techniques although I'm not quite there yet. :)

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