@ DAZ install manager: Why was there a need to create a new "public" default installation location?

linvanchenelinvanchene Posts: 617
edited November 2013 in Daz Studio Discussion

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  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 7,758
    edited December 1969

    An easy one to answer...the content used to be installed 'system wide'. With Vista, the preferred location became the user's individual profile. Of course, you could by using a custom install put it in the Public (All users) profile. The content license is pretty much a 'site' license. All this does is restore the old behavior of installing the content system wide.

  • linvanchenelinvanchene Posts: 617
    edited November 2013

    edited and removed by user

    Post edited by linvanchene on
  • mjc1016mjc1016 Posts: 7,758
    edited December 1969

    It is Windows that forced the change. With Vista, they changed the default behavior of almost 20 yrs (18). (Actually almost 25 yrs if you go back to DOS.)

    But the content is licensed for the system, so it actually makes sense to, as a default, install it system wide...which is the way it used to be. And no it isn't really 'public'. The Public profile in Windows is the old 'All Users' profile. It is still 'local' and under the full restrictions of the machine. That was one of my big complaints about DS4...the license and the default install behavior did not agree. Using the 'Public'/'All Users' profile should have been done from the start., as that's the proper location for installing something system wide.

    And I suspect that there is also a practical side to this...UAE, security software, account restrictions and what not are probably easier to deal with using a default of the 'All Users' than individual user accounts.

    And no, the content is NOT completely tied to a path. A properly written dsf/duf file uses relative paths that use the default library locations as provided by DS itself as the 'starting point'. So, if the default path changes, then it's no problem, as long as the content within that doesn't change...so moving from My Library to My DAZ3d Library doesn't really matter as long as what is within the two is still the same after the change and DS is aware of it. There are more problems WITH hard coded paths than there are with files that have changed 'default library' locations.

  • edited December 1969

    Where do we find this "Install Manager?"

  • DAZ_SpookyDAZ_Spooky Posts: 1,950
    edited December 1969

    First: That is the default path, and as stated by mjc1016, better agrees with the EULA.
    Second: While it is the default path, there is no requirement to use the default path, if for some reason that path does not suit.
    Third: If a item of content is using absolute paths, it is broken, and needs to be reported in the bug tracker. All Content should be using relative paths.

  • DAZ_SpookyDAZ_Spooky Posts: 1,950
    edited December 1969

    Where do we find this "Install Manager?"

    You still have to wait until it is actually released. :)

  • adamr001adamr001 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks Spooky :)

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,878
    edited December 1969

    DAZ has always permitted members of a household to share content - you don't need a separate license for each family member who does 3D, at least as long as they are living at home.

  • namretteknamrettek Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    When is this Install Manager coming out? Anyone know?

    I just got an email about PC members getting the DIM soon, but I am no longer a PC member.

    When do the rest of us get this DIM?

    I may not be a PC member any more, but I did BUY DS4 Pro...

    I've been waiting for this to install DS4 on my new hard drive!!

  • CypherFOXCypherFOX Posts: 2,342
    edited February 2013

    Greetings,
    Wait...the video about 'integrate Install Manager with existing content installations? (MAC)' doesn't...actually...address the elephant in the room, which is whether it will work to point the install manager to the CURRENT directory that stuff is installed in.

    Instead he cancels out of the process at that point, leaving me...unsure if it'd work, or if it's not valid at all.

    See, I'm not like some who have TB of stuff, but I do have about 100G of content. Some of it is free stuff, some of it is from other places, but it's all installed to my single 'My Library' content tree.

    If I download updates or reset downloads for items, it's going to duplicate them if I add a second content tree that ends up having the same stuff.

    So...what DOES happen if we point it to our existing 'My Library' tree?

    -- Morgan

    p.s. I suppose the answer may be "...dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"

    Post edited by CypherFOX on
  • linvanchenelinvanchene Posts: 617
    edited November 2013

    edited and removed by user

    Post edited by linvanchene on
  • PendraiaPendraia Posts: 2,524
    edited December 1969

    I haven't watched the videos yet, I'm hoping someone can confirm for me if it is still possible to use an external hard drive for your content folder. If I've read Spooky's post correctly I think I can, if I can't I'm not going to be interested in using it and can't see a point in watching videos on something I won't be using.

    I'm hoping that I have read it correctly and you can use an external hard drive. Can someone please confirm this?

    Thanks

    Pen

  • Alisa Uh-LisaAlisa Uh-Lisa Posts: 1,248
    edited December 1969

    I've absolutely ZERO interest in this, because I want to control what and where all my content goes.

    So my question is this - is there any plan to fix the download mess that's been in existence since the new site started, where we can't select JUST windows or JUST mac stuff, and where finding something to redownload is a bit of a challenge? Or is this new shiny toy going to mean "use it or tough luck"?

  • edited December 1969

    yes indeed,i think i keep my hands away form this feature.
    i install manually since years and i know exactly where my folders are and i have my runtimes structured the way i want and i dont have any file conflicts,i keep mine the way it is.

    and i do hope we still have the option of not using the dim once it is out in the open.otherwise bye bye daz.i get¡ tired of playing games really.

    Pendraia said:
    I haven't watched the videos yet, I'm hoping someone can confirm for me if it is still possible to use an external hard drive for your content folder. If I've read Spooky's post correctly I think I can, if I can't I'm not going to be interested in using it and can't see a point in watching videos on something I won't be using.

    I'm hoping that I have read it correctly and you can use an external hard drive. Can someone please confirm this?

    Thanks

    Pen

  • edited December 1969

    you are just like me.when having a huge content i want to know where my content is and i dont let any managing feature interfering.

    i know exactly on what computer is what file (more or less) and i have myself 3 workstations 2 laptops and my wife has her own machine of course. and i install all manually and always custom installation never use default (recommended)option.

    i usually change my pc every two years (yes i am crazy lol) and i never lost a single file that way.
    i just take my harddisk with the runtime build it in in the new pc (or clone it onto another drive)build it in and point in the daz preferences to the specific location of the folder.
    that way when i start daz the content shows up.

    ok i love an leave you for now (lol.

    I've absolutely ZERO interest in this, because I want to control what and where all my content goes.

    So my question is this - is there any plan to fix the download mess that's been in existence since the new site started, where we can't select JUST windows or JUST mac stuff, and where finding something to redownload is a bit of a challenge? Or is this new shiny toy going to mean "use it or tough luck"?

  • MadbatMadbat Posts: 287
    edited December 1969

    Yup, I have zero interest in this thing. I really wish Daz would dump the exe's altogether and just use zip files.

  • edited December 1969

    hi shawn bro glad to meet ya here,i bet its cold in canada..i knew somehow you would agree with me lol.

  • edited December 1969

    i spend more time searching for something i dont have already and where i can use my voucher on.before the one was able to use the voucher on all items except pc of course.

  • MadbatMadbat Posts: 287
    edited December 1969

    hi shawn bro glad to meet ya here,i bet its cold in canada..i knew somehow you would agree with me lol.

    Of course I agree with you bro lol! I don't mind the idea of a download manager, TESNexus uses one for it's mod content and it works just fine, but Games like Skyrim/Oblivion and whatnot have very definite default directories. Daz content tends to wind up all over the place.

    Cold here? Nah, not anymore. It jumped from -25c to +1 as of right now....whups, I lie, it's 0c right now.

  • creativemodelsbecreativemodelsbe Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Where do we find this "Install Manager?"

    You still have to wait until it is actually released. :)

    any launch date?

    this month, next month, around summer, next year,...?

  • KeryaKerya Posts: 7,237
    edited February 2013

    Question: is it possible to use it just for downloading?
    And then installing (renaming folders and so on) myself?
    Will it find updated files in this case?


    Edited: default C:\ - are you kidding? My c:\ drive is an SSD ... and I am sure I am not the only person to have an SSD for C: and a "normal" harddrive as D:\ for content.

    Post edited by Kerya on
  • edited December 1969

    its in any case a brilliant stupoid idea to install such things on as sytem drive wether it is ssd or not.the system drive belongs to my system and to applications which definitely need to have it on c drive..
    but i dont allow software toduse this drive.
    i am doing this since 20 years and i have not lost a single important file if i recall right.
    even when my system crashes i build up another one reinstall my applications (core base) and can use my own stuff (runtime,filters,whatever) like if nothing has happened.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,878
    edited December 1969

    I've absolutely ZERO interest in this, because I want to control what and where all my content goes.

    So my question is this - is there any plan to fix the download mess that's been in existence since the new site started, where we can't select JUST windows or JUST mac stuff, and where finding something to redownload is a bit of a challenge? Or is this new shiny toy going to mean "use it or tough luck"?

    The content will move to zips, as I understand it - that was publicly stated some time ago - so there won't be mac and Windows files, just a single zip.

    --------------------------------

    Note that a default path is the one that appears when the thing is first run - Spooky said, on the first page, that users could use a different path if they wished and although I don't think he specified I imagine it will remember the last path used or even keep a list of paths, so once you have told it not to use the C: drive or the Shared folder it should not do so.

  • Alisa Uh-LisaAlisa Uh-Lisa Posts: 1,248
    edited December 1969

    I've absolutely ZERO interest in this, because I want to control what and where all my content goes.

    So my question is this - is there any plan to fix the download mess that's been in existence since the new site started, where we can't select JUST windows or JUST mac stuff, and where finding something to redownload is a bit of a challenge? Or is this new shiny toy going to mean "use it or tough luck"?

    The content will move to zips, as I understand it - that was publicly stated some time ago - so there won't be mac and Windows files, just a single zip.
    .

    Thanks - I have to admit I have almost no faith in what Daz does and says anymore, So many things are messed up since this new site came out and there have been so many promises of things that will improve that haven't, so I've just about given up hope that anything will become better. If they keep with their word and DO start using zips (which we were told a year ago would happen), that will be nice.

    But what worries me is that EVERY other store uses zip files and they don't require a download and installation manager to install them. So I have major fears that something about this new installation manager will mess things up for those not using it :(

  • DAZ_SpookyDAZ_Spooky Posts: 1,950
    edited December 1969

    Where do we find this "Install Manager?"

    You still have to wait until it is actually released. :)

    any launch date?

    this month, next month, around summer, next year,...?

    Yes there is a launch date. No I am not going to announce it. :)

  • Satira CapriccioSatira Capriccio Posts: 522
    edited December 1969

    Why is it advised against installing to the folder where our content is currently located?

    How does this work for those of us who use Poser and do not keep our content in the DAZ Studio structure? (My Documents / DAZ 3D/ Studio / My Library / Runtime)

    Will the DAZ install manager have the option to install content in the Poser Runtime structure rather than the DAZ Studio structure? I don't use DAZ Studio so don't want my 3D Content folder cluttered with the DAZ Studio folders (Animals, Camera Presets, data, DAZ Studio Tutorials, Figures, Light Presets, Lights, People, Poses, Presets, Props, ReadMes, RTR, Scenes, Scripts, Shader Presets, Shaders, Uninstallers) when all I need is the Runtime folder.

    I'm pretty sure content will be installed in that DAZ Studio structure, so I doubt I'll want to install content through the DAZ Install Manager to my Runtimes. I'm sure it's going to require as much (if not more) cleanup as the zip files do, and it's far better to do that in a temp folder.

    I can see where this will make things easier on those who don't want to control how their content is organized, but it doesn't seem to be flexible enough for those of us who don't use DAZ Studio.


    First: That is the default path, and as stated by mjc1016, better agrees with the EULA.
    Second: While it is the default path, there is no requirement to use the default path, if for some reason that path does not suit.
    Third: If a item of content is using absolute paths, it is broken, and needs to be reported in the bug tracker. All Content should be using relative paths.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,878
    edited December 1969

    I've absolutely ZERO interest in this, because I want to control what and where all my content goes.

    So my question is this - is there any plan to fix the download mess that's been in existence since the new site started, where we can't select JUST windows or JUST mac stuff, and where finding something to redownload is a bit of a challenge? Or is this new shiny toy going to mean "use it or tough luck"?

    The content will move to zips, as I understand it - that was publicly stated some time ago - so there won't be mac and Windows files, just a single zip.
    .

    Thanks - I have to admit I have almost no faith in what Daz does and says anymore, So many things are messed up since this new site came out and there have been so many promises of things that will improve that haven't, so I've just about given up hope that anything will become better. If they keep with their word and DO start using zips (which we were told a year ago would happen), that will be nice.

    But what worries me is that EVERY other store uses zip files and they don't require a download and installation manager to install them. So I have major fears that something about this new installation manager will mess things up for those not using it :(

    The only issue with the zips we have so far is that everything is in a folder called Content - butt hen, Renderosity and a lot of freebie makers do that too. The Install Manager is an option, not something you have to use if you want to get all butch hauling the files around (as I usually do).

  • Acudia3DAcudia3D Posts: 35
    edited December 1969

    I for one would use such a product it will help in keeping your products updated like plugins as there updated.
    as far as using a different install path we all have different veiws of where to install to.i can add another library or merge existing
    with this product the way it looks. i for one use PzDB for my content search anyway much easier to find what im looking for.
    if it helps keeping my products updated im fine with it.

  • PendraiaPendraia Posts: 2,524
    edited December 1969

    Kerya said:
    Question: is it possible to use it just for downloading?
    And then installing (renaming folders and so on) myself?
    Will it find updated files in this case?


    Edited: default C:\ - are you kidding? My c:\ drive is an SSD ... and I am sure I am not the only person to have an SSD for C: and a "normal" harddrive as D:\ for content.

    From looking at the videos downloading and installing are on separate tabs so I'm thinking it should be possible but would also like confirmation that it is definitely possible. I also have an ssd drive and my content is on an external hard drive I would still like to know myself if it is possible to use an external hard drive in conjunction with it. There is no way I will install it on my c drive...but I'm interested if I can use it with an external drive.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 19,878
    edited December 1969

    Spooky has already confirmed that the default path can be changed.

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