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Weight map, one fits all is bad
Posted: 03 January 2013 10:54 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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Rayman29 - 03 January 2013 10:39 PM

Sorry, didn’t intend to cross.  But as I have said, do all original daz morphs use the same weight map?

Yes.

You’ve just been told that.

Not just Daz morphs, but all morphs. Just like every other Poser/Daz figure in existence, the weight map doesn’t change when you use a full body morph. It’s just not possible. That’s why we have JCMs.

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Posted: 03 January 2013 11:08 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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So I upload a weight mapped morph, some one installs it.  And they only have the default genesis weight map?  That seems messed up.

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Posted: 04 January 2013 12:18 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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Rayman29 - 03 January 2013 11:08 PM

So I upload a weight mapped morph, some one installs it.  And they only have the default genesis weight map?  That seems messed up.

You’ve got it all wrong. Let me explain it this way:

Genesis is a humanoid figure with a weight map that describes in general how humanoid figures bend. The new Daz Horse is an equine figure with a weight map to describe how equine figures bend in general..

Now let us say I create a very skinny young humanoid character for Genesis like the Teens 5. It is still Genesis and it is still a humanoid character so it will use the weight map assigned to humanoid figures. But because the proportions are drastically different than the original Genesis figure I now notice that in some places my skinny young teen do not bend as well as they should. I DO NOT CHANGE THE WEIGHT MAP! I can’t because the weight map describes how all humanoid figures should bend and if I change it I end up breaking every character based on Genesis.

What I can do and what is done is practice is make corrections to problem areas via a modelling tool like for example ZBrush. So lets say for example when the arms are raised it looks not quite right. The model is exported and the problem is fixed and a morph is created. But I can’t have the user fiddle with morphs every time he wants to raise the arms so I plugin my correction morph into the figure by creating a JCM (Joint Controller Morph). So now when you raise the arms the fix morph is applied automatically and the end user never even knows it was fixed.

If I wanted to create a Zebra fowl I would do exactly the same but this time the bending would be described by the new Daz Horse weight map as that is the one created for all equine figures based on said horse.

So to repeat again what everyone else was saying. Weight maps have nothing to do with character morphs. Zip. Nada. Zero. They are only there to describe how a newly created STAND ALONE BASE FIGURE would behave.

As for saving weight maps, just because it’s possible to do something does not make it a good idea. You’ll end up breaking more things than it’s worth.

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Posted: 04 January 2013 05:22 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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Well explained.

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Posted: 04 January 2013 08:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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Yes, all Genesis shapes use the Genesis weight maps as there’s no way to dynamically change them - unlike the joint centres, which can be changed. of course you can edit any weight map and save the result (ideally to a new figure, if you are customising the maps to give better results with an extreme morph) but as noted, you are likely to find that you then have to edit the weight maps on all clothing too - negating one of the benefits of Genesis, that one set of clothes will work on everything (to a degree, in the case of things like Anubis or the troll). Of course it would be nice if weight maps could be made to adjust in response to morphs, though I can see all sorts of difficulties in that for content creation.

Edit: oops, didn’t see there was a second page when I wrote my reply.

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Posted: 04 January 2013 08:32 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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what is a jcm?

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Posted: 04 January 2013 08:42 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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Novica - 04 January 2013 08:32 AM

what is a jcm?

Joint Controlled Morphs

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Posted: 04 January 2013 09:37 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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Leave it to Harry Dresden to step in and save the day.

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Posted: 04 January 2013 01:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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Harry Dresden - 04 January 2013 12:18 AM

Let me explain it this way:

Thank you muchly for that, BTW. You successfully explained several things that have eluded me for months.

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Posted: 07 January 2013 08:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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now we can not change weight-map about each character.

But I understand and feel simpathiy what he hope, because I hope weight-map preset about each character
or hope to customize and save it by user.rolleyes

It is future request,, but I think if we can ERC freeze weight-map
for character morph as same as property in future.

when wear clothing, I may need new weight-preset for the character too.
(simply change weight-map data)

but I think most of them can auto-transfer by picking up delta, genesis weight-map and
character weight-map to the clothing, as same as auto-generated morph.
(the basic principle seems same I think)

and I believe variable weight map must need to keep good shaping when pozing about many character.

there is limitation, even though making jcm about each rotation, but
when mixing rotation, it often work not perfect.
we need so many jcm to correct shape,, to adjust shape perfect,,
between 0 to 45, 45to 90 etc.

and I hope,, if only buldge map can change,, about each characte it seems big progress.
( I feel if we can change about buldge map pos value, and save it by ERC freeze,, for each character,,?)

 

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Posted: 07 January 2013 09:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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Like richard said above, you change the weightmap per character, you’ll most likely destroy the capability of clothing working between characters, not to mention the mixing capabilities of genesis. That’s why there’s only one weightmap, and you use JCMs for tweaking.

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Posted: 07 January 2013 09:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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of course,, Male-M3dia is right. but I understand what you said already.

I said future request ^^;

I know, when weight map of character change,, clothing weight map of character need changing too.
but I feel,  if changing weight-map destory mixing character capability ,
actually now genesis have not true mxing capability. 

it is same. make weight-map for genesis zero shape or, make weight-map for character shape.
afterward we need JCM to adjust weight map defomation for other character.

about product,, they make JCM for the genesis one weight-map,,  and make clothing, by transfer weight from genesis,
after that,, adjust weight-map which can fit for genesis zero shape,, then make JCM for each character.

so they can not fit when genesis weight-map change.  no one hope to re make every JCM and transfer again. I understand.

but it seems simple,, when hope to use the original genesis weight
use it. and when hope to use another weight for the character, apply it. do not you think so?

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